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Training Management Officer (TMO)

wave_dodger

MIA
Book Reviewer
Does this thread go to prove the age old saying, those that can’t teach?

Other than some potential for shitty jobs officer, a fairly cushy number

Bit harsh, I tongue in cheek rib schoolies as for the better part of 5 years I was one.

Would you rather have a scarce WE, AEW or ME taken to a first or second phase training establishment for three years. Despite arguments over harmony jobs it wouldn't be career enhancing or a development opportunity in reality. And let's not go into appointing Warfare to teach. Whilst I've no doubt they could it would utterly bugger up their career profiles.

So your left with contracting out and using people with little or no Naval ethos and no interest except money. Then what do you do for ships, commando units, deployed locations and all of the secondary and tertiary jobs that make those units work.

Again looking shoreside you can only civilianise so far.

Despite many shortcomings, hey they accepted me!, I still think there is a need for TMO. The question really has to be for what and how many.
 

Sumo

War Hero
WD if a bit harsh, then more like life long Uni lectures who spend all their live in academia and never join the real world of work outside academia?
 

Trainer

War Hero
Book Reviewer
WD if a bit harsh, then more like life long Uni lectures who spend all their live in academia and never join the real world of work outside academia?

You make it sound like it's a bad thing?.......
 

Sumo

War Hero
You make it sound like it's a bad thing?.......

Not a bad thing, not everyone can teach, in the same way as not everyone is cut out to be an engineer?

Used to work with a guy at BAE who was a Dr of Engineering, he was bored so was studying for a second PhD? When BAE linked up with Leister University to form a Systems Engineering School of excellence, I suggested he should apply to be a lecturer; he was a highly intelligent man, who should stay in academia and not be allowed out into the real world, he could not fully grasp how to work with people?
 

wave_dodger

MIA
Book Reviewer
WD if a bit harsh, then more like life long Uni lectures who spend all their live in academia and never join the real world of work outside academia?

Except you'll find schoolies back aft and in the control room of SSN and SSBNs, acting as IntO in Cdo Units and the MTSO at Poole (deploying), working in Combat Camera Teams with Royal, taking up Common Appointment Op Tours in Sierra leone, Afghanistan, Iraq, Africa etc.

Before STCW you'd find a few, me included who had Bridge Tickets, Nav tickets and Ops Room tickets, an extra body always comes in handy, especially in DW.

It's not what people perceive
 

Trainer

War Hero
Book Reviewer
Lol, oh dear, every time we have some young shaver come on and ask for careers advice, it always ends up with this wall pissing....:rolleyes:

I'm dying to know where my extra 'e' was btw...;)

@wave_dodger could also add the TLM targeting cell, and some very crunchy stuff in the Horn of Africa and Northern Ireland that associates of mine have done in recent years...
 

Sumo

War Hero
Except you'll find schoolies back aft and in the control room of SSN and SSBNs, acting as IntO in Cdo Units and the MTSO at Poole (deploying), working in Combat Camera Teams with Royal, taking up Common Appointment Op Tours in Sierra leone, Afghanistan, Iraq, Africa etc.

Before STCW you'd find a few, me included who had Bridge Tickets, Nav tickets and Ops Room tickets, an extra body always comes in handy, especially in DW.

It's not what people perceive
Cor that must have been a shock to the system. Schoolie I have a little job for you, bit of the beaten track for the average teacher but we are sure you will be fine, plus where we are sending you could do with a hand, have a nice trip see you when you get back?:D:p
 

sea_vixen

Midshipman
@Trainer happy to help . . . . . .

I was handed a sheet and told to come back once my time to reapply had elapsed, but consider the role as a TMO (assuming this was because they are heavily unsubscribed, I believe?

This was true for a long time but isn't anymore. The specialisation is a small one and in the past was made up of lots of branch transfers. Now most people that join are DE officers and are well qualified and keen to join the RN as Training Managers.

I've trawled through the forums on here, but I still have a couple of questions looming over my head - mostly, what does a TMO actually train? Do you choose a specialisation to train? Or is this given to you? I understand this may start as basic maths/English, but.. What's the process? How does one go on to train the Commando's or Engineers of the Royal Navy?

