Telegraph: Cdr Jeff Tall RN (SM) On The Chilean Miners

#2
the Telegraph said:
The Chile miners are about to emerge from one of the toughest human ordeals in history.
Bollocks. I can think of half a dozen tougher ordeals off the top of my head, and without really trying. Have a look at Owen Chase's account of the sinking of the Essex if you want to read about ordeals.

Cdr Tall said:
One of the features of us coming back from patrol, because we didn't have very far to look, our focal length had shortened so we weren’t allowed to drive for 48 hours.
I've heard this said before, but am aware of no medical evidence to support this. (I am aware of the anecdotal evidence, particularly the RTAs, but there are other ways to explain this, and my own experience tells me that this is fallacious).
 
#3
Joe_Crow said:
Cdr Tall said:
One of the features of us coming back from patrol, because we didn't have very far to look, our focal length had shortened so we weren’t allowed to drive for 48 hours.
I've heard this said before, but am aware of no medical evidence to support this. (I am aware of the anecdotal evidence, particularly the RTAs, but there are other ways to explain this, and my own experience tells me that this is fallacious).
Joe,

I cannot substantiate the medical evidence but one of the re-adjustments on returning from patrol (SN & BN) was definitely the WOW factor of being able to see ALL around the horizon; fore-, middle-, and back-ground views. Not to mention the glorious technicolour of nature in it's fullest splendour, whatever the season.

For me that always took a bit of getting used to.

Perhaps your boats returned from patrol in the dark each time?
 

Seaweed

War Hero
Book Reviewer
#4
From earlier reports some are going to face difficult choices .. between women as some miners, allegedly, have been caught out with their wives finding hitherto-unknown girlfriends also pitching up at the minehead.
 
#5
BreathingOutOnTheWayUp said:
Joe,

I cannot substantiate the medical evidence but one of the re-adjustments on returning from patrol (SN & BN) was definitely the WOW factor of being able to see ALL around the horizon; fore-, middle-, and back-ground views. Not to mention the glorious technicolour of nature in it's fullest splendour, whatever the season.

For me that always took a bit of getting used to.

Perhaps your boats returned from patrol in the dark each time?
I don't deny that the sight of the outdoors is indeed wondrous to the eyes of those deprived of it for some time, but there is a difference between staring at the scenery in awe and there actually being a physical condition temporarily affecting one's eyesight. I am firmly of the belief that crashes involving those recently returned from patrol are more to do with tiredness (due possibly to our strange sleep patterns at sea, and their being disturbed by Harbours etc.), and it would take more than a few bomber-dits to alter my perception.
 
#6
Joe_Crow said:
BreathingOutOnTheWayUp said:
Joe,

I cannot substantiate the medical evidence but one of the re-adjustments on returning from patrol (SN & BN) was definitely the WOW factor of being able to see ALL around the horizon; fore-, middle-, and back-ground views. Not to mention the glorious technicolour of nature in it's fullest splendour, whatever the season.

For me that always took a bit of getting used to.

Perhaps your boats returned from patrol in the dark each time?
I don't deny that the sight of the outdoors is indeed wondrous to the eyes of those deprived of it for some time, but there is a difference between staring at the scenery in awe and there actually being a physical condition temporarily affecting one's eyesight. I am firmly of the belief that crashes involving those recently returned from patrol are more to do with tiredness (due possibly to our strange sleep patterns at sea, and their being disturbed by Harbours etc.), and it would take more than a few bomber-dits to alter my perception.
We were told that the reason why it was not a good idea to drive having just returned from patrol was that our eyes were not used to viewing objects at a distance and that it was a good idea to get someone to pick you up. Now not being a medic I believed this. Now Joe I have no doubt that with your medical prowess you can tell us different but back in 1971 I tended to accept a lift home keping all my energy in reserve for giving 'er indoors a bloody good rogering!!
 
