Richards Trophy / Duffy Trophy

[beer_bosun]

Given the number of weekends which we seem to be increasingly spending "doing RNR stuff", what would people think if the Richards and Duffy trophies were merged into a single weekend. Richards on one day, Duffy on the other.

This would have the benefit of freeing up a weekend in the calendar and reducing the cost and number of days to the RNR.

Having never attended either of these weekends, could these single event weekends be slimmed down to single day events?

Obviously the first snag is that logisitcally they are currently held at different locations, however I reckon that could be overcome.

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

(Am playing devils advocate on this one and have no preference either way having never attended either (tis PTP (or DTO as its now known) for 2007-8))

 

[Handsome]

I think it would a GREAT idea. I've only been on the RT and i think the Sunday is a total waste of time.

 

[Trouble]

I think you would be pushing it to run a competition on the Sunday as people generally need to get home as early as possible. The problem is wherever it was held some units would end up with a very long travel late in the day.

 

[FlagWagger]

Having never attended either of these weekends, could these single event weekends be slimmed down to single day events?

Obviously the first snag is that logisitcally they are currently held at different locations, however I reckon that could be overcome.

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

Two thoughts, one logisitcal and the other slightly more philosophical.

In the past the Duffy has been heavily dependant upon the equipment located at Colingrad. The current Duffy format is slightly fluid although given it is a Comms competition it is likely to require access to Comms and IS fit, so relocation elsewhere could be difficult.

If both competitions are to be moved to Colingrad, there is a fundamental logistical problem called accommodation - there is a shortage of accommodation at MWS Collingwood, especially since the arrival of the Railway Children. On a normal Merwex weekend, they get about 100 or so people attending - space can usually be found. On the Duffy, the attendance can be well in excess of 200-300 which means Sultan, Blockhouse or even Browndown Camp have to be called upon. If you add in additional participants for the Richards Trophy then I think that we'd break the RN Central Booking System!

On the philosphical front, I can see that the relevance of Comms and Seamanship to the RNR has diminished in recent years so there could be justification for having a combined competition. However, the Duffy Trophy did not just relate to Comms(Sea) but also to the SM specialistion. There's also a strong COMMS element of the new CIS specialisation. Duffy is therefore most applicable to people within the C4ISR specialisation (plus the SM crowd who seem to be of no fixed abode!). Is there not an argument for extending the content of the Richards Trophy to include elements of GSSR too?

On balance, I think the two events should remain separate, and be held at the appropriate lead schools, after they're attended by different groups of people so savings of co-location would be marginal.

 

[trehorn]

I think you would be pushing it to run a competition on the Sunday as people generally need to get home as early as possible. The problem is wherever it was held some units would end up with a very long travel late in the day.

i think that someone forgot to tell the SR's that point for this years Richards.
After getting back to Raleigh from JP on Sunday we had 3/4 hour to wait before dinner, 1/2 hour for dinner, we were then told that all rooms were to be inspected so off we went to our relevant messes. 25 mins later no one had been to check them and everyone else had f*ucked off home.

We arrived at Raleigh at 1am on Friday, up at 0630, bed at 3am up at 7am set off home at 2pm and got home after 8pm.

Its a good weekend but we were well and truly f*cked by the time we got home. far too far to go for a weekend. then CDRE Reynolds complained that it took him 7 hours from london on Saturday.

Sorry sir, you wont get much sypathy from me.

 

[trehorn]

(/quote) On the philosphical front, I can see that the relevance of Comms and Seamanship to the RNR has diminished in recent years so there could be justification for having a combined competition. (/quote)

RNR Comms is dead - long live GSSR.

a young lady this weekend questioned if it was possible to trasfer into CIS as she was ex-comms and only joined GSSR because she was told that she could still do tactical.

i loved tactical but MCO shite was suicide watch stuff.

 

[WarMonger]

There is another thread open on the RT opened by me but as we are discussing its future will keep it to this one..!!

They have asked for feedback as to how it could be improved....but before I put pen to paper I was wondering what people thought of this years competition as a whole...!!

Would ask we try and keep it as constructive as possible...if that is possible!!

 

[FlagWagger]

RNR Comms is dead - long live GSSR.

