RNR Manning - 1500 leave, 750 join since 03

[Jim30]

These statistics were in Hansard today. It makes very depressing reading:

First figure is the "inflow" - i.e. new entrants. The 2nd is outflow - i.e. those leaving.
Number
Inflow Outflow
1997- 98
590 / 400

1998-99
440/ 320

1999-2000
600/ 470

2000-01
560/590

2001-02
680 / 560

2002-03
540 / 570

2003-04
280 / 540

2004-05
200 / 530

2005-06
270 / 430

Since 2003, 750 people have joined the RNR. In the same time 1500 have left. Says it all really...

 

[persona_non_grata]

Shows the effect that Telic had on recruitment quite well though - drop from 540 in 2002/3 by half to 280 in 2003/4 and an unsurprising minor drop in 1998/9.
Such are the joys of Labour governments :roll: :evil:

 

[dubaipusser]

The 'leaving' figures have been pretty consistent over the last few years reflecting something probably more akin to a natural retirement pattern.

1997 was the night of the long knives (aka Options for Change) so a lot of people were pretty unceremoniously binned around that time as units closed and branches were realigned which could explain the relatively benign wastage rates in the following 2 years.

The problem would appear to be recruitment and, at the risk of accepting that the 'authorities' may have it right (and oh how I hate to consider such a possibility) perhaps the often quoted priority on recruitment is right.

Retention (still vital to survival), despite comments about haemorrhaging of the current profile, appears to be no more a problem now than it has been for the last 6 or 7 years and it is attracting the new blood that is causing us problems.

 

[rogerthecabinboy]

How do the Functional Employer hope to recruit when we are invisible.
Look at the gucci TV ads for the TA. Get fit army style, gliding, rock climbing etc etc. Fcuk, i thought about swapping over; then realised it was PR bullshit. But- it raises recruitment levels. Spend some cash , not just on RN TV ads, but Reserve ones too.
End of rant :sad:

 

[PartTimer]

How do the Functional Employer hope to recruit when we are invisible.
Look at the gucci TV ads for the TA. Get fit army style, gliding, rock climbing etc etc. Fcuk, i thought about swapping over; then realised it was PR bullshit. But- it raises recruitment levels. Spend some cash , not just on RN TV ads, but Reserve ones too.
End of rant :sad:

I did think that but heard a very persuasive agrument last week that we shouldn't be wasting millions on brand awareness, but just doing the plain simple stuff like sending someone around to the local CCF and Sea Cadet units every so often. That isn't happening in many, many areas.

We also need to improve the ratio of those attending recruitment evenings to actually sign on the dotted line. 3 to 1 is the best I've heard so far - at least one unit is orders of magnitude worse. We're also suffering from so many specs being closed to recruitment over the last few years.

For those that are leaving because of Telic, good riddance. If you take the pay, then won't stand to then I for one don't want to serve alongside you. I think only a minority have left because of Telic in any case - much of it is a generation of people leaving, and that is set to get worse. Many seemed to have stayed for the RNR100 celebrations before leaving.

Retention is a big problem - not helped by constant cuts in the units, to travel, AT etc.

 

[mad_muppet]

Interesting statistics. It would help understand the figures if we knew how many of those who left actually went voluntarily or were discharged due to age? I think that the demographics could tell us a lot.

I wonder if any analysis is ever done with the personnel side of things in the RNR. How long people stay in for? What is their reason for leaving? I know we all had a survey a few years ago but not sure what came of it and the results were used, if at all. Maybe exit surveys should be completed for people who leave?

I agree with the comments about people leaving post-Telic. A personal choice but you can't expect the cash without the commitment.

Cuts and the lack of communication from CMR isn't going to help matters in the coming months/years.

 

[itsamuppet]

I Agree with Part Timer, we seem to missing the obvious recruitment catchment area. The CCF, SCC, VCC and Sea Scouts are areas we should concentrate on. I recently visited a Sea Scout unit to initially prepare for Remeberance parade, but whilst there answered lots of questions about how to go about joining and what was in it for them. Many saw it as a stepping stone to a full time career, but others wanted to carry on doing what they enjoyed, and the pay was a bonus.

I did 10 years in the Volunteer Cadet Corps, all our instructors where serving Sailors, my father was a Submariner, but it wasn't until I left the TA that I found out about the RNR.

If this is still the case no wonder we aren't getting people in through the door. Surely this pool of like minded individuals already used to the Navy discipline and Ethos are perfect for what the RNR requires, dedicated young men and women with a love for the sea.

And the cost virtually nothing. My unit has a SCC unit and RMR VCC unit next door. I don't know of anyone who has joined us from any of these establishments. Nor do I know of anyone from my unit giving a talk. Considering they meet on the same night as us this is ridiculous.

Perhaps the SCC will see this as poaching their prospective instructors, but surely they can see the benefits to themselves of closer ties to RNR units.

Enough Said

 

[rugger_bob]

Slightly off the thread, but do you guys think they are rushing new entrants through training ?

RB

 

[phil1972]

They should do, but I don't think they are.

 

[ToryBoy]

There needs to be a proper audit of reasons why people are leaving.
We could then address the issue perhaps.

So a leavers' survey is vital. If a comercial company were loosing customers on this scale, they would make every effort to find out why, and modify what they offer.

I think we should do the same.

It is said that in politics, nothing is ever as good, or as bad as it seems. I wonder if that is the case here, and perhaps the figures will pick up naturally?

