SAFEGUARD are their any SUY(XSM) or XSM? Available for info at the short trail?

Discussion in 'Submariners' started by dsgrnmcm, Sep 24, 2012.

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  1. AIB moved left and new branch opportunity.

    Sent from my non-iPhone using Tapatalk
  2. Hi just passed AIB, going before extraction GS board this month and if unsuccessful SM board after that.

    My intention is to go XSM, if I get picked at the GS board I will speak to the SM RA, and hopefully get re extracted on IWOC after SFT.

    I spoke to the SM career Manager who is a 2 and a half, also my old 1lt who got to perished.

    What I would like from you guys are some gen dot experiences or information of the life on a V or A boat, that of a warfare officer, the whole getting the dolphins experience, and an idea of the routines. I have been based in Falange before but now I have a MQ down south it is a lot to consider weather to move up or weekend warrior.
  3. I don't think there are any X(SM) on this board - at least any who have been in service in this century!

    This may be a combat indicator about quite how hard junior Warfare Officers are thrashed within the SM service - not only Pt 3s, but you are seen as a 'non-qualified' in some way, shape or form until you pass Perisher. However, in many ways it's easier than GS life as the lack of email means a junior Dabber tends just to watchkeep and prepare for the multitude of boards you will have to pass - Pt 3, then Tactical Weapon Systems ('twis'), Officer of the Day (and all the Nuclear bits), then getting ready for FNO, and then getting ready for PWO(SM) and then obviously SMCC.

    I don't know many X(SM) who have had a shore draft pre-XO, and I know many who bounced from boat to boat to cover gaps as SAFAs and broken oppos need covering. It is a statement of faith that a boat won't go to sea with a gap, so if you are the closest body then you'll cover it. Alongside that there are some fairly fierce OpTempo's for the running boats: TRIU just did 10 months EoS, her relief is warned off for much the same whilst the rest of the T boats struggle to get out of RAMP. The A Boats aren't really running yet but I doubt that when they are they'll make much impact on that programming pressure.

    There are so many people leaving the SM Service prior to SMCC they have cut in half the number of courses a year: this means that if you pass you'll be doing 3 - 4 years as an XO before being promoted to Cdr, and then quite possibly 3 - 4 years as a CO. To relieve the pressure on the COs lots of SM COs are going around the buoy again (i.e. 2 x 2 year drafts) - not because they are duffers but simply because a SM is uniquely reliant upon a CO in the way a FF/DD isn't and thus the stress is a lot higher.

    If you can hack the sheer pace of being an X(SM) (and pass SMCC) you are guaranteed a drive but the attrition rate is fantastically high. I have no idea of your personal circumstances but your family might be in some for some shocks as you survive all this.

    Having been on PWO Course with an SUY(X) and my old XO was a SUY I can also provide some advice on that front if you want. In all honesty I would suggest that it's much much more satisfying to be a skimmer......
  4. If you are extracted as a GSX and are interested in some time in boats then there may be another option rather than fully committing yourself to X(SM).

    There was, recently, a number of GSX who have gone across to spend some time as submariners on the understanding that it was not permanent. Probably equivalent to going FC or MCDO etc before coming back to GS for PWO course.

    I don't know anything more about the specific details or if the scheme is still available. I had not heard of it at all until I met someone who was going that route.

    Might be worth you considering, gives you the chance to stay GS and get a decent look at SM before committing yourself if you still wanted to. Once you go SM it will be considerably harder to come back to GS if you wanted to.
  5. They went over at the FNO level for 3/4 years - 12-18 months to pass Pt3 etc, and then the rest as N2 and moving up the bed to NO. This is a practical demonstration of how short the SM service is of people at every level.
  6. Do you get N2 on ships? How long would you spend as an N2 on submarines or ships?
  7. You get an n2 on Capitol ships. The idea being the N2 navs the ship while the navigator navs the fleet / group.
  8. Cheers, some good advice. AFG I'll pm you in a bit with details.

    The biggest choice for me is the location and routines. But having said that my last trip was on the ocean and our 7 week jolly ended with a 9 month RFTG tour. So maybe boats are more stable, programme wise.

  9. Erm, no, in a word.
  10. Cheers, some good advice. AFG I'll pm you in a bit with details.

    The biggest choice for me is the location and routines. But having said that my last trip was on the ocean and our 7 week jolly ended with a 9 month RFTG tour. So maybe boats are more stable, programme wise.
  11. Only if you go for bombers (and stay on them as it's all about bums on seats).
  12. And as a baby dabber you won't stay on bombers.

    True dit - mate went to work on Tuesday morning for the day, came back 4 months later having completed a shakedown, BOST and SMCC in place of a Navs who'd quit due to stress.
  13. Thought bombers were better for progression due to patrol Time I.e. 12 weeks?
  14. The largest part of SMCC is aggressively driving the boat to close and attack a target, generally by visual means. This is inimical to everything a SSBN does which is mainly be very quiet and slow.

    It might be great for Pt 3, TWS and SCOOW but pretty awful for PWO(SM) and SMCC!
  15. How is poncing around at 4 kts for weeks on end, avoiding detection, better for progression? (especially for a dabber) ATG, although a skimmer, is correct.
  16. For a submariner, saying that has got to hurt.....
  17. Not really, you talk a lot of sense. I know a few engineers who have made the SUY GS to SM transition (success rate about 50%). I don't recall a Warfare guy who has done likewise - far from easy!
  18. What's the whole 4kts thing?
  19. Top speed of an SSBN on patrol (allegedly!)
  20. Right, just to get this off my chest.....

    As a SUY(X)(GS) you would be a PWO within 4 years of getting your bridge watchkeeping certificate, and within 6 years you'd be in line for a promotion to Lt Cdr and, if you wanted to, qualified for Command. Now, granted, this takes a decent candidate who is good enough to earn a recommend from their CO to go to PWO course early, as well as able to pass their 13 Command Exams. That's not a huge stretch to be honest, as nearly every Warfare Officer goes through exactly the same process and you know as well as I there are some complete morons in our branch.

    If you want to get off the elevator, especially as a post-PWO, there are loads of Lt Cdr shore assignments for SUYs (as well as the more generic Lt Cdr X assignments) that offer significant stability. If you wanted to you could probably enter the MWS or Raleigh track and spend 6 or 8 years in one place.

    Being SUY means you can apply some of your previous experiences to bear on your new career, and for example a lot of the bridge/dabber stuff for you won't be a new thing to master. It is this that off-sets the fact you are 10 years or so behind the curve compared to the guys you will be doing SFT(X) and IWO Course with.

    Going SM as a SUY with only a GS background loses you that advantage - suddenly you'll be at the bottom of the ladder with little or no experience of the job you are about to do and you are 10 years older to boot. It's not like you are a CPO(S)(SM) who can look at a NB display and identify a 2x5 blade rate alongside a MDFLOP or 3rd Harmonic of the CFR for the diesels, who will also have his Dolphins as well as his SCOOW (probably) and possibly is also periscope qualified.

    I would strong advise against going down the SM route, but at the end of the day it's your career and your life.

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