The loss of HMS Sheffield

Hawkeye

Lantern Swinger
alhucoll said:
Just going on my experience as en ex-Killick stoker who only served on 23's -
Costly errors occured - but the fleet learned from it i.e. the 23's.
Good men died from a lack of knowledge/foresight/common sense - rules/operational procedure. OP's are written and instigated by people removed from the situation possibly ten or more years prior to an incident.

I now work in the Oil Industry and have last been on the Tartan Platform that STILL fed the Piper Alpha Platform as it was going up in a plume of smoke and melting - spoke with guys who were there at the time, guess what?
They were following procedure!

SNAFU - we learn from it, do you think that any of the people involved in the loss of life on the Sheffied or the Piper sleep well at night?

To continue to look for scapegoats, to me brings the honourable deaths of our colleagues into a lower place - they died doing what they wore the uniform for.

To me, it's disrespectful to say they died due to a f ck up. They followed orders as any good Matelot would.

Many will disagree with my comments; would you rather remember the men as casualties of war or as a casualty of a procedure that went wrong?

As I've statred before:
"Do you think that any of the people involved in the loss of life on the Sheffied sleep well at night?"

I did serve with several members of Sheffields surviving ships company and have a good idea of what I am talking about: the guys I met would not look for a scapegoat, they would look for the truth and leave it at that.

I totally agree with your post.
I was involved with NBCD Trials and Evaluation as a Chief Stoker post Falklands and a lot of the lessons learnt during that time reflect the changes that the fleet have today in procedure, equipment and training. Before that most was based on WW2 experiences and I do believe Exocet missiles were not used during WW2. The continual shout's regarding cover up do not IMHO do anything positive Let's just hope the lessons learnt will not be put to the test for another 50+ years.
 
Fletch said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
Fletch said:
All,

Please see the latest entry (Number 1140) by George Laybourne

http://mylostoppos.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4830&page=114

Thanks for this information Fletch. I have passed the information on to the House of Commons Library.

You down the road from me at the Gas Works then matey ? I'm up the road at 50 Broadway will probably visit Committee Room 5 sometime tomorrow !!

Fletch,

We might meet... I'll be in Committee Room 3a from 1600. When will you be around?

Incidentally I also forwarded the link to Mr. Hancock.

Steve.
 

rictic

Badgeman
slim said:
Its my belief that the Sheffiels, Coventry & other ships were lost for one reason. The lack of a conventional aircraft like the old Ark Royal.
This would have provided gannets at high level transmitting radar information back to the ship(s). Phantom aricraft to intercept & destroy enemy aircraft & Buccaneer low level bombers capable of tossing a bomb with accuracy a distance of up to four miles without tne need to overfly the target. However the Conservative government had seen fit to dispose of the Ark in 1978.
I still maintain that a conventional carrier combined with submarines would have prevented the loss of our ships save for the one that was hit by a truck mountd exocet.

I agree wholeheatedly that carrier borne air cover and AEW would have likely saved many lives, they would have been able to pretty much detect incoming as they left Argentina and been waiting for them. We cannot blame the Tories for the loss of the Ark etc..in 1978 as Labour were in power at that time up until 1979, it was also Labour that mothballed the replacement carrier project.
To be honest, in many ways the Ark was on her last legs at that time but they should have kept her until the so called through deck cruisers arrived or arranged for AEW to operate off of Hermes.
There were a lot of lessons that weren't learnt prior to the Falklands, everyone knew about the wiring on type 21s being PTFE and would give off toxic fumes during a fire and that the Aluminium ladders would melt in a fire trapping men below decks. There was wholesale disregard for the fact that these were warships and were expected to have major fires/damage from enemy action. Nothing absolutely nothing was done regarding issues such as those.
 

Fletch

Badgeman
Always_a_Civvy said:
Fletch said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
Fletch said:
All,

Please see the latest entry (Number 1140) by George Laybourne

http://mylostoppos.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4830&page=114

Thanks for this information Fletch. I have passed the information on to the House of Commons Library.

You down the road from me at the Gas Works then matey ? I'm up the road at 50 Broadway will probably visit Committee Room 5 sometime tomorrow !!

Fletch,

We might meet... I'll be in Committee Room 3a from 1600. When will you be around?

Incidentally I also forwarded the link to Mr. Hancock.

Steve.

Looks like I MAY be down to Cte. Rm. 5 tomorrow now as they have finished business for today in under 40 mins !!! Will probably get down there at around 10.00 Hrs. They normally put coffee and tea on for around 11.40 ish. so look out for a chap with glasses, chort hair and, probably, my Lostoppos Fleece with a White Ensign on it !!!

Andy
 
I've just read your message. I'm going to miss seeing you Andy as I work adjacent to Portcullis House. The Palace is a 10 minute walk away. I'll be there this afternoon for a meeting.

Some other time perhaps?

Steve.
 

Fletch

Badgeman
Always_a_Civvy said:
I've just read your message. I'm going to miss seeing you Andy as I work adjacent to Portcullis House. The Palace is a 10 minute walk away. I'll be there this afternoon for a meeting.

Some other time perhaps?

Steve.

Yeah !!! Maybe a pint in The St. Stephen's Tavern Wednesday next week !!! ?
 
Fletch said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
I've just read your message. I'm going to miss seeing you Andy as I work adjacent to Portcullis House. The Palace is a 10 minute walk away. I'll be there this afternoon for a meeting.

Some other time perhaps?

Steve.

Yeah !!! Maybe a pint in The St. Stephen's Tavern Wednesday next week !!! ?

That would be OK. What sort of time do you have in mind?

Also if any other Rum Rationers are around they could perhaps come along?
 

Fletch

Badgeman
Always_a_Civvy said:
Fletch said:
Always_a_Civvy said:
I've just read your message. I'm going to miss seeing you Andy as I work adjacent to Portcullis House. The Palace is a 10 minute walk away. I'll be there this afternoon for a meeting.

Some other time perhaps?

Steve.

Yeah !!! Maybe a pint in The St. Stephen's Tavern Wednesday next week !!! ?

That would be OK. What sort of time do you have in mind?

Also if any other Rum Rationers are around they could perhaps come along?

Any time after 17.00 Hrs. Steve !! Any other's welcome, YES !!!
 

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