If Comms is dead as you say, why then is there a fair chunk of Comms still contained within the CIS Ispecs? Perhaps its because the C stands for Communications!

a young lady this weekend questioned if it was possible to trasfer into CIS as she was ex-comms and only joined GSSR because she was told that she could still do tactical.

The original intention, I believe, was that GSSR would become the RNR parallel to the RN Bridge QM branch (or whatever its called) which would mean all aspects of bridge work including buntingry. However, given the bias towards all things gunnery, there's a lot of pissed off ex-comms rates in GSSR.

Could she transfer now? Probably not now - she had the opportunity early last year to join CIS at the start - the Scheme Of Complement for CIS Ratings has now been agreed and surprise, surprise is extremely close to that numbers borne. As a consequence, the specialisation is effectively "closed" unless someone can offer some exception IS skills that the RN needs.

i loved tactical but MCO shite was suicide watch stuff.

Having suffered sparker-shite in the MCO I can understand why sparkers are the way they are

 

[mazza_magoo]

I think you would be pushing it to run a competition on the Sunday as people generally need to get home as early as possible. The problem is wherever it was held some units would end up with a very long travel late in the day.

i think that someone forgot to tell the SR's that point for this years Richards.
After getting back to Raleigh from JP on Sunday we had 3/4 hour to wait before dinner, 1/2 hour for dinner, we were then told that all rooms were to be inspected so off we went to our relevant messes. 25 mins later no one had been to check them and everyone else had f*ucked off home.

We arrived at Raleigh at 1am on Friday, up at 0630, bed at 3am up at 7am set off home at 2pm and got home after 8pm.

Its a good weekend but we were well and truly f*cked by the time we got home. far too far to go for a weekend. then CDRE Reynolds complained that it took him 7 hours from london on Saturday.

Sorry sir, you wont get much sypathy from me.

Ah i see! so you were the one i saw being dragged kicking and screaming into the harbour lights on saturday night, and held there, against your will until it closed. If its anyone's fault you were tired on sunday shippers, it's yours :twisted:
I remember the days when we worked hard, played hard, and didn't bitch about it after the event. I felt this was one such training period. obviously i was wrong. :lol:

 

[Deckhead_Inspector]

What do you do for the Richards now? Didn't it used to be awarded for performance in the MSFs?

I think you would be pushing it to run a competition on the Sunday as people generally need to get home as early as possible. The problem is wherever it was held some units would end up with a very long travel late in the day.

Now I get to my point. At least in the MSF, time travelleing to the training area on Friday evening was training in its own right. As was time travelling home on Sunday. If we were lucky, we were alongside early enough to have Sunday Lunch in a civilised manner with out having to wet the Ward Room table cloths. Then the afternoon was spent cleaning ship and handing her back to the "Custodians" or permanent staff. All proper naval activity. It does seem odd that I spend as much time on the motorways now on a training week end as I do actually training.

 

[WarMonger]

I think you would be pushing it to run a competition on the Sunday as people generally need to get home as early as possible. The problem is wherever it was held some units would end up with a very long travel late in the day.

i think that someone forgot to tell the SR's that point for this years Richards.
After getting back to Raleigh from JP on Sunday we had 3/4 hour to wait before dinner, 1/2 hour for dinner, we were then told that all rooms were to be inspected so off we went to our relevant messes. 25 mins later no one had been to check them and everyone else had f*ucked off home.

We arrived at Raleigh at 1am on Friday, up at 0630, bed at 3am up at 7am set off home at 2pm and got home after 8pm.

Its a good weekend but we were well and truly f*cked by the time we got home. far too far to go for a weekend. then CDRE Reynolds complained that it took him 7 hours from london on Saturday.

Sorry sir, you wont get much sypathy from me.

Ah i see! so you were the one i saw being dragged kicking and screaming into the harbour lights on saturday night, and held there, against your will until it closed. If its anyone's fault you were tired on sunday shippers, it's yours :twisted:
I remember the days when we worked hard, played hard, and didn't bitch about it after the event. I felt this was one such training period. obviously i was wrong. :lol:

Lets hope you never get deployed operationally then....if your worn out by a bit of travelling and tying a few bends an hitches you have a rude awakening waiting for you...Life in a blue suit Im afraid!

 

[imom1406]

Lets hope you never get deployed operationally then....if your worn out by a bit of travelling and tying a few bends an hitches you have a rude awakening waiting for you...Life in a blue suit Im afraid!

