training

[buster]

don't know if this has been threaded before, feel free to give me verbals if so.
the amount of training courses available to GSSR seem to have been decimated, e.g. boats courses- armourers-ssem
some (or all) are mandatory for advancement. any thoughts.

 

[FlagWagger]

don't know if this has been threaded before, feel free to give me verbals if so.
the amount of training courses available to GSSR seem to have been decimated, e.g. boats courses- armourers-ssem
some (or all) are mandatory for advancement. any thoughts.

BR60 out of step with reality (again!)

 

[dunkers]

I was put off GSSR by the colossal number of training courses required before you made AB1... something like 6 weeks' worth of courses?

 

[Prochnow]

Have recently risen to the dizzy heights of AB1 GSSR the only ORT 5 day courses needed was 518 and 547 (throw in about 5 weekends as well). Safe deckhand/sailor (can’t remember which) previously needed advancement has been binned. Great, however having just come off a week on a 22 I found myself sadly lacking in basic seamanship skills (ajax barge is useful to jog the memory of someone whose been there, seen it done it, but it’s never gonna replace a weeks course). Added to this you’ve gotta be in date for BSSC which is I suppose another week every 3 years.

I know our roll is SPO but we’re operational by the time we get to AB1. So with the lack of any laid down format for AB1 to LH (other than LRCC) wouldn’t be an idea to create a task book that includes some seamanship? Or better still, having read on another post about GSSR being deployed on to the Enterprise and told they’re not able to do the job their supposed to do because of not being qualified on MK44/GPMG, why not include a course on command weapons. Instead of looking the square root of [email protected] useless by being call GSSR who don’t do seamanship or SPO teams who aren’t qualified to be of any use on RN ships. Can someone tell me if there are any other SPO courses open to ABs?
Rant over

Ps heard the rumours of the branch rename to “Force Protectionâ€? Wouldn’t it be better if we got to do loads of small arms courses including stuff with hand grenades? Then they could prefixed the new branch name with “Ultimate†and be know as â€special oppsâ€. :idea:

 

[phil1972]

Am a lowly AB2 done my 518 and 547, what are the 5 weekends you mentioned to get AB1. Have similarly been unsuccessful getting an up to date task book.

I think it is a real shame that we can't do the seamanship side any more and that was a major attraction when I first signed up.

 

[Prochnow]

Am a lowly AB2 done my 518 and 547, what are the 5 weekends you mentioned to get AB1. Have similarly been unsuccessful getting an up to date task book.

I think it is a real shame that we can't do the seamanship side any more and that was a major attraction when I first signed up.

Merwex alpha
Ajax Barge
GSSR General
NBCD
Accreditation

Though the list has probably changed by now

 

[trehorn]

Am a lowly AB2 done my 518 and 547, what are the 5 weekends you mentioned to get AB1. Have similarly been unsuccessful getting an up to date task book.

I think it is a real shame that we can't do the seamanship side any more and that was a major attraction when I first signed up.

Merwex alpha
Ajax Barge
GSSR General
NBCD
Accreditation

Though the list has probably changed by now

You are also required to do an MCMV weekend in either pompy or Faslane.
These, i think, are the best weekends to do for seamanship training. Alas not many units attend them so they are (as i previously reported on here) in danger of being binned.

The next ones are in November and early February.

 

[trehorn]

don't know if this has been threaded before, feel free to give me verbals if so.
the amount of training courses available to GSSR seem to have been decimated, e.g. boats courses- armourers-ssem
some (or all) are mandatory for advancement. any thoughts.

Unfortunately mate its one of them things that for some reason never seems to have been addressed.

As others have mentioned, please stick with it. The RNR needs experienced hands like never before. Once you get through all the bullshit at the beginging it really is worth it.

 

[trehorn]

Unfortunately mate its one of them things that for some reason never seems to have been addressed.

As others have mentioned, please stick with it. The RNR needs experienced hands like never before. Once you get through all the bullshit at the beginging it really is worth it.[/quote]

Sorry, wrong thread. DOH!!

Its been one of those days.

 

[sgtpepperband]

I sympathise with the sentiment of this thread, and as an ex-Dabber, very shocked and surprised that seamanship - despite being a nautical tradition for the Regular and Reserve Fleet, whatever your branch - is not taught as a basic skill.

How easy is it to be seconded to a sea-going ship to get some 'hands on' training in seamanship? I know plenty of Parts of Ship on board who could do with enthusiastic ratings, eager to learn this dying skill.

It worries me in the Service now that young ratings do not know the basic rudimentary seamanship skills, using the old excuses ("I wasn't taught that at Raleigh" or "It's not in my Task Book!"). I wasn't taught many things about being a Seaman yet I learnt so much from my experienced Sea Dads; skills which, even though I no longer work as a Dabber on a Part of Ship, still come in useful today.

