Why doesn't the RN buy some of these?

I suggest we do buy ------


The Germans usually make a very good product
very reliable and usually cost effective.


Vorsprung derch Technic :lol: :lol:
 
The trouble is going to be rataining the personnel, or even recruiting, to man them (if Brown ever allows the money to purchase extra hulls)and with all the garbage coming from the MoD civs about reduction of personnel for 'the modern .....' etc etc, how long will it be before we are a totally defenceless nation ?
 

grefs

Lantern Swinger
whitemouse said:
The trouble is going to be rataining the personnel, or even recruiting, to man them (if Brown ever allows the money to purchase extra hulls)and with all the garbage coming from the MoD civs about reduction of personnel for 'the modern .....' etc etc, how long will it be before we are a totally defenceless nation ?

Not long, by present cutbacks.
 

Skunkmiester

Lantern Swinger
You do realise that if you buy a German Submarine then other submarines won't let you out at T-junctions and you'll forget how to indicate.
 
Skunkmiester said:
You do realise that if you buy a German Submarine then other submarines won't let you out at T-junctions and you'll forget how to indicate.
Also the Sea Beds will be littered with Beach towels every morning!!
 
And the crew will have to sing the English Song in bad German accents... It's a long, long way to bein tipsy, it's a long wait for the beer... (to the Tipperery tune).
 
As I stated in another place dump the Bombers and buy 15 of these. Keep the SSN's for long range deep water ops. the SSK's for Gib home waters, we will try to avoid the Med. not a good pl;ace for boats of any type.

Nutty
 
exploding_blancmange said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
With that many we could have our first all wo-manned crew :wink:
That would make "The Crimson Tide" a reality :lol:
XE-Milkystuff

Unlike most on this forum I have no problem with birds in boats, be they single sex crews or mixed. In the case of a mixed crew they would suffer a lack of privacy and poor hygine if we go back to D/E's. My problem is with ladies on surface ships. Especially in the Damage Control context, however they perform in the controlled simulators at Collingwood?. The instructors are hardly going to let them fail and do their own cushy number no good or the confidence of the trainees. Experience during WW11 clearly showed that good DC practice saved many ships and upper body strength is without doubt required to prevent further flooding and shut doors/hatches or valves is a must. Save the ship, save lives.

On boats if any one compartment floods to any extent you sink, ladies can do all the other jobs.

Hence
Girls of Boats Yes
Girls on Targets No

Nutty
 
They certainly appear to be the BMW of boats. Most of this type of technology has been around since the 80's but Pusser only has yes for Nukes.

Love or loath BMW's you have to admit they are a class act.

Nutty
 
Nutty said:
exploding_blancmange said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
With that many we could have our first all wo-manned crew :wink:
That would make "The Crimson Tide" a reality :lol:
XE-Milkystuff

Unlike most on this forum I have no problem with birds in boats, be they single sex crews or mixed. In the case of a mixed crew they would suffer a lack of privacy and poor hygine if we go back to D/E's. My problem is with ladies on surface ships. Especially in the Damage Control context, however they perform in the controlled simulators at Collingwood?. The instructors are hardly going to let them fail and do their own cushy number no good or the confidence of the trainees. Experience during WW11 clearly showed that good DC practice saved many ships and upper body strength is without doubt required to prevent further flooding and shut doors/hatches or valves is a must. Save the ship, save lives.

On boats if any one compartment floods to any extent you sink, ladies can do all the other jobs.

Hence
Girls of Boats Yes
Girls on Targets No

Nutty
Yet some women can outperform some men in upper body strength, far better to have sensible standards which are measurable and let all who pass whatever their sex join. The reason this is usually not done is that not enough of either sex will pass and you then end up with a recruiting problem. I suspect that in reality you would be quite happy if all in the crew were 'person' enough to do the job required.

Peter
 

snorko

Lantern Swinger
Hate to say it guys, but the only reason we now only have nukes is that during the defence review at the start of the 90's FOSM was asked to come up with a saving. Either SSN's/SSBN's or SSK's. Realising that he didnt really want to get rid of any, as the SSBNs kept our place on the UN Security council and were a big stick hit threaten people with, the SSN's were bloody useful - see Belgrano - and the new SSKs were some of the best in the world he thought - and I have had this on fairly good authority - that if he offered up something that the Treasury would be stupid to take then he would be on to a winner. So he offered up the SSK's - and the treasury took them with open arms and they sat in a dock in Barrow for years unitl we flogged them to the Canadians - who then decided to sail them in a huge storm whilst not running shut down - as a result they flooded, had a fire, one man died and the press blamed us - CNUTS!!

we will quite likely get SSKs again in the future as they are loads cheapers than SSN's - but we will always need SSNs for their reach, capability, payload, endurance and a million other reasons.
 

FlagWagger

GCM
Book Reviewer
Nutty said:
Especially in the Damage Control context, however they perform in the controlled simulators at Collingwood?. The instructors are hardly going to let them fail and do their own cushy number no good or the confidence of the trainees.
The DRIU is still at Phoenix on Whale Island, t'other side of the water from Colingrad. While it may be a simulator, it still has large amounts of cold water and stress in abundance.

Rather than citing / accusing the DRIU instructors of allowing people through with relaxed standards, perhaps we should look at recent requirements for DC in the fleet and the potential impact that women at see may have had, for instance, was the Nottingham jeopardised by female members of her ship's company?
 
Maxi_77 said:
Nutty said:
exploding_blancmange said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
With that many we could have our first all wo-manned crew :wink:
That would make "The Crimson Tide" a reality :lol:
XE-Milkystuff

Unlike most on this forum I have no problem with birds in boats, be they single sex crews or mixed. In the case of a mixed crew they would suffer a lack of privacy and poor hygiene if we go back to D/E's. My problem is with ladies on surface ships. Especially in the Damage Control context, however they perform in the controlled simulators at Collingwood?. The instructors are hardly going to let them fail and do their own cushy number no good or the confidence of the trainees. Experience during WW11 clearly showed that good DC practice saved many ships and upper body strength is without doubt required to prevent further flooding and shut doors/hatches or valves is a must. Save the ship, save lives.

On boats if any one compartment floods to any extent you sink, ladies can do all the other jobs.

Hence
Girls of Boats Yes
Girls on Targets No

Nutty
Yet some women can outperform some men in upper body strength, far better to have sensible standards which are measurable and let all who pass whatever their sex join. The reason this is usually not done is that not enough of either sex will pass and you then end up with a recruiting problem. I suspect that in reality you would be quite happy if all in the crew were 'person' enough to do the job required.

Peter

Peter YES but neither of us really believe that to be the current situation nor will it ever be.

Flag-Wagger. Unfortunately right across the field of Education, Training, Apprenticeships, Entry Tests standards have been lowered to allow the required amount of people to reach the standard required. Having read many postings on this board I have no reason to doubt that this also applies to Pusser. To quote one incident i.e. HMS Nottingham and say that she was not jeopardized by any member of her female crew is rather immature and as I understand it a member of the bridge watch keeping staff was a female who failed to notice using the Captains words, "a 1 metre high wall of white water breaking over the reef up to 100 metres on my side of th ship as I walked to th bridge". Given to th Oz press in Sydney

Read up on WW11 DC operations, a daily event on both military and merchant ships and see how much long term effort and strength was used to save vessels. We will reap what we sew in DC terms if another full blooded surface war returns.

Nutty
 

FlagWagger

GCM
Book Reviewer
Nutty said:
Flag-Wagger. Unfortunately right across the field of Education, Training, Apprenticeships, Entry Tests standards have been lowered to allow the required amount of people to reach the standard required. Having read many postings on this board I have no reason to doubt that this also applies to Pusser.
Agreed - I've seen it with my own four eyes (it used to be two - the perils of ageing :( )

Nutty said:
To quote one incident i.e. HMS Nottingham and say that she was not jeopardized by any member of her female crew is rather immature ...
I didn't actually say that - I asked whether there was any evidence that having females on board had been jeopardised the Nottingham from the DC perspective.

Nutty said:
... and as I understand it a member of the bridge watch keeping staff was a female who failed to notice using the Captains words, "a 1 metre high wall of white water breaking over the reef up to 100 metres on my side of th ship as I walked to th bridge". Given to th Oz press in Sydney
So upper body strength wasn't the issue, nor was her performance in DC - the problem in this case was a lack of basic observation skills and/or CDF; while some may maintain that these are female traits, I'm not sure there's objective evidence to support this view. Coming back to the specific case of the Nottingham; none of the officers who faced court martial, i.e. CO, NO, OOW and OOW2 were female, and I'm sure that there would have been other people on the bridge as well as these 4 and the Jenny you single out- why didn't they see "the 1 metre high wall of water" - to single out a single female on the bridge as being at fault is, in your words, immature.

Nutty said:
Read up on WW11 DC operations, a daily event on both military and merchant ships and see how much long term effort and strength was used to save vessels. We will reap what we sew in DC terms if another full blooded surface war returns.
In all honesty, with shrinking crew sizes and increasing destructive powers of weapons, if we ever get into a full blooded shooting war, the amount of DC requried to save a ship would be beyond the powers of all but a crew comprised of Superman clones - take HMS Coventry & HMS Sheffield as examples of major damage - the Coventry went down in about 2-3 minutes and no amount of DC could have saved her; the Sheffield lost he Engine Room, Ops Room and Fire Main and proved, again, that DC was not sufficient. DC can save one of today's ships in a far narrower range of circumstances than in WW2.