Pulled in Boobs at 2, late drinkies in Lil's until 4....all night in to 07.30...turn to at 08.00.....refit routine ...fabulous...took years off my life, but made a man of me....no stamina nowadays!

 

[jesse650]

putting aside the deplorable stamina levels.. ....had a great time (apart from 1 stance) most of the staff running the stances realised that along with brushing off long disused skills (some of the guys had not done any seamanship training for over a year) it was supposed to be a competition and FUN!. :wink: As a loggie, did some stuff i haven't done since NE and I did some stuff I've never done before cracking w/e, supurb run ashore.. ..wheelers and HL. ...not changed since last there although rumours of a buy out by one of the big brewery chains of HL were in the air 8O :? and generally a load of new faces to learn.......would have liked to have a go at the light line transfer as that would dovetail into what I do in the RNR but hey can't hav it all......They reckon I'm a closet seaman and that I'll transfer......not a chance boys :twisted:

 

[FlagWagger]

Pulled in Boobs at 2, late drinkies in Lil's until 4....all night in to 07.30...turn to at 08.00.....refit routine ...fabulous...took years off my life, but made a man of me....no stamina nowadays!

Hmm lets see, started off in Nelson JRs around 1900, ashore into Pompey City Centre until 2300, then Jo's until 0330 followed by messy burger somewhere near Nelson. All night in until 0800 (colours can be such a good alram clock!) followed by mad panic to get to Horsea Island for sea-survival course.

Major learning point of this exercise was that no matter how much stamina you have, turning up for sea survival still pissed from the night before is not a good idea - several gallons of Horsea Lake followed by a trip in the 25 man life-raft behind the Gemini will make you throw up!

 

[rosinacarley]

how was 'On Me'? well behaved or not!

Thought of you all having fun whilst I was instructing MTO!

 

[bunnyjumper]

There is another thread open on the RT opened by me but as we are discussing its future will keep it to this one..!!

They have asked for feedback as to how it could be improved....but before I put pen to paper I was wondering what people thought of this years competition as a whole...!!

Would ask we try and keep it as constructive as possible...if that is possible!!

1. Get rid of the silly games part of it. It's a seamanship (or more recently a GSSR competition), and I don't think it's good practice to award points for non-seamanship / GSSR exercises. i.e. foul up weapon drill, but hey, you can get the points back by knocking a ball off a cone with a power ball!! Please!! We're RNR not bloody Part 1s with ADHD!!!

2. In reality, we're not really going to do much anchoring and stuff now, but that was left in. However, really important stuff like OOSS donning, and NBCD suiting is not in. Suggest more thought be put in to what's relevant to the role as it stands today.

Otherwise, bloody good weekend. Knackered on the sunday? Too bloody right. It wouldn't be the same otherwise would it!! Long reign the Lights!

Oh, and congrats to this years winners Calliope!! Top notch lads - but don't get too attached eh!! :wink:

 

[trehorn]

RNR Comms is dead - long live GSSR.

If Comms is dead as you say, why then is there a fair chunk of Comms still contained within the CIS Ispecs? Perhaps its because the C stands for Communications!

a young lady this weekend questioned if it was possible to trasfer into CIS as she was ex-comms and only joined GSSR because she was told that she could still do tactical.

The original intention, I believe, was that GSSR would become the RNR parallel to the RN Bridge QM branch (or whatever its called) which would mean all aspects of bridge work including buntingry. However, given the bias towards all things gunnery, there's a lot of pissed off ex-comms rates in GSSR.

Could she transfer now? Probably not now - she had the opportunity early last year to join CIS at the start - the Scheme Of Complement for CIS Ratings has now been agreed and surprise, surprise is extremely close to that numbers borne. As a consequence, the specialisation is effectively "closed" unless someone can offer some exception IS skills that the RN needs.

i loved tactical but MCO shite was suicide watch stuff.

Having suffered sparker-shite in the MCO I can understand why sparkers are the way they are

May is suggest that you speak with a few CIS ratings.

I am open to be corrected by anyone who is more in the know than me as i am a measly GSSR but the impression i am given by CIS ratings is that they are chomping at the bit to get some training done but there is no ciriculum (spelling???) for them to work to. GSSR seem to be getting very good training opportunities and alot of CIS are attending GSSR weekends just to keep their hand in.

