Tri-Service amalgamation

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by bumblebee, Aug 14, 2007.

Welcome to the Navy Net aka Rum Ration

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial RN website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Dartmouth, Cranwell and Sandhurst to become one?
    These are the buzzes I heard this week-end just gone at the Delhi Extravaganza at RMA Sandhurst. A consensus of opinion seemed to be that it seemed likely in the not too distant future.
    I've no idea if it's in the pipe-line but the Brownjobs seemed to think so. Any views?-
  2. there already moving sultan and making st athens a tri service base for engineering
  3. So?
  4. sgtpepperband

    sgtpepperband War Hero Moderator Book Reviewer

    BB: So? So what was the point of your post? Not such a great shame is it? To have occifers from different services training alongside each other....
  5. It may even be a good thing. training and living together each service would possibly appreciate what the others services do.
  6. Except none of the three sites is suitable for training Officers from other branches. The Navy needs Britannia for the Dart and the Sea, the Army needs Sandhurst for access to all those lovely training areas, and the Crabs need Cranwell for its Runway.

    So unless there is a site with access to the Sea for the Navy, Training Areas for the Army and a Runway for the RAF I can't see it happening. Couple that with the fact that can you see any heads of any of the services being willing to give up their Officer Training College over one of the others?
  7. By that I assume you agree Dartmouth Sandhurst and Cranwell should become one. It certainly would release an enormous amount of land on non-flood plains on which we could buid the vast number of houses John Prescott suggested we need.
  8. Cranwell's runway is surely only required for aircrew officers?
  9. And housing developers.
  10. And to enable Aircraft to get to the RAFC, I would hope that the RAF Officer Cadets get some live practice on the Aircraft that they will one day either be flying, maintaining, getting parts for etc. Do they not need some real practice with real aircraft, much like RN Officer Cadets do IST regardless of later specialisation, is there not Initial Air Training for the Crabs?
  11. The Officer corps of each of the three services does have very different cultures, because we do different things. Add a fourth culture, the RM, into the mix as well. That culture is inculcated in basic training, and then exhibited in our interactions.

    The cultures are further strengthened, and each branch, Regiment and specialisation adds it's own flavour as well.

    Clearly there would be operational efficiencies by consolidating all the Officer training on a single site, but I'd suggest that the dilution of culture resulting from that would be harmful in the short to medium term. In the longer term it would merely create a fifth culture, subsuming the existing four.

    Working in a joint environment benefits from having the four different perspectives. Staff training at JSCSC was also strengthened by taking place in that melting pot.
  12. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    Sorry but completely disagree:

    Initial Officer training does not require an exclusive exercise area, the sea in very close proximity or a runway outside your door when training respective potential managers.

    Later-on, RN & Army pilots need a runway as do their engineers in that trade, all-arms Army Officers & Intelligence Officers together with RAF pilots & Groundcrew Officers need amphibious training sooner or later & the Royals need training areas, in fact RM Commando Officers train alongside other rank Commandos. Likewise each service has a huge area of common ground which continues to be foolishly squabbled over.

    The sooner the 3 services drop their ridiculously insular attitude, we will then make progress in this area.
  13. Three services being based at the same establishment does not necessarily mean that the training of the different branches of the services need be identical.
    For starters parade training is completely different.
    Each has it's own branch of military history.
    I fail to see how trainee officers from different branches of the services living in the same accommodation should be detrimental.
    There would also be a massive saving on funding by having one establishment instead of four.
  14. I think it would be more Cost effective to do as the Royals do and train Ranks/Rates and Officers together, I would much rather be trained in Navigation at Sea, at Sea, and get the rules of the road right in the Picket Boats at Dartmouth, than in a lecture room at say Sandhurst. All lessons would need to be seperate, with Drill different, different lessons in Military History needed, when would they mix? If the arguement is for greater Tri-Service understanding between the ruperts, then have Acquaint weeks at each other's colleges, or similar.

    If it ain't broke, don't fix it, any single Officer Training College would have to built from new to meet the size needed, and to offer the selection of training facilities all arms need.
    And did the Canadian experiment work?
  15. They do some Air Experience Flying, but for most of them the real involvement with a/c comes when they do professional training in branch.
  16. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    Oh, marvellous, train the Navy's officers as far from the sea as possible, teach them lots of theory, bags of accountancy and 'management' skills, then or before give them three years at uni reading meeja studies, what's next? A union card?

    They need to be away in a boat every day from day ONE including how to get off the putty in Mill Creek when the tide does eventually come in. Oh, forgot, there's probably a canal or stream somewhere and if not they can sail radio controlled models and learn practical seamanship that way.

    The sailors are really going to enjoy being 'managed' by a highly-trained office-wallah. MoD won't understand this but one of the first requirements of LEADERSHIP is to know your job and the jobs of the men you are leading - up, down and backwards, so that they can trust your decisions in an emergency.

    When they do go to sea it'll be a choice of PVR or the divorce courts for most.

    Time was, we had an entry that spent, in their first two and a half years from the age of 18, apart from time on leave, TEN WEEKS ashore and the rest in a wide variety of SHIPS. Which is what the right sort of young people join for - to go to SEA.
  17. Sandhurst stands in enormous grounds, it wouldn't be too expensive to expand it to take all three services.
    As for training officers and other ranks together i think you will discover that officers are against this. They do not wish junior ranks (rates) to witness the cock ups made by officers during their training.
    For any sea training Sandhurst is only about 50 miles from Portsmouth.
    For the RAF Blackbush airport is about 5 miles away. Or RAF Odiham about 20 miles.
  18. Might I suggest HMS Daedalus at Lee on Solent. Inhabited by grumpy old Fleet Chiefs and Admirals. Couple of miles of long black stuff for the RAF to bounce along, right next to the sea for us, Browndown Beach for the Army to run about on and close to rail links for Smoke to go to the Opera. Hurrah!!
    But they sold it to make room for asylum seekers didn't they.
    Theres my tuppence worth.
  19. Somewhere like Portland would work, although a decent sized parade ground might be a challenge. It would need improved infrastructure to allow transport to the training areas on the plain.

    There isn't really a huge need for fixed wing capabilities on site.

    One of the challenges would be the complete dislocation for tradition and ethos, coming from an iconoclast like me that's quite a statement! Students would come up with an additional, unique and rather homogenous ethos.

    One of the additional issues would be the training of Marines on the same site, since I don't believe the Corps would wish to give up the value that comes from that shared experience.
  20. Excellent choice, especially as the residents managed to get the asylum seekers accommodation turned down.

Share This Page