 

[FlagWagger]

How easy is it to be seconded to a sea-going ship to get some 'hands on' training in seamanship? I know plenty of Parts of Ship on board who could do with enthusiastic ratings, eager to learn this dying skill.

Realistically? Not easy. The main problem I've encountered is if the training is not in the RNR Career Matrix then its difficult to get the unit hierarchy to approve the hit to the travel budget (especially if the training involves any travel outside the UK!). If a ship would be willing to fund the training and travel from their own UIN then you may get authorisation from the unit, but as we all know, budgets are tight and not many ships are able to fund these short-term additional personnel and associated travel (although I am aware that it can be done, having assisted HMS Ledbury during her refit in Rosyth while OP Fresco was underway).

However, getting funding is only the first hurdle that must be negotiated - there is increasing pressure being applied by the bureaucrats to ensure that people only undertake training in accordance with their speciaisation Career Matrix, which as anyone outside the bureaucracy well knows, is usually out of date, inappropriate, and/or incomplete! Sadly, we've lost sight of the way in which the fundamentals of being a sailor, of any specialisation, are learnt

It worries me in the Service now that young ratings do not know the basic rudimentary seamanship skills, using the old excuses ("I wasn't taught that at Raleigh" or "It's not in my Task Book!"). I wasn't taught many things about being a Seaman yet I learnt so much from my experienced Sea Dads; skills which, even though I no longer work as a Dabber on a Part of Ship, still come in useful today.

Agreed 100%

 

[sgtpepperband]

Does the RNR have the same Divisional system to voice concerns, or would it have to resort to more dramatic measure and talk with their feet? Questions will be asked surely when the Reserve Froces are no longer availble to supplement the Regular Forces - or maybe that's what the Government wants...

 

[WarMonger]

Seamanship is still a core skill if our masters are to be believed, however the priority at the moment is to get as many people up to speed with FP as that is what Fleet have deemed as their priority..once we have got through the mad rush and the FP training has stabilised I can see the Seamanship re-emerging more prominantly in the training plans...!!

That is what I think will happen...!!

My personal opinion is that anyone that goes to sea no matter what your role that if they are not competent with basic rudimentary seamanship skills is of a limited value to that asset and probably more to the point dangerous!

Everybody onboard doubles up some sort of role if not more thats what makes the TEAM WORKS!!

 

[trehorn]

Does the RNR have the same Divisional system to voice concerns, or would it have to resort to more dramatic measure and talk with their feet? Questions will be asked surely when the Reserve Froces are no longer availble to supplement the Regular Forces - or maybe that's what the Government wants...

For f*cks sake dont go streight to the top.

I did. In the end my comments seem to have made a difference (either that or they were already working on the issues i raised)and those at the top said they appreciated the honesty. It was the people in the middle who weren't particularly pleased.

You see its the people in the middle who stop those at the top finding out exactly what the problems/issues are. So when a little shitty AB tells those at the top that everything is not all rosey they want to know why the people in the middle didnt bring it to their attention.

 

[sgtpepperband]

Sounds like not much is different in the RNR then... 8O

 

[FlagWagger]

Does the RNR have the same Divisional system to voice concerns, or would it have to resort to more dramatic measure and talk with their feet? Questions will be asked surely when the Reserve Froces are no longer availble to supplement the Regular Forces - or maybe that's what the Government wants...

Yes we do have a Divisional System, but as others have said, the problem lies within the middle tiers of management of the RNR (NB these people may equally be RN and not RNR before people leap to conclusions about part-time professionalism!). The Divisional System allows concerns to be voiced within a unit up to the CO - after that, the reporting path is vague, but will undoubtedly involve desk officers at COMMARES before ultimately reaching the Commodore.

The organisation at COMMARES are also responsible the RNR's direction, specialisation structure and career training matrices too.... need I say more?

 

[fleetchief]

I was put off GSSR by the colossal number of training courses required before you made AB1... something like 6 weeks' worth of courses?

a whole six weeks ! golly. pity those guys/gals in the RN who may take 2 years, to aquire the same rate/skill level. :wink:

 

[dubaipusser]

Fleetchief, I presume you are aware that the point dunkers was trying to make was that he has to undertake 6 weeks of formal courses which, given the RNR schedule of 2 weeks Operational Role Training per year means a 3 year pipeline to get to AB1 in addition to evening and weekend training.

Just a clarification in case there was any misunderstanding

 

[fleetchief]

i was aware of that dp. how would you propose reducing that time scale, to make it more attractive ? maintaining the same skills of course.

 

[rogerthecabinboy]

take your tongue out of your cheek please fc, you will get a sore bit.
i think i get you tho. to fast the rise, insufficient gravitas of bod ?
i do not think 3 years is to long to get to AB1. bout right i reckon.