If this is incorrect i apologise but that is the impression that was passed on the Cdre Reynolds this weekend.

 

[trehorn]

I think you would be pushing it to run a competition on the Sunday as people generally need to get home as early as possible. The problem is wherever it was held some units would end up with a very long travel late in the day.

i think that someone forgot to tell the SR's that point for this years Richards.
After getting back to Raleigh from JP on Sunday we had 3/4 hour to wait before dinner, 1/2 hour for dinner, we were then told that all rooms were to be inspected so off we went to our relevant messes. 25 mins later no one had been to check them and everyone else had f*ucked off home.

We arrived at Raleigh at 1am on Friday, up at 0630, bed at 3am up at 7am set off home at 2pm and got home after 8pm.

Its a good weekend but we were well and truly f*cked by the time we got home. far too far to go for a weekend. then CDRE Reynolds complained that it took him 7 hours from london on Saturday.

Sorry sir, you wont get much sypathy from me.

Ah i see! so you were the one i saw being dragged kicking and screaming into the harbour lights on saturday night, and held there, against your will until it closed. If its anyone's fault you were tired on sunday shippers, it's yours :twisted:
I remember the days when we worked hard, played hard, and didn't bitch about it after the event. I felt this was one such training period. obviously i was wrong. :lol:

Yes kicking and screaming, that was me. The point i was trying to make was that if you're travelling for 6 - 7 hours after working and 8 1/2 hour shift then the last thing you want on a Sunday is for the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. If they would have inspected the rooms as they said they were going to then i wouldnt have a problem. the point being we could have been on the road more than an hour earlier had they let us leave from jupiter point. Going back to Raleigh was pointless. I have been on JMC's and have no problem with the log hours and high tempo training, i just resent being dicked about - as do most people i suspect.

On a lighter note this was the first Richards Trophy i have been on and thoroughly enjoyed it. As an ex-comms rate i found it much more relevant than the Duffy. On the whole it was a well organised weekend with the right blend of work hard/play hard ethic. i am looking forward to attending next years.

 

[FlagWagger]

May is suggest that you speak with a few CIS ratings.

I'd love to, but the travel expenses are a bit prohibitive at the moment

I am open to be corrected by anyone who is more in the know than me as i am a measly GSSR but the impression i am given by CIS ratings is that they are chomping at the bit to get some training done but there is no ciriculum (spelling???) for them to work to. GSSR seem to be getting very good training opportunities and alot of CIS are attending GSSR weekends just to keep their hand in.

If this is incorrect i apologise but that is the impression that was passed on the Cdre Reynolds this weekend.

OK, first of all, CIS does have a curriculum (of sorts); three interim task books for AB1, LCIS and POCIS were issued to the units from CMR a few months back. Yhey are classed as "Interim" since they are based on the issued task scalars from Fleet rather than the usual product of Training Design = this decision was taken to get something around the bazaars now for the troops to use rather than waiting a further 12-18 months. IS courses are coming on-line, and the comms elements of the syllabus can be largely taught from existing legacy training material.

The SO2 CIS issues a regular newsletter to all units that provides updates to the CIS specialisation on the current course offerings, training opportunites and progress of the development of the CIS training material.

If ratings are champing at the bit, as you say, then they are being let down by their Senior Rates, either RN or RNR. The basis of their training has been published - unfortunately, it requires the specialisation training managers to do a little bit of thinking abouut how it can be applied to an individual's training needs and career development.

If individuals are not being offered training that they think worthwhile or relevant they should take their case through the unit chain-of-command in the first instance or go to the SO2 CIS at CMR (Lt-Cdr Fleming at King Alfred) or his Asst (CPO Clarke at Flying Fox).

Flags (Asst to SO2 CIS until June)

 

[Flagtosser]

Well he was his usual self, :evil: the only part he did well was the rowing, he had to stop after about 100yards and then proceed to swap with the Coxsain but did make a remarkable recovery after that!

It was damn good weekend, I got about 7 hrs sleep all weekend yep worked to the bone but it flowed a lot better this year, Its only my second Richards Trophy but really enjoyed it. Cant wait for next year, bring it on! :lol: