Return of service questions

hello_there

Lantern Swinger
#1
Ok, I understand that you must do at least the first 4 weeks, then up until the first 6 months you can give 2 weeks notice to leave. Its after the first 6 month that Im a little unsure of. Ive heard from some sources that it is 2.5 years, but others that it is 3.5 years.

Also is the return of service from the point when you finish basic training OR from the point when you finish professional training? I understand 12 month notice must be given at this stage, correct?

Another thing some sources say initial length of service will be 12 years yet others say 18 years?
 

squashedbanana

Lantern Swinger
#2
Ok, I understand that you must do at least the first 4 weeks, then up until the first 6 months you can give 2 weeks notice to leave. Its after the first 6 month that Im a little unsure of. Ive heard from some sources that it is 2.5 years, but others that it is 3.5 years.

Also is the return of service from the point when you finish basic training OR from the point when you finish professional training? I understand 12 month notice must be given at this stage, correct?

Another thing some sources say initial length of service will be 12 years yet others say 18 years?
You can claim discharge after 4 weeks service, up to your 6 month point, or 18th birthday, by giving 14 days notice.

After the 6 month point you're committed to serving for another 2.5 years before you can submit notice to leave. Then your Return of Service kicks in, which is another 12 months you must serve, after giving in your notice.

You're then liable for recall up to 6 years after your leaving date.

Initial career is 12 years, I read this is extendable to 20 years after promotion, not sure if this is promotion to Leading Hand or higher? Maybe someone else knows?


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hello_there

Lantern Swinger
#3
You can claim discharge after 4 weeks service, up to your 6 month point, or 18th birthday, by giving 14 days notice.

After the 6 month point you're committed to serving for another 2.5 years before you can submit notice to leave. Then your Return of Service kicks in, which is another 12 months you must serve, after giving in your notice.

You're then liable for recall up to 6 years after your leaving date.

Initial career is 12 years, I read this is extendable to 20 years after promotion, not sure if this is promotion to Leading Hand or higher? Maybe someone else knows?


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Ok thank you. Its just that I read somewhere that the 2.5 years kicks in after phase 2, not during?
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#5
Ok thank you. Its just that I read somewhere that the 2.5 years kicks in after phase 2, not during?
Correct. If you do not wrap before week 27 after joining, you must complete your Standard Initial Training Period (SITP) which varies between branches, then a Return of Service (30 months for most, 36 months for Student Nurses) before eligible to submit 12 months notice to quit.

The initial contract length is 12 years, extending to 20 years if you pass selection for leading rate before your 12th year.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#8
To be fair to those joining, they do need to know their terms & conditions of service & will be asked about it at interview. It is important those joining are aware of minimum timescales.
 
#11
Ok thank you. Its just that I read somewhere that the 2.5 years kicks in after phase 2, not during?

Correct. If you do not wrap before week 27 after joining, you must complete your Standard Initial Training Period (SITP).
Isn't week 27 mid-way through Phase 2? Or is it 27 weeks excluding the 10 weeks at Raleigh? - sorry for seeming pedantic!!



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Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#13
Are you sure it is complete your return of service, then 12 months notice? I'm pretty sure it's RoS including your notice period.
For Ratings, the minimum time to serve (MTS) = SITP + RoS, then + 12 months notice period.

SITP's by branch are listed here: (BR3 Chapter 7, article 0759) http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/~/media/royal navy responsive/documents/reference library/br 3/Br3book/ch07.pdf

The RoS criteria is outlined here (BR3 Chapter 53, article 5302, paragraph B)

BR3 said:
Ratings and Other Ranks

(1) All new recruits enlisting in the Naval Service, who have not previously so enlisted, have a statutory right to claim discharge within their first six months of service, provided that they have completed a minimum four weeks’ service (excluding leave periods and any forfeited service) from their date of entry, or until the day before their 18th birthday, if this comes after the end of the six month period.

(2) For ratings and other ranks, a ROS is required to consolidate an individual’s training and give a reasonable return on the investment made by the Service.

Having completed six months’ service, or reached the age of 18 (if this comes after the end of the six month period), and subject to the exceptions that follow, ratings and other ranks become eligible to submit an application for Early Termination on completion of a minimum of 2½ years’ service – a period commonly known as the minimum time to serve (MTS) – from the end of their Standard Initial Training Period (SITP). The exceptions to the 2½ year rule are Student Naval Nurses and Medical Technicians who must complete a minimum of 3 and 3½ years respectively from the end of the SITP before they are eligible to apply for Early Termination.

(3) The SITP varies across specialisations and is the theoretical aggregate of the time that a rating or other rank spends undergoing the various components of initial training, assuming a smooth flow through the system and including an element for leave. Dates of actual completion of training should not be used. It should be noted that, if the length of an SITP is reduced, ratings and other ranks within the respective specialisation(s) will also be able to use the reduced period in the calculation of the earliest date on which they can submit their notice. If a SITP is lengthened, ratings and other ranks will retain their shorter SITP period.

(4) Unlike the ROS for further career training, the MTS period cannot run concurrently with the notice period. An individual must complete the MTS period before they become eligible to apply for Early Termination. http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/~/media/royal navy responsive/documents/reference library/br 3/Br3book/ch53.pdf
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#15
Yep, the reason AFCOs have to ask applicants and give them a drop copy of their attestation form (s3049) is basically because when they want out, disaffected individuals will swear blind their AFCO never told them they would serve a minimum of 4 or more years.

Selective amnesia is a common occurrence. Tiffs used to be the worst because they had a 48 month SITP and would always try to blag their way out after becoming qualified, without completing the 42 month RoS.
 
#16
Can anybody advise whether The Royal Navy Terms of Service (Ratings) Regulations 2006 are applicable today?

If they are then there are some interesting sections in those regs that to my mind raise as many questions as they might answer. This business of establishing minimum terms of service seems like a minefield, that is it's a difficult area in which to find definitive answers, though I feel Ninja_Stoker's posts in this thread come very close to what is laid down in the 2006 Regulations as I (an unqualified layman) read them.

Frankly, I think it is a little strange to be seeking to establish minimum service periods when one is setting out on one's chosen career. Were I joining the Navy myself, I would be far more concerned with finding out how long I could be permitted to stay on in service than how short my service might be.
It may surprise you to know that some people join the services with the sole intention of obtaining qualifications that they would have to pay for in civilian life. Pilot is an obvious example. To discourage this activity a return of service is required to satisfy the taxpayer that your training was money well spent.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#18
In truth, the main two most popular things people cite as reasons for joining are travel and transferable skills.

The 2006 Attestation Form remains valid for those who joined on the AFPS 2005 contract and remain on that contract. Those joining on the AFPS 2015 contract or switching to the 2015 contract switch to those terms and conditions of service.
 
#19
Mmm, somehow << Roll on my SITP + RoS, then + 12 months notice period!>> seems no match for the shorter but oft-uttered expletive of << ROMