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Your Thoughts please....

Just had a families day out on one of Pussers Grey Liners and during an excellent day out they practised the "Man Overboard" Drill.They said that they could resue the man overboard within 4 minutes.
So they duly threw Fred the Dummy over the side,came around to port to launch the Sea Boat and also for the Swimmer of the Watch to go in and rescue poor Fred.

When Fred was about 20 yards off the Port side they ordered The Swimmer of the Watch to jump over the side from the Port waist and swim to Freds aid.

Now at this point The Swimmer of the Watch lost it and couldnt jump over the side to rescue Fred,so whilst everyone stood and watched this happening poor Fred was washed around the other side of the ship and it took a good 10 mins to get another swimmer dressed up and ready to go,but by this time they had decided to launch the Sea Boat and get poor Fred.(RIP Fred !!)

My point is this,the swimmer of the watch was a WREN, and at no point did anyone shout at her from the Bridge to get her arse in gear etc,and when I questioned this I was told by various Ships Coy,if it had been a bloke he would have been given serious grief from everyone,but because it was a female no one can bawl her out or reprimand her in anyway.
Im not Sexist in anyway but Im glad I wasnt that man overboard today !!
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
Maybe it was stage fright- blokes suffer from nerves too.

I saw many a senior rate a blubbering wreck during the Falklands conflict, well before criticising our female counterparts (no longer called Wrns) was even considered.
 
Probably doesn't look good for who ever organised that evolution, perhaps they should have checked that that person was ready to do the man-overboard drills for a public display?

Oh and Nutty's question below: How is Swimmer of the Watch organised?

Edited to add.
 
Questions I asked before but did not get any real answer being.

1. Who marks the spot where the man goes over or do they rely on GPS
2. Is this swimmer of the watch dressed and ready to go 24 hours or do they have to dress, how long does that take? How long to get into the water from cold i.e if it was not an exercise where the wink has been tipped?
3. Are they selected for their swimming abilities or is it just buggings turn? What if he/she can only just pass the swimming test?
4. The sea boat now seems to be a Rib style boat launched by crane? How do they manage that in rough weather? Does the ship have to come to a stop or do they still use a bow rope method where the way on the ship pushes the sea boat away from the ships side?
5. Who mans this sea boat if we have no watch on deck?

Being a sludge mariner so not having been near any of this type of thing since 1965 I am interested to know how it works now.

NUtty

Nicks, any reason why she would not enter the water or did she just bottle it?
 

Guns

War Hero
Moderator
And I have seen a young girl of 18 barge past two (frankly overweight and dithering) Stokers to be the first in with an SPE to tackle a fire that could have been cheeky.

As an officer I wouldn't have shouted at a male rating either. What would that achieve, they jump because they are pressurised and then panic in the water.

I would question the SR that put someone in that position. They should know who their jumpers are, who is confident and who isn't and have them do the job.

As for bawling her out etc. Being female does not mean you do not get a rocket when appropriate, as several females on my ship will tell you. However screaming and shouting at someone is not always the best way to get someone to do something.
 

Guns

War Hero
Moderator
Nutty said:
Questions I asked before but did not get any real answer being.

1. Who marks the spot where the man goes over or do they rely on GPS
MOB markerbuoys released, WECDIS (electronic Nav system) marked, MOB on GPS marked and not forgeting the Plot marking the plot and using WAIS as well
2. Is this swimmer of the watch dressed and ready to go 24 hours or do they have to dress, how long does that take? How long to get into the water from cold i.e if it was not an exercise where the wink has been tipped?
Not sure, we do not have a SOW on the LPD - Anyone?
3. Are they selected for their swimming abilities or is it just buggings turn? What if he/she can only just pass the swimming test?
I would hope a good Buffer knows his team and ensures the right person is getting dressed
4. The sea boat now seems to be a Rib style boat launched by crane? How do they manage that in rough weather? Does the ship have to come to a stop or do they still use a bow rope method where the way on the ship pushes the sea boat away from the ships side?
LPD - uses a Carley Davit capture system to lower, held on boat rope. Sea states and wind can be abated a bit by turing the ship to provided a lee
5. Who mans this sea boat if we have no watch on deck?
LPD - Duty Coxn and bowman - however on a MOB every SEA and WARFARE goes to the boat deck. The first PO/LH starts the lowering process. In essence if you are not on watch you get your arse to the boat deck

Being a sludge mariner so not having been near any of this type of thing since 1965 I am interested to know how it works now.

NUtty

Nicks, any reason why she would not enter the water or did she just bottle it?
 

ctfairway

Lantern Swinger
Nicks said:
Just had a families day out on one of Pussers Grey Liners and during an excellent day out they practised the "Man Overboard" Drill.They said that they could resue the man overboard within 4 minutes.
So they duly threw Fred the Dummy over the side,came around to port to launch the Sea Boat and also for the Swimmer of the Watch to go in and rescue poor Fred.

When Fred was about 20 yards off the Port side they ordered The Swimmer of the Watch to jump over the side from the Port waist and swim to Freds aid.

Now at this point The Swimmer of the Watch lost it and couldnt jump over the side to rescue Fred,so whilst everyone stood and watched this happening poor Fred was washed around the other side of the ship and it took a good 10 mins to get another swimmer dressed up and ready to go,but by this time they had decided to launch the Sea Boat and get poor Fred.(RIP Fred !!)

My point is this,the swimmer of the watch was a WREN, and at no point did anyone shout at her from the Bridge to get her arse in gear etc,and when I questioned this I was told by various Ships Coy,if it had been a bloke he would have been given serious grief from everyone,but because it was a female no one can bawl her out or reprimand her in anyway.
Im not Sexist in anyway but Im glad I wasnt that man overboard today !!