 

[Manny]

The TA/Army adverts were very smart, but the Army has admitted that they cost many £millions and recruited practically no one. This does not explain why the RN is keeping such a low profile.

My unit is doing some analysis of leavers, while some are due to retirements (and the RNR age profile is suggesting that the numbers will dive even more, due to the aging population), the majority are leaving between 5 and 10 years after joining. The problem is that it is all very well trying to do exit interviews (and the like), but the person has already left (or stopped attending) and this is far to late in the day.

The RNR is not like a real job, people do not work out notice, they just stop attending. I think everyone knows the problems, late cancellation of training, training that is not challenging etc, the problem is that CMR are not doing anything to fix it!

 

[brummiebloke]

In terms of recruitment I do not understand why the RNR does not target sports events. Take a premier league or even championship football match, 15000 - 60000 people as a captive audience. If you get just 0.5% that show interest then you have 75 - 300 people that are potential recruits. 50% then turn up for a recruitment night and you have 37 - 150 people. Based upon the 3:1 ratio already mentioned then you get 12 - 50 new people that will stick with it.

And thats all based on just one sporting event. multiply that by the number of sporting events in an area or even the country and the numbers really ass up.

Can I take commission on this ????

 

[Deckhead_Inspector]

The RN adverts were ready to run now, with an add on for the RNR. But now they have been shelved and the RNR bit dropped.

 

[PartTimer]

The RN adverts were ready to run now, with an add on for the RNR. But now they have been shelved and the RNR bit dropped.

Something to do with legalities about calling the RNR 'part time', and its implications for pensions etc, so I heard. Could be bollocks of course.

 

[sinbad]

I Agree with Part Timer, we seem to missing the obvious recruitment catchment area. The CCF, SCC, VCC and Sea Scouts are areas we should concentrate on. I recently visited a Sea Scout unit to initially prepare for Remeberance parade, but whilst there answered lots of questions about how to go about joining and what was in it for them. Many saw it as a stepping stone to a full time career, but others wanted to carry on doing what they enjoyed, and the pay was a bonus.

If this is still the case no wonder we aren't getting people in through the door. Surely this pool of like minded individuals already used to the Navy discipline and Ethos are perfect for what the RNR requires, dedicated young men and women with a love for the sea.

And the cost virtually nothing. My unit has a SCC unit and RMR VCC unit next door. I don't know of anyone who has joined us from any of these establishments. Nor do I know of anyone from my unit giving a talk. Considering they meet on the same night as us this is ridiculous.

Perhaps the SCC will see this as poaching their prospective instructors, but surely they can see the benefits to themselves of closer ties to RNR units.

Enough Said

i 've notced this from across the pond also, recruitment from the SCC could help with the survival of quite a few units but it's always overlooked. How many times have we seen SCC's at Raleigh, Excellent or Caledonia ? they get the SNR accom before we do !! Their Parade Training would put most of us to shame and ur right they do know most of the basics seamanship etc... let them move up and onwards to the RNR....entice them with pay and bounties and travel afar they have already proved they are interested in the RN ethos and don't take the P out of them when they arrive at your unit with nice shiny boots and announce the where a cadet. t they could help save the RNR !!!!

 

[polab]

The problem is that the SCC does see this as "poaching their potential instructors". That is why in the context of the SCC there is not much mention of service in either the RN or RNR.

The SCC tries not to ally with recruiters because it does not want to be seen as a pre-service orgnisation. This is not in line with ACF or ATC units who often have Advisors and Liason Officers that have the purpose of informing the sproggs that a career in the services is open to them.

Personally, I believe ex-cadets would make good matelots. I'm one.

 

[dunkers]

The problem is that the SCC does see this as "poaching their potential instructors". That is why in the context of the SCC there is not much mention of service in either the RN or RNR.

I'm afraid not. I found that quite the opposite is true, in fact.

It was only through having been a cadet that I knew the RNR existed; and for a couple of years I was under the impression that only ex-regulars joined the RNR.

I was preceisly the kind of person you claim the SCC was worried about losing - a cadet going on to the instructor level. I joined the RNR so as to stop playing at it and the cadet unit was very supportive. I am still involved with the cadets however.

The SCC provides excellent training for going into the RN in terms of drill, dress standards and basic seamanship. Visiting cadet units, advertising in newspapers and maybe even (now here's an idea) opening recruiting offices at weekends might help recruiting just a bit.

There is no section of the country's youth more aware of the Forces than cadets. With the right approach, I am sure most cadet units would be happy to open their doors to RNR visits, since it would provide their cadets with a great opportunity.

 

[beer_bosun]

I Agree with Part Timer, we seem to missing the obvious recruitment catchment area. The CCF, SCC, VCC and Sea Scouts are areas we should concentrate on.

I disagree, I do not think that "selling" to young kids is the right way to bolster numbers. I see no problem in making them more aware of the RNR and what we do but the RNR and Cadet organisations are coming from completely different angles.

Cadets are mainly around adventureous activities than active service - imagine the disappointment when kids join and realise that all of the equipment, boats and activities they are accustomed to do not exist in the RNR to such a considerable extent....

 

[dunkers]

beer_bosun, bear in mind that there are cadets in the age range of 16-18 many of whom would very much enjoy the RNR - I was one of them.

 

[MasterChief]

Beer Bosun
I think the stats show that quite a healthy percentage of RNR ratings originate from the cadet organisations.

ps are you still helping the wardroom cut up their food

DSMSMR