#7
Polycell said:
We were told that the reason why it was not a good idea to drive having just returned from patrol was that our eyes were not used to viewing objects at a distance and that it was a good idea to get someone to pick you up. Now not being a medic I believed this. Now Joe I have no doubt that with your medical prowess you can tell us different but back in 1971 I tended to accept a lift home keping all my energy in reserve for giving 'er indoors a bloody good rogering!!
Not being an Ophthalmologist, I am not in a position to say that this definitely not true, but I believe it to be a suburban myth, and have never seen anything other than anecdotal evidence to say otherwise. In my own case, many years ago, I came off a 13 week winter patrol straight into Bergen, and within a couple of hours was driving a LHD minibus on the wrong side of the road in an unfamiliar place with no visual problems. A quarter of a century later, I was doing almost exactly the same, (albeit after slightly less time at sea, and in a place with which I am more familiar) in the brilliant sunshine of the UAE, again, without any problems of a visual nature. I have also driven whilst dog-tired, and have had problems focussing. My experience, logic, and intuition all tell me that it is a gash dit, but one, maybe, that served a purpose, for the reasons I gave earlier.
 
#8
Although I've always had a lift home coming back off patrol as I live too far away from the dockyard for buses etc I've often driven within a few hours of coming home with no problems. I've always been told the 48 hour adjustment is for safety, but like Joe, I've never seen it written down or had any experience of it affecting any one.
 
#9
So Cdr. Jeff Tull was seduced by the 'urban myth', too? I think not.

Posted in August:

BreathingOutOnTheWayUp said:
SONAR-BENDER said:
I'm FAIRLY certain, but stand to be corrected as always, that on returning from patrol, we were not supposed to drive for 24 hours after coming alongside. Right! :wink:

This was supposedly based on the fact that for x weeks ones eyes could not have anything further away that say 20ft on which to focus. Seemingly rather a lot of lads had bad accidents on the A38/Faslane dual carriageway and this was used as the excuse for this information.

:D
As far as I can remember this VG advice was issued circa 1969 after a car full of Polaris (Reso?) WE SRs were written off on in a nasty collision with a lorry on their way home from Coulport on the narrow B833 between Clynder & Garelochhead.

Thereafter I always felt a cold chill whenever I passed that spot.

REA Noble & Co: RIP
Bob
 
#10
BreathingOutOnTheWayUp said:
So Cdr. Jeff Tull was seduced by the 'urban myth', too? I think not.

Posted in August:

BreathingOutOnTheWayUp said:
SONAR-BENDER said:
I'm FAIRLY certain, but stand to be corrected as always, that on returning from patrol, we were not supposed to drive for 24 hours after coming alongside. Right! :wink:

This was supposedly based on the fact that for x weeks ones eyes could not have anything further away that say 20ft on which to focus. Seemingly rather a lot of lads had bad accidents on the A38/Faslane dual carriageway and this was used as the excuse for this information.

:D
As far as I can remember this VG advice was issued circa 1969 after a car full of Polaris (Reso?) WE SRs were written off on in a nasty collision with a lorry on their way home from Coulport on the narrow B833 between Clynder & Garelochhead.

Thereafter I always felt a cold chill whenever I passed that spot.

REA Noble & Co: RIP
Bob
As I said earlier - anecdotal evidence. I also said "... a gash dit, but one, maybe, that served a purpose..."
 
#13
soleil said:
This is by no means intended as corroboration of the idea that submariners are formally advised by the RN not to drive for a certain period after returning from deployment...
I have heard the dits, but I have never been advised (officially or otherwise) not to drive following a period at sea, and have, as I pointed out earlier, driven as part of my duties within a couple of hours of coming alongside.
 
#15
Seaweed said:
From earlier reports some are going to face difficult choices .. between women as some miners, allegedly, have been caught out with their wives finding hitherto-unknown girlfriends also pitching up at the minehead.
Mmmmmmmmm - a bit like Guzz then, after a long patrol (Global 86 maybe) so I've heard (cough) :oops:

Well, wtf, we're divorced now!!! :D

Strangely enough in 1986!!! :lol:
 
#16
SONAR-BENDER said:
Seaweed said:
From earlier reports some are going to face difficult choices .. between women as some miners, allegedly, have been caught out with their wives finding hitherto-unknown girlfriends also pitching up at the minehead.
Mmmmmmmmm - a bit like Guzz then, after a long patrol (Global 86 maybe) so I've heard (cough) :oops:

Well, wtf, we're divorced now!!! :D

Strangely enough in 1986!!! :lol:
Well Dave how coincidental is that so was I. Must have been a good year for a divorce me thinks!!
 

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