Nutty[/quote]
 
Nutty,

Surely the solution to the DC problem is longer (OK, more expensive) basic training during which the lasses can develop their muscles. Obviously these days it would need to be practical tasks, like carrying cases of rum across Dartmoor or doubling round Raleigh delivering heavy crates full of beer can - but this would confer the same or similar upper body strength as most of the blokes.

Where's this extra money going to come from? Well you could begin by selling off all those grace and favour residences for people who earn enough to be able to afford their own property! You could also pay those Admirals in mothballs the same as ABs...

Steve.
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
MG Maniac Microsoft "Fix it" doesn't! Bloody Computers 20
Good CO We've been hacked, but it doesn't seem serious Site Issues 22
RomanyRanner Doesn't just rain it ******* pours! Diamond Lil's 25
M Photos... Service number doesn't match uniform! History 7
tiddlyoggy Stormy bast*rd bubbles doesn't know Jacko's dead Diamond Lil's 14
Pitfirrane Crime doesn't pay? Current Affairs 9
Father_Famine If this doesn't work I'm in the shi......................... Diamond Lil's 8
U what kind of bee doesn't fly? Joining Up - Royal Navy Recruiting 4
D Buy British regardless Diamond Lil's 37
Stirlin Help to buy. The Quarterdeck 2
MoD_RSS Information for Help to Buy: Equity Loan customers during Coronavirus (COVID-19) MoD News 0
MoD_RSS Payment Holidays offered to Help to Buy homeowners affected by Covid-19 MoD News 0
MoD_RSS Forex broker uses bank funds to buy foreign properties MoD News 2
C RFA and Forces Right To Buy RFA 3
slim Electric Cars Anyone Own One? Which is the best type to Buy? Current Affairs 21
MoD_RSS Homes England unlocks its Help to Buy: Equity Loan calculator so advisers can check an applicant’s likely approval MoD News 0
MoD_RSS Forces Help to Buy scheme extended for a further three years MoD News 0
MoD_RSS Help to Buy loophole closed to benefit homeowners MoD News 0
MoD_RSS News story: All employers in England to have better access to buy high quality apprenticeships MoD News 0
K Armed forces help to buy Finance & Pensions 2
J I want to buy a ratings beret & badge in London Miscellaneous 19
MoD_RSS News story: Almost half a million new keys exchanged with Help to Buy MoD News 0
MoD_RSS Press release: More than 400,000 first time buyers step onto the housing ladder with Help to Buy MoD News 0
S Forces help to buy. Finance & Pensions 4
M Forces help to buy Finance & Pensions 2
MoD_RSS News story: Forces Help to Buy loans £100m for new homes in first 2 years MoD News 0
P Help to Buy Finance & Pensions 14
O Want to buy a blazer Social & Reunions 5
MoD_RSS News story: Forces Help to Buy gets 5,000 service people on the property ladder MoD News 0
FunkyJunky LSAP/Help to buy Finance & Pensions 3
sweetpea Australia Moving Ahead With $20 Billion Japanese Sub Buy. International 9
MG Maniac Ho Ho Bleeding Ho! ... or what to buy for Chrimbo? Diamond Lil's 29
Topstop Saudis to buy Submarines? Submariners 7
MaiBelle Why oh why did I buy a white car? Motoring 43
soleil Guardian: "How Do I Buy-to-let While Serving In The Royal Navy? Finance & Pensions 15
trelawney126 Do you buy this Excuse Diamond Lil's 6
trelawney126 Good Buy for Naval Museum in Pompey The Gash Barge 0
R Where can i buy 1 of those burgen type kit bags from? Joining Up - Royal Navy Recruiting 23
soleil Pompey News: "MoD Urged To Buy Cheaper Navy Jets" Current Affairs 26
soleil Navy News: "Bids Sought To Buy Ark Royal" The Fleet 8
soleil Pompey News: "Navy To Buy New Aircraft" The Fleet Air Arm 10
Seaweed Psst! Wanna buy a dockyard? Current Affairs 11
P MOD to Buy 3 Boeing Rivet Joint Aircraft to replace NimrodR1 Current Affairs 1
scouse Thunder City to Close!!! Anyone want to buy 3 Buccaneers The Fleet Air Arm 15
soleil Navy Days 2010 Programme Available To Buy Online Bases / Shore Est 0
S Babcock buy out VT Group Current Affairs 5
Seaweed Wanna buy a battleship, one careful owner? Current Affairs 0
WreckerL Wanna buy an aircraft Diamond Lil's 3
NZ_Bootneck Psttt wanna buy a Hurricane mate..Only $4 Million NZ to you! Diamond Lil's 5
M What's your experience? - Do you rent, buy or use SFA? Finance & Pensions 0
Similar threads


















































Top