Why do i bother to do so much for the RNR???

Discussion in 'Royal Naval Reserve (RNR)' started by GSSR_Vvd, Apr 29, 2008.

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  1. :rambo:

    Well bounty month is suppopsed to be a nice month for reservists. Last year we were paid mid month and we DID have JPA, this year they say it'll be in our accounts on the 1st of May. Now I get an e-mail saying that after ROUTINE checks of pay statements there has been a problem with JPA and messages to the units that our bounty is unlikley to be paid into our accounts on the 1st of May. We have a civillian in our unit who is working hard to rectify this situation but will probably not be sorted untill the 1st of June!!!!!!

    In my personall opinion this is just one more example for reservists not to be included in the JPA system. How can it work one year but not the next? The unit are saying it is not their fault but JPA's, someone has to take the blame somewhere.

    I am now sat here wanderding why I give so much time throughout the year to help them out. Before I thought well at least i'll get paid for it, when that go's wrong I think well at least i'm getting my bounty. Now i'm thinking why????

    Yes it does feel good to be part of something that not everyone is involved with and there are benefits such as use of military facilities but I ask this question...........If the full timers were messed around like reservists, would anyone actually still stay in? Good benefits dont pay bills.

    RANT OVER!!!!
  2. Without wanting to restart the long running JPA threads again, I find that you will have far fewer headaches if you assume from the start that JPA simply will not pay what you are owed, when you should be paid.

    I literally cannot remember the last time JPA paid me properly (in fact, now I think about it, I don't think it ever has). The most recent fiasco was that realisation that shedloads of people had apparently been overpaid months and months earlier, and it was now all going to be reclaimed, although JPA was unable to catalogue what these overpayments are. I've more or less given up on HTD payments for drill nights.

    In summary:

    Never make plans that rely on being paid the right amount, on time. This include bounty - assume that you will not see it for several months, and also that it will be the wrong amount and you will have to fight to get that rectified.

    Keep every JPA payform you ever get - I honestly believe that in some cases they are the only record in existence of what you have been paid.

    Keep every bank statement showing that money reaching your account, or not.

    In essence, treat it like the mess of parts put together by the lowest bidder that it is, staffed by the under-qualified and poorly-paid (not to have a go at them; good technical staff with a solid understanding of the Armed Forces pay systems and the ability to deal flexibly with people deployed all over the world would cost a fortune, and I suspect the original JPA planners didn't realise this and put them down in the budget as entry-level call-centre staff). Not what people want to hear, but that's how it is; assume the worst, and on the occasions that you get paid, it will be a pleasant surprise. More importantly, you will suffer far fewer headaches and stress filled rants.

    There was a time when the RN prided itself on doing things better than civvy street - when it comes to JPA, those days are clearly long gone, and to be fair the RN didn't really have much of a chance on this one.

    This thread is bound to attract comments along the lines of how reservists should be proud to do it for free and that being paid is a bonus. I suggest we ignore those comments rather than feed the trolls.
  3. What...

    You expect to get paid as well..... :thumright:
  4. Uncle_albert,

    I agree with what you are saying completly. It is a shame though that we can not expect payment for our work done in our spare time. If i wanted to do it for free then i would have joined the sea cadets.......ahhhh now there is an idea :dwarf:
  5. So the reserves, presumably including the TA and the RAuxAF, should invest in their own HR management system? So where exactly is the cash for that going to come from? JPA is more thn just a payment mechanism, it's used by the N1, and their equivalents, to plan how the services are structured, what training is required for a role, how people are loaded on to training and to postings. I fail to see why there is any good reason to split the reserve forces away from that given our current employment.

    Many reasons; garbage in/ garbage out. The technology is only as good as the people who operate it. Largely depends what's gone wrong, if anything.

    Frequently, and worse. At least most reservists aren't reliant on the MOD paying them.
  6. It's more a case of if civilians were messed around like sailors, squaddies and crabs! If my civilian employer demonstrated this level of incompetence in paying me, I'd have taken the appropriate steps long ago. I feel for the regulars when it comes to JPA pay; they're hostages to the MOD codes of discipline, essentially unable to do anything about it.
  7. This is the first i've heard of this and if it is true (which i have no reason to doubt) then its a fecking joke.

    Not impressed.

    Not at all impressed.

    :threaten: :thumbdown: :crash: :frustrated: =( :confused: :crying: :eek:mfg: :pissedoff: :rage: :shakefist: :x :cry: :roll: :scratch: :cwm21: :cussing: :knob: :pain10:

    F*ck the lot of em!
  8. well there was an internal e-mail sent advising of the situation. I'm aware that bounty day hasn't passed and we'll only see once it does but we have been warned that we probably wont be getting it on the 1st of May.

    I agree with the above statement :rambo:
  9. wave_dodger

    wave_dodger War Hero Book Reviewer

    Sorry I agree with Karma, the RNR have banged on for years about wanting full integration now you've got it you want to revert to your own HR system?

    I don't think so for one there is no cash and as Karma has stated JPA is far more than a salary payment system, then there is the lack of alternatives? Want to go back to the RNR Database - I don't think so, I know for certain it was full of holes and mandraulically frigged to make sure people were paid, training was booked, details were indate - it was hideously manpower intensive and unreliable.

