SMQ (Dry)

#1
Genuine question!

I've just been reading about the two latest classes pasing out from their SMQ (Dry) course at Faslane.

This made me think..... What happens if you are drafted to boats later in life? For example, I went after Mech's course (a volunteer!!). Now I know that there are no longer Mech's courses, but are folk still drafted to boats as Leaders or POs and if so, do they do a Part 3 onboard as we did, or do they piggy back on one of these SMQ courses?
 
#2
No such thing as a silly question!

Yes, all transfers (ratings) now conduct SMQ (Dry), we recently have had a number of transfers from skimmer, loggies, waffu's etc. They conduct the SMQ (Dry) classroom based instruction mixed with baby's just joining up. Once complete they (depending on spare bunks) join a boat and do BSS and BSQ the same as new entries. Their currently is no difference in qualification methods for ratings irrelevant of rank and service history. Essentially a Non-Qual is a Non-Qual and must be trained and treated as such.

Hope that helps!
 
#3
No such thing as a silly question!

Yes, all transfers (ratings) now conduct SMQ (Dry), we recently have had a number of transfers from skimmer, loggies, waffu's etc. They conduct the SMQ (Dry) classroom based instruction mixed with baby's just joining up. Once complete they (depending on spare bunks) join a boat and do BSS and BSQ the same as new entries. Their currently is no difference in qualification methods for ratings irrelevant of rank and service history. Essentially a Non-Qual is a Non-Qual and must be trained and treated as such.

Hope that helps!
At least the showers will get used :)
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#5
Can I ask a submariner question too, please?

The submariner medical examination after joining...precisely what does it involve? Is it everything already checked at the AFCO medical or is it just the lung function and cardio stuff?
 
#6
Can I ask a submariner question too, please?

The submariner medical examination after joining...precisely what does it involve? Is it everything already checked at the AFCO medical or is it just the lung function and cardio stuff?
It is (or was) mainly lung function on a vitalograph, it also used to be chest x-ray but that was when we still did the tank, I don't know if it's included now. I can ask and see what they have to do now.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#7
It is (or was) mainly lung function on a vitalograph, it also used to be chest x-ray but that was when we still did the tank, I don't know if it's included now. I can ask and see what they have to do now.
Cheers Wrecks, I wondered if any afco elements were repeated.

I'm aware things like head injuries (concussion, skull fractures & being knocked unconscious) were significant issues but was curious with regard repeated stuff. ie: could you pass an AFCO medical for entry, but be knocked back for submariner on something already checked & passed generically OK. (Examples being height/weight, fractures, visual acuity, mental health history, colour perception, hearing, etc.)
 
#8
Cheers Wrecks, I wondered if any afco elements were repeated.

I'm aware things like head injuries (concussion, skull fractures & being knocked unconscious) were significant issues but was curious with regard repeated stuff. ie: could you pass an AFCO medical for entry, but be knocked back for submariner on something already checked & passed generically OK.
We had one guy volunteer for submarine service who got turned down for being overweight. Still okay for GS though. He did not appreciate being told he was unfit. Something to do with the fact that he played rugby for Collingrad and was either the hooker or prop and did circuits every day!
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#9
We had one guy volunteer for submarine service who got turned down for being overweight. Still okay for GS though. He did not appreciate being told he was unfit. Something to do with the fact that he played rugby for Collingrad and was either the hooker or prop and did circuits every day!
Yep, it's an interesting one. Many muscle bosuns (Divers & Bootnecks in particular) would fail the entry standard on BMI, but as long as the guy was passed fit for entry and has a waist measurement under 94cms, you'd have thought an "in service" medic would apply a degree of common sense. Then again, many fat fcukers are rugby players as well as simply being overweight.
 

janner

MIA
Book Reviewer
#10
Yep, it's an interesting one. Many muscle bosuns (Divers & Bootnecks in particular) would fail the entry standard on BMI, but as long as the guy was passed fit for entry and has a waist measurement under 94cms, you'd have thought an "in service" medic would apply a degree of common sense. Then again, many fat fcukers are rugby players as well as simply being overweight.
I didn't realise that you'd actually met Sumo. o_O
 
#11
Cheers Wrecks, I wondered if any afco elements were repeated.

I'm aware things like head injuries (concussion, skull fractures & being knocked unconscious) were significant issues but was curious with regard repeated stuff. ie: could you pass an AFCO medical for entry, but be knocked back for submariner on something already checked & passed generically OK. (Examples being height/weight, fractures, visual acuity, mental health history, colour perception, hearing, etc.)
Just asked the question and, since the demise of pressurised escape training, Raleigh do not carry out any extra medical checks on submariners.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#12
Just asked the question and, since the demise of pressurised escape training, Raleigh do not carry out any extra medical checks on submariners.
Wow, interesting. So, if someone is going to have any medical issues with a submarine escape, they'll only find out if doing it for real. Hmmn, makes me not want to be in the escape queue behind a newly badged submariner ;)

And yep, I am aware that we prefer to use rescue submersibles nowadays.
 
