Return of service questions

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
Are you sure it is complete your return of service, then 12 months notice? I'm pretty sure it's RoS including your notice period.
For Ratings, the minimum time to serve (MTS) = SITP + RoS, then + 12 months notice period.

SITP's by branch are listed here: (BR3 Chapter 7, article 0759) http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/~/media/royal navy responsive/documents/reference library/br 3/Br3book/ch07.pdf

The RoS criteria is outlined here (BR3 Chapter 53, article 5302, paragraph B)

BR3 said:
Ratings and Other Ranks

(1) All new recruits enlisting in the Naval Service, who have not previously so enlisted, have a statutory right to claim discharge within their first six months of service, provided that they have completed a minimum four weeks’ service (excluding leave periods and any forfeited service) from their date of entry, or until the day before their 18th birthday, if this comes after the end of the six month period.

(2) For ratings and other ranks, a ROS is required to consolidate an individual’s training and give a reasonable return on the investment made by the Service.

Having completed six months’ service, or reached the age of 18 (if this comes after the end of the six month period), and subject to the exceptions that follow, ratings and other ranks become eligible to submit an application for Early Termination on completion of a minimum of 2½ years’ service – a period commonly known as the minimum time to serve (MTS) – from the end of their Standard Initial Training Period (SITP). The exceptions to the 2½ year rule are Student Naval Nurses and Medical Technicians who must complete a minimum of 3 and 3½ years respectively from the end of the SITP before they are eligible to apply for Early Termination.

(3) The SITP varies across specialisations and is the theoretical aggregate of the time that a rating or other rank spends undergoing the various components of initial training, assuming a smooth flow through the system and including an element for leave. Dates of actual completion of training should not be used. It should be noted that, if the length of an SITP is reduced, ratings and other ranks within the respective specialisation(s) will also be able to use the reduced period in the calculation of the earliest date on which they can submit their notice. If a SITP is lengthened, ratings and other ranks will retain their shorter SITP period.

(4) Unlike the ROS for further career training, the MTS period cannot run concurrently with the notice period. An individual must complete the MTS period before they become eligible to apply for Early Termination. http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/~/media/royal navy responsive/documents/reference library/br 3/Br3book/ch53.pdf
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
The things you learn.
Yep, the reason AFCOs have to ask applicants and give them a drop copy of their attestation form (s3049) is basically because when they want out, disaffected individuals will swear blind their AFCO never told them they would serve a minimum of 4 or more years.

Selective amnesia is a common occurrence. Tiffs used to be the worst because they had a 48 month SITP and would always try to blag their way out after becoming qualified, without completing the 42 month RoS.
 

fishhead

War Hero
Can anybody advise whether The Royal Navy Terms of Service (Ratings) Regulations 2006 are applicable today?

If they are then there are some interesting sections in those regs that to my mind raise as many questions as they might answer. This business of establishing minimum terms of service seems like a minefield, that is it's a difficult area in which to find definitive answers, though I feel Ninja_Stoker's posts in this thread come very close to what is laid down in the 2006 Regulations as I (an unqualified layman) read them.

Frankly, I think it is a little strange to be seeking to establish minimum service periods when one is setting out on one's chosen career. Were I joining the Navy myself, I would be far more concerned with finding out how long I could be permitted to stay on in service than how short my service might be.
It may surprise you to know that some people join the services with the sole intention of obtaining qualifications that they would have to pay for in civilian life. Pilot is an obvious example. To discourage this activity a return of service is required to satisfy the taxpayer that your training was money well spent.
 
More to the point, the Armed Forces are one of the single biggest providers of trained Engineers (amongst other areas) to U.K. Businesses. We need to protect our investments.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
In truth, the main two most popular things people cite as reasons for joining are travel and transferable skills.

The 2006 Attestation Form remains valid for those who joined on the AFPS 2005 contract and remain on that contract. Those joining on the AFPS 2015 contract or switching to the 2015 contract switch to those terms and conditions of service.
 
Mmm, somehow << Roll on my SITP + RoS, then + 12 months notice period!>> seems no match for the shorter but oft-uttered expletive of << ROMFT!>...:(

Previously <<ROMFD!>> D = Doz =Dozen = 12 Year Engagement
 
... Tiffs used to be the worst because they had a 48 month SITP and would always try to blag their way out after becoming qualified, without completing the 42 month RoS.

Aye, I had some fun & games handling those baby Tiffs who played the 'Unhappy Junior' card/loophole, despite being over 18...

Those that were successful attracted a lot of also-rans, too.

Grrr & Spits.:cool:
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
Okay, thank you. I take it then that there is a newer set of Navy Terms of Service Regulations than the 2006 legislation? Perhaps it is the Br3 thing you mentioned earlier, Ninja_Stoker?
There is.

For those joining after 4 Sept 2016 the Standard Initial Training Period has been removed inasmuch as the Return of Service commences upon completion of Phase Two training. It's a subtle change which won't make much difference to anyone other than those who undergo phase three or taskbook training as the SITP used to add that period before the ROS began.

BR3, Chapter 53, article 5304 paragraph b (2) refers: http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/-/media...s/reference-library/br-3-vol-1/chapter-53.pdf
 

Sumo

War Hero
Aye, I had some fun & games handling those baby Tiffs who played the 'Unhappy Junior' card/loophole, despite being over 18...

Those that were successful attracted a lot of also-rans, too.

Grrr & Spits.:cool:


We had a very clever Tiff join us in CollingGrad A school when Mechs and Tiffs combined, Tiffs having done their sea trip.


He was trying to get kicked out by just bouncing along a 50% then fail the navy only courses so he looked like a failure and would be kicked out, then being able to claim his HNC to use to go to Uni, as he was stitched to the instructors he just did not seem to be able to fail any exams (pusser) His was clever enough to do just over 50% in an exam and not both to answer any more question. Whilst doing advanced Electronics he asked the schoolie if he could do A level math, A level maths failure rate whilstt on course was very high, he achieved an A*. on one Radar course his only input was to tell the instructor his massive equation he had put on the board was wrong, it did not balance?

Once we closed his exit route, he looked for another way out, go officer? Back then you left the navy for one, he had to convince a selection officer why he was should be allowed to go Officer, after leaving Collingrad never heard of him again just the rumour that he left to become an officer but did not return, and went to Uni?


Asked why he did not do A levels and excel at school, he thought he would get the navy to pay?
 

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