    JPA will get better - part of the problem will be IT (JPA itself) but the other part will be business processes and properly adopting the new ways of working (I know the MoD has not covered itself in glory here - training and implementation could have been better).
  10. Ok i agree understand that JPA has more functions than just pay but I am annoyed at how many problems seem to pop up when we are doing above and beyond the call of duty.
  11. I wouldn't be daft enough to rely on my RNR pay going in correctly and on time but i do rely on my expenses and bounty going in correctly and on time.

    If i've paid it out then i expect it back in time and correctly. People work all year to get their bounty, some do just enough to get it and many do enough to deserve two bounties.

    It grips my sh*t when people tell me not to rely on it. I've earned it, its in the contract. I spend all year telling prospective new entries how great it is when your bounty is paid in and you can book a nice holiday for the wife and kids to make up for the evenings, weekends and ORT you've been away on all year.

    And before anyone starts with the "poor reservists doing their weekends while real matelots are away for months" i would argue that its completely unacceptable that the regulars have problems with their pay and expenses. I dont rely on my RNR pay but i do allow for my bounty in my planning and to be f*cked about like this is a f*cking joke.

    The worst thing about it is that as per usual we hear about it through RR and not through official channels.

    P*ss poor, thats all i can say! :thumbdown:
  12. Totally agree- this is a total disgrace.

    I was relying on my bounty this month to pay off a credit card bill for some nice treats bought in anticipation of its arrival. Fair enough that I took the risk, but I'm now going to be several quid worse off due to someones incompetence. I'm lucky - there are a lot of people out there who rely on this - I know of people to whom the RNR isn't beer tokens, its an essential second job to keep their families financially stable - screwing people around like this can have real impacts - particularly on retention.

    I'm all for keeping the JPA system - we want equality so we get it warts and all. That means paying for food, that means getting screwed over like our regular counterparts. BUT we also expect leadership from our seniors - right now I'm guessing CMR has known about this for some time. Why doesn't he demonstrate some moral courage and firstly let us know whats going on, and secondly try apologising for this fiasco. It would win them a lot of goodwill at a time when the RNR is asking for more and more from us.

    Bottom line is and always has been that people will stay provided their bounty isn't messed with. To the waverers out there (and I after 10 years loyal service now consider myself to be one of those waverers) this could well be the straw that breaks the camels back.

    I now consider this to be a job - the RNR is showing me no loyalty nor goodwill - I don't want to be paraded through the streets with ticker tape, but I expect to be paid on time for work done. I shall henceforth treat the RNR with the same contempt that its utterly pathetic leadership showers on their employees.
  13. Also - if you are as angry as I am right now at the failure of our so-called 'leadership' to communicate, may I suggest you contact the reserves review team. They are looking at all aspects of the reserves and I think they'd be very interested in your views about just how poor the RNR really is.

    If CMR wants to treat us like mushrooms then I suggest we fight back.
  14. It is disgracefull i agree. since JPA has come in I seem to have become a little apprehensive when it comes to pay which i agree is wrong but you have to make do with what you have.

    Now before everyone from all over the country start ranting about camels backs breaking lets just wait untill Thursday to see if anyone gets thier bounty. The e-mail i had did come from an official channel but in it, it was stated that it PROBABLY wont be paid which is to say that there is a chance it WILL be paid. I'm not sure how much of a chance but nether the less it might.

    Lets just have our fingers crossed :thanks:
  15. Now i dont think fighting back will do anything, there is a situation here which we dont know will evolve into what we think it will. Like i said lets just wait and see what happens on Thursday. We dont want to be lining ourselves up for some head bashing now do we :threaten: Just wait and see and we might just be happy with the outcome :whew:

    Us getting angry whilst there are people (including LEADERS) working hard to resolve the situation on our behalf.
  16. Delete RNR Database. Insert JPA

    PAS did work!

    The initial planning and spec for JPA appears to have been very poorly carried out to allow for the essential differences between the regular forces and the reserves.
  17. Stand fast for the moment; I had a chat with someone today who had a look at the pay statements for a few people in his unit, and it did include bounty. Your mileage may differ.
  18. Well there is a lot of outrage at the moment from people who haven't had a letter about this. It strikes me that it's not out of the question the problem is restricted to Vivid, which means that it may be a Vivid problem, or it may be wider than that.

    I don't know which unit UA is in but it appears that at least four other units haven't had any notice of this!
  19. wave_dodger

    wave_dodger War Hero Book Reviewer

    Might I suggest rather than have a thread which spiral's out of control someone from the RNR takes the initiative (Materchief - is he not the Senior SNCO?) or an Officer; Call CMR ask them what the issue REALLY is - then call SPVA JPA Ops Room (email and phone on the web) and ask them, then post the authoratitive answer.

    Yes, CMR should be doing this and broadcasting it RNR wide but it seems they are either unaware or waiting to understand the scope of the full problem (very possible).

  20. Fully agree that they should do this - the problem is that over the years CMR has shown itself to be unable to act proactively. Instead it seems to adopt a "it'll be okay in the end" approach, and not bother to even give out a warning order that there MAY be a problem.
    Had they turned round a week ago and suddenly issued an all units email to say "wait one lads, possiblity of a problem" then people would have been hacked off, but accepted it. Once again though it appears that an RNR policy issue is being communicated through the medium of RR and not established channels. When will they realise how much this hurts their cause?

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