#13
Wow, interesting. So, if someone is going to have any medical issues with a submarine escape, they'll only find out if doing it for real. Hmmn, makes me not want to be in the escape queue behind a newly badged submariner ;)

And yep, I am aware that we prefer to use rescue submersibles nowadays.
Surprised me as well, I thought a basic check would be at least a vitalograph.
 

janner

MIA
Book Reviewer
#14
What is this vitalograph that you speak of, they put us in the pressure pot and took it to 100' you got a bollocking if you couldn't keep your ears free on the way, instructor was really happy when we had to back from around 50' because one lad couldn't clear his ears. He eventually went back to Gens.

I always understood that reluctance to go on a mass escape was the reason that the senior man was issued with a large wheel spanner.
 
#15
What is this vitalograph that you speak of, they put us in the pressure pot and took it to 100' you got a bollocking if you couldn't keep your ears free on the way, instructor was really happy when we had to back from around 50' because one lad couldn't clear his ears. He eventually went back to Gens.

I always understood that reluctance to go on a mass escape was the reason that the senior man was issued with a large wheel spanner.
Before you went into the pot you had to do the vitalograph, which is basically blow into a machine for so many seconds and keep the pointer near the top (bit like a breathalyser).

You had to do it on re-quals as well.

Vitalograph is the name of the company that made the machines.

https://vitalograph.co.uk/
 

janner

MIA
Book Reviewer
#16
I don't remember doing anything other than a medical then into the pot, mind you it was a while ago. Had a much more through medical when I went to Lee to do some cold water trials a few months later, we were doing comparisons between the immersion suit and the current air crew dingy. Good thing was we got two tots (neaters) a day.
 
#17
Yep, it's an interesting one. Many muscle bosuns (Divers & Bootnecks in particular) would fail the entry standard on BMI, but as long as the guy was passed fit for entry and has a waist measurement under 94cms, you'd have thought an "in service" medic would apply a degree of common sense. Then again, many fat fcukers are rugby players as well as simply being overweight.
I didn't realise that you'd actually met Sumo. o_O
In my stealth days of playing Rugby, Judo for CS and brickwood FG I was a fit fast prop, not so the case these days, my once power house chest has slipped downwards about 18", currently working on that, it will take a while, 1st 8lb since new year, measured in at 60, 61, 50 similar shape to the CSB containers?
 
#18
The Vitalograph tests lung function (this is all off the top of my head now - standing by to be corrected) in that a certain percentage of air had to be expelled in a certain time, say for example, 85% in one second - no idea of the real figure. I vaguely know this, as I was a submariner and a Ship's Diver and never once passed a Vitalograph! It seems I have mahoosive lungs (stop sniggering at the back!) compared to the size of the airways, and cannot get enough air out in the first big blow. Depite being a volunteer, I was knocked back at my 'Submarine medical' because of this. When I said I was a volunteer and REALLY wanted to get into boats, I was sent to the INM for tests, which proved I was OK. (Stop sniggering at the back those who know me!)
In my stealth days of playing Rugby, Judo for CS and brickwood FG I was a fit fast prop, not so the case these days, my once power house chest has slipped downwards about 18", currently working on that, it will take a while, 1st 8lb since new year, measured in at 60, 61, 50 similar shape to the CSB containers?

I think the Vitalograph is still used for divers. It IS possible to cheat on it to pass, as I later found out, but by then I had a 'Get Out Of Jail' chitty from INM. For instructions on how to cheat, send 10 Euros to..........
 
#19
In my stealth days of playing Rugby, Judo for CS and brickwood FG I was a fit fast prop, not so the case these days, my once power house chest has slipped downwards about 18", currently working on that, it will take a while, 1st 8lb since new year, measured in at 60, 61, 50 similar shape to the CSB containers?
Is that inches or cms?

If inches, your belly has a greater circumference than my missus has height!

I am still wearing clothes (comfortably!) from 30 years ago - yes - a 'prudent' Jock, who would have thought it! And still at my literal fighting weight too!
 
#20
Is that inches or cms?

If inches, your belly has a greater circumference than my missus has height!

I am still wearing clothes (comfortably!) from 30 years ago - yes - a 'prudent' Jock, who would have thought it! And still at my literal fighting weight too!
I am wearing socks from 30 years ago, does that count? :)
 
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