If you think that was bad you were lucky you were not onboard the ship that had a families day back in the 70s. They decided to demonstrate the MOB drill by getting a member of the Ship's Company to jump over the side. The idea was for the ship to the usual drill and come round and pick him up. Only trouble was that after they got back to where they thought he was, there was noone to be seen in the water. The guy had drowned. Anyone else remember this incident?? I think it was a DLG. Incidentally there have been other Families Day disasters like helicopters doing a fly past and hitting the ship (also a DLG) and helicopters trying to take off when they are still chained down on the flight deck.
 

clanky

War Hero
letthecatoutofthebag said:
Nutty said:
1. Who marks the spot where the man goes over or do they rely on GPS.

The Ops Room mark the plot in the command system, it is also recorded on the bridge in the Nav Data Book or in the WECDIS.

Nutty said:
2. Is this swimmer of the watch dressed and ready to go 24 hours or do they have to dress, how long does that take? How long to get into the water from cold i.e if it was not an exercise where the wink has been tipped?

The Swimmer of the Watch is not dressed 24/7 (you can't walk around in a dry bag all day). I can't remember the Fleet Standard time for the SoW, but they are generally ready to go before the OOW has the ship in the right place, i.e. less than 6 - 8 mins.

Nutty said:
3. Are they selected for their swimming abilities or is it just buggings turn? What if he/she can only just pass the swimming test?

Not entirely sure what the regulations are now, but in 2001 all SoWs had had to complete a "competency test" - i.e. jump off a diving board - and the SoW had to be a volunteer.

Nutty said:
4. The sea boat now seems to be a Rib style boat launched by crane? How do they manage that in rough weather? Does the ship have to come to a stop or do they still use a bow rope method where the way on the ship pushes the sea boat away from the ships side?

Still use a boat rope so ship is underway when the boat is launched. The OOW should manourvre the ship to provide a lee for the boat. The sea boat is good up to sea state 4 or 5 .

Nutty said:
5. Who mans this sea boat if we have no watch on deck?

The boat crew are nominated from the watch and station bill - the cox'n is normally "blue card" and does not keep any other watches or an duties within the SSEP.

I've not been in a FF/DD since PCP so some of my info might be a trifle out of date, particlarly with respect to the boats crews and the watch on deck.

SOW still has to be a volunteer under PCP. Since jumping over the side of a perfectly functional warship I not something I would choose to do, I would not criticise the young lady in that situation. :thanks:
 
clanky said:
SOW still has to be a volunteer under PCP. Since jumping over the side of a perfectly functional warship I not something I would choose to do, I would not criticise the young lady in that situation. :thanks:


Have you never had "Hands to bathe"?
 

IDOITDEEPER

War Hero
IMOHO the blame lies with the chain of command. If this young lady was not capable of carrying out the duty required of her, this fact should have been identified before the incident and alternative appropriate arrangements made.

Have a nice day
IDOITDEEPER
 

Daktari

Banned
ctfairway said:
If you think that was bad you were lucky you were not onboard the ship that had a families day back in the 70s. They decided to demonstrate the MOB drill by getting a member of the Ship's Company to jump over the side. The idea was for the ship to the usual drill and come round and pick him up. Only trouble was that after they got back to where they thought he was, there was noone to be seen in the water. The guy had drowned. Anyone else remember this incident?? I think it was a DLG. Incidentally there have been other Families Day disasters like helicopters doing a fly past and hitting the ship (also a DLG) and helicopters trying to take off when they are still chained down on the flight deck.

Yeup! Devonshire back in 75 (I think) Families Day and the Wessex 3 did a fast pass close down one side of the ship - rotor clipped something and next second had completely looped over the top of the ship and landed in the ogin! Who said the Lynx was the only parrafin parrot to fly upside down! .. Oh sorry did they mean safely! .. and yes the crew all got out!
 

Taloolah

Banned
Rod-gearing....You forgot to add bubble bath, the soothing sounds of Enya-and a nice exfoliating cream scrub. Oh, and a face pack.
 

trehorn2

Lantern Swinger
I've been on board where they've asked RNR for a volunteer for the SOW for the MOBEX while we've been training for the weekend.

Someone usually volunteers quite willingly.

Is it possible that a volunteer was requested earlier in the day and the young lady in question genuinley wanted to and thought she could do it only to lose her nerve when the moment came.

Unfortunate - yes, especially in front of the families however i would suggest that in the event of a real MOB emergency then the SOW would be a tried and tested rating as opposed to someone who just put their hand up cos they wanted to give it a bash.
 
trehorn2 said:
I've been on board where they've asked RNR for a volunteer for the SOW for the MOBEX while we've been training for the weekend.

Someone usually volunteers quite willingly.

Is it possible that a volunteer was requested earlier in the day and the young lady in question genuinley wanted to and thought she could do it only to lose her nerve when the moment came.

Unfortunate - yes, especially in front of the families however i would suggest that in the event of a real MOB emergency then the SOW would be a tried and tested rating as opposed to someone who just put their hand up cos they wanted to give it a bash.

Absolute pish!
 
trehorn2 said:
I've been on board where they've asked RNR for a volunteer for the SOW for the MOBEX while we've been training for the weekend.

Someone usually volunteers quite willingly.

Is it possible that a volunteer was requested earlier in the day and the young lady in question genuinley wanted to and thought she could do it only to lose her nerve when the moment came.

Unfortunate - yes, especially in front of the families however i would suggest that in the event of a real MOB emergency then the SOW would be a tried and tested rating as opposed to someone who just put their hand up cos they wanted to give it a bash.


No she was fully qualified for the job.
 
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