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Telegraph: "Honours Bias 'Favours Officers Over Soldiers'"

soleil

War Hero
lawrence-skuse_2788187b.jpg

"They are intended to symbolise the Monarch’s and her nation’s gratitude towards members of the armed forces for their exceptional loyalty and devotion to duty.

But an inspection of the Queen’s New Year and Birthday Honours list has revealed that the honours are awarded far more frequently to officers than to ordinary soldiers.

...

In the most recent New Years Honours list there were 52 awards issued to members of the Army and Army reserve, but of these 48 went to officers and warrant, or non-commissioned, officers, with only one awarded to a staff sergeant, one to a colour sergeant, one to a sergeant and one to a rifleman.

There was a similar ratio in the Royal Navy, where 21 awards were made to officers and Warrant Officers and only three to more junior ranks."

Honours bias 'favours officers over soldiers' - Telegraph




 

FunkyJunky

War Hero
I had one CO (a few years ago)
who was quite open in that we (the ships company) were only really there to get him "his OBE"

nice, eh. Its almost up there with the "if you dont like it, put your notice in"
 

Guzzler

War Hero
View attachment 8561

"They are intended to symbolise the Monarch’s and her nation’s gratitude towards members of the armed forces for their exceptional loyalty and devotion to duty.

But an inspection of the Queen’s New Year and Birthday Honours list has revealed that the honours are awarded far more frequently to officers than to ordinary soldiers.

...

In the most recent New Years Honours list there were 52 awards issued to members of the Army and Army reserve, but of these 48 went to officers and warrant, or non-commissioned, officers, with only one awarded to a staff sergeant, one to a colour sergeant, one to a sergeant and one to a rifleman.

There was a similar ratio in the Royal Navy, where 21 awards were made to officers and Warrant Officers and only three to more junior ranks."

Honours bias 'favours officers over soldiers' - Telegraph





Rubbish reporting again. Three of the 'remaining four' are NCOs so only the rifleman is the odd one out.
 
I remember the CO of 800 squadron (spit) briefing the chaps ref his MBE, his line was "this is not just for me but the whole Squadron". Out shouts a rather brash northern PO "I'm off to a wedding in August can I sign it out?".


Posted from the Navy Net mobile app (Android / iOS)
 
I'm not defending the system but the prevalence of more senior military 'movers & shakers' granted honours (as opposed to decorations or medals) in the New Year Honours and Queen's Birthday Honours only mirrors that of more senior civil servants, diplomats, captains of industry and other 'movers & shakers' in local government, charities, sports, the arts, etc.
Wikipedia said:
The British honours system is a means of rewarding individuals' personal bravery, achievement, or service to the United Kingdom and the British Overseas Territories. The system consists of three types of award: honours, decorations and medals:

Honours are used to recognise merit in terms of achievement and service.
Decorations tend to be used to recognise specific deeds.
Medals are used to recognise bravery, long and/or valuable service and/or good conduct.

Naval Gazer (CDF & Bar)
 
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Plus its the officers who write themselves or their oppo's up for the awards..eh NG???

I've never written up an officer for a medal but I've written up several WOs and ratings with quite a satisfying success rate. The service system allows anyone to put someone forward. How many have you written up?
 

Flagdeck

War Hero
Methinks 'tis the grapes turning sour.

The higher up the greasy pole, the more responsibility, that equates to 'risk', therefore more kudos (and more dosh)


.......just look at the gongs on these working class heroes.......
 

Sharkey

Banned
I'm not defending the system but the prevalence of more senior military 'movers & shakers' granted honours (as opposed to decorations or medals) in the New Year Honours and Queen's Birthday Honours only mirrors that of more senior civil servants, diplomats, captains of industry and other 'movers & shakers' in local government, charities, sports, the arts, etc.



Naval Gazer (CDF & Bar)

And barbers
 
There were a couple of AB's who were awarded either the MBE or OBE a few years ago (I think it was the former). It caused a little bit of a stink as they both happened to be Stewards working in one of the many Admiralty buildings in London - a running joke in the UPO was that they had been awarded it for services to pillow fluffing.

To be honest, I do wonder if that has precluded those in the lower decks from being recommended for an award?
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
And barbers
My thoughts exactly.


The one thing that throws a spanner in the works for me is the relatively new trend of giving artificially inflated awards to professional athletes immediately they do the job they are paid to do, having already been given a medal or cup by the individual sporting body. It's a bit like getting more than one campaign medal for a single campaign (or adorning oneself in submarine effigies in case no-one sees the kissing kippers).
 

redmonkey

Lantern Swinger
Book Reviewer
I did write myself up for an MBE, the hardest per was getting someone to sign it.
Even putting it into a pile if other papers that needed signing didn't work fully. It got signed due to pen runaway but then filed in the big round file once it was realised what it was for.
I thought I had done a very good job of reducing the NATO tea mountain and looking busy whilst googling on works time.
The CO got his MBE when I should have had mine.

Isn't the OBE generally known as Other Bastards Efforts?

Sent from my HTC Desire using Navy Net - Rum Ration mobile app
 

wave_dodger

MIA
Book Reviewer
If you look at the definitions which I think loosely are MBE - National recognition/service and OBE - wider, perhaps International recognition/service it's often easier to characterise these towards Officers role as opposed to JR/SRs, not always but more often.

I've written up three JR/SRs for MBEs and none of them received it - which was a huge personal disappointment but they will never know. That the TLB I worked for at that time was knees deep in very operationally focussed work and it did further support people for honours was a level of balance that whilst disappointed I understood and I knew that above that level there were three more layers of filtering and vetting.

I know most people realise this but it's by no means as simple as CO endorses, recipients gets it. I do think our internal scrutiny though, is more stringent than other departments.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
My thoughts are that if Ratings/Other Ranks aren't getting MBE' s, then maybe SNCO's, the people that write their reports, aren't making sufficient nominations. Must admit, I didn't put anyone forward in the days I wrote JR reports.
 

FunkyJunky

War Hero
What should happen, is properly train people in the art of defence writing in order for better quality reports to leave units
 

Spidiver

War Hero
Or..do your job, draw your pay and if you want lots of bling join the fecking scouts, they have badges and shit for everything.
Not sour grapes etc, but had the chance to read the diary of a naval officer who described how he and his 2 buddies had decided to divvy up some medals between them, great read and insight into the mentality of these little teddies.
 

SONAR-BENDER

War Hero
I'm sure I read recently that 'they' were re-instating the BEM for those on the lower decks. Could be wrong though - I was once in 1976!
 

wave_dodger

MIA
Book Reviewer
Or..do your job, draw your pay and if you want lots of bling join the fecking scouts, they have badges and shit for everything.
Not sour grapes etc, but had the chance to read the diary of a naval officer who described how he and his 2 buddies had decided to divvy up some medals between them, great read and insight into the mentality of these little teddies.

There's a lot to be said for that - applies in the same way to promotion. The number of drips I've had and the countless hours lost to representations because "X wholly believed doing a good job equalled being ready for promotion" - I think the same does apply to Honours & Awards hence why in reality there are very few and those that are awarded do genuinely seem to be for those who do more than just their job. At the higher levels I can't comment but when I look at OF5 down I sense it is quite fair.
 
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