Training Managers are generally not instructors. Instead they Manage Training and the Navy does a lot of training. There are 4 subspecilisations or 'pillars' and one of those is Human Capability Development (HCD) which does include a bit of instructing but not much. There are a couple of instructor jobs at SULTAN and some people teach Defence Train the Trainer or coaching courses but instructing is no longer the main effort. Maths and English is taught by contractors.

Any TM can work with RM either at CTC or or somewhere else. There is opportunity to get your green lid if you want to.

Any TM can also get their dolphins if that is the route you want to go down. You can join as a TM, complete phase 2 and then go into the Warfare pipeline to get your dolphins or you can do the minimum just to collect the badge.

In terms of going to sea the new air craft carriers will have two TM onboard. The other option is NETS(ops). This is navy education and training support (operational). These people fly out to the ships and offer support as required.

The other 'pillars' are connected to Training Capability Management, contracts and assurance. This is all about managing risk, Defence Systems of Training, continuous improvement, quality assurance, training design, evaluation etc. It is making sure that all training done by the RN is efficient and effective.

Also, what's the general perception of TMO's in the RN (ie. Are they appreciated?) Is this role best come in to direct? Or after serving with a branch for a while to earn some respect from those you are training?

Depends on who you talk to. TM are appreciated by higher command, by HQ staff etc. The job is not understood by much of the RN and people are rude about what they don't understand. As everyone now passes out of BRNC as a midshipman it is not uncommon to see a TM SLt offering advise to the CO 'with respect Sir, you can't do that . . .' And being listened to because they actually understand 'all that schoolie bolocks'. NETS staff are popular because they can sign off learning credits! Historically the TM branch included a lot of Warfare officers who had had enough of being Warfare officers.

This post gives up to date info on the four pillars:

https://www.navy-net.co.uk/communit...ining-management-officer.166692/#post-1371767

Any other questions just shout
 
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Not a bad thing, not everyone can teach, in the same way as not everyone is cut out to be an engineer?

Used to work with a guy at BAE who was a Dr of Engineering, he was bored so was studying for a second PhD? When BAE linked up with Leister University to form a Systems Engineering School of excellence, I suggested he should apply to be a lecturer; he was a highly intelligent man, who should stay in academia and not be allowed out into the real world, he could not fully grasp how to work with people?

We have a Dr of engineering here who doesn't have any social skills at all, he couldn't see the issue when he pressed print on a particular MOD aircraft work recording system and downloaded all the data, 12 reams of paper later, two toners and 12 hours out of action for the printer. No we couldn't cancel the print run :(
 

Sumo

War Hero
We have a Dr of engineering here who doesn't have any social skills at all, he couldn't see the issue when he pressed print on a particular MOD aircraft work recording system and downloaded all the data, 12 reams of paper later, two toners and 12 hours out of action for the printer. No we couldn't cancel the print run :(

Yep that’s about right, say and does what they think but do not think about what they do or say.

Not meant for the real world, stick them in academia or give them minders if you want the use of their brain.


Had one down a boat once he arrives in the control room with no bags or test equipment, where's your stuff I ask he says on the jetty he says, best you go and get it before someone nicks it or it is blown up as a suspect package. After running ragged for a week he did not come back, a useful engineer did. He told us the Prof was used to being waited on back in the office and we gave him a bit of a shock.
 

Trainer

War Hero
Book Reviewer
@sea_vixen Have we met? LOL:)

'This was true for a long time but isn't anymore. The specialisation is a small one and in the past was made up of lots of branch transfers. Now most people that join are DE officers and are well qualified and keen to join the RN as Training Managers'.

And not chopped Aircrew and Fleet Navigators who've had nervous breakdowns...

Always a bad sign when you hear me use the words
'With all due respect... :'

I'm not/We're not/You can't...

Do that....:D

Schoolies are there to make sure that lazy Dabbers so their jobs properly...
 
@sea_vixen Have we met? LOL:)

'This was true for a long time but isn't anymore. The specialisation is a small one and in the past was made up of lots of branch transfers. Now most people that join are DE officers and are well qualified and keen to join the RN as Training Managers'.

And not chopped Aircrew and Fleet Navigators who've had nervous breakdowns...

Always a bad sign when you hear me use the words
'With all due respect... :'

I'm not/We're not/You can't...

Do that....:D

Schoolies are there to make sure that lazy Dabbers so their jobs properly...

Like checking their spelling...
 
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