Swords

Anyone know what the deal is with SCC Officers being able to carry swords but not CCF Officers?

Always wondered! Can enyone enlighten me?

 

I go to a CCF unit and a SCC unit (well marine cadets unit but you know) and to be honest I wouldn't trust the officers at my CCF unit with a pair of safety scissors. (this is by no means a dig at the CCF in general, just my CCF)

 

Isnt it because SCC officers are also RNR and CCF officers are not? Just a guess.

 

Good idea, but both have RNR in their full titles

 

Sea Cadet Corps Officers are given a commission and wear the wavy Navy braid. Hence the sword .

Not sure about the CCF

 

Probably down to CCF/SCC uniform regulations rather than anything to do with the RN/RNR. Both lots of officers are listed in the Navy List.

 

I'm not shore what the officers in your units were like, but in mine the only time I ever saw officers with swords was when real officers from the Royal Navy came on Inspection Days.

But like I said that was just my unit.

 

CCF are wavy navy too, i think there might be some difference in their commissions, but just not quite sure what! There are a few other random differences tooo - like in the SCC i think the highest you can go is a 2 and a half but in the CCF the CO can be a full Cdr.

 

Yes, you are right about the full Commander, but they can only get that if they are in a post scheduled for a two and half (ie 100 cadets or more) and they have held a commission for twenty years. They can then apply for a promotion to acting (unpaid) Commander.
As I said earlier, both have RNR in their title, but neither SCC nor CCF hold a full commission in the way Army or RAF cadet officers do. SCC hold a courtesy commission and are only entitled to compliments while on duty and in uniform. CCF officers hold a "Headmasters appointment" and are similarly entitled to compliments.
Army cadet officers (ACF and CCF) have a TA Group B commission, and RAF cadet officers (ATC and CCF) hold a Volunteer Reserve (Training) commission, hence the metal VRT endorsement on the bar code rank slides.

 

Just for interest, the cost of a complete sword set in the RAN is $A3,500, and thats through Naval Stores. Needless to say, if any Cadet Officers were thonking of wearing a sword the cost would be too much for tha average one.

With Wolkinson Sword Company now extinct, maybe some cheap Chinese versions will become available

 

Official RN sword new £1500 from wilkinson sword.
Refurbished sword £600+ depending on condition complete with scabbard and sword knot.

SCC Officers get a £500 grant towards uniform.

The officers in the SCC who wear swords do so at great personal expense. this may be why CCF Naval Officers dont bother...

Rincewind

 

Interesting to learn that Australian officers now pay $3,500 for a sword kit. As a long retired SD officer, I paid just £95.00 for a full sword kit and felt seen off when I learned that the three Oz officers in my term paid just £A25.00 - apparently, the RAN had bought hundreds of them years before and sold them on the newly commissioned officers at the original cost price. Typical Aussie common sense! I still have mine.

Regards,

fido

 

SCC officer's do not hold commisions (nor courtesey commissions). If you read the MOU with the RN, it clearly states that. They are temporarily appointed in the RNR and their officer's and senior rates are part of the Youth movement. When RFA 95 came out SCC were excluded from the RNR, although this has now been rectified, to have the SCC temporarily attached to the RNR.

 

Any scc officers interested in purchasing a sword and scabbard at a reasonable price let me know
Joe Fraser

 

Any scc officers interested in purchasing a sword and scabbard at a reasonable price let me know
Joe Fraser

 

It is quite simply down to Dress Regs

The SCC regs are written by SCC HQ and submitted for MoD(N) approval.

 

Both types of Cadet Force Officers have worn swords whilst participating in the now defunct Battle of the Atlantic parade and would have been roundly repremanded had they not. l

 

Why are Battle of the Atlantic parades now defunct? Still very much alive and well here in Canada.

 

That is because the budget was cut after the "60th". Nice to know some one is keeping them going. ( I think this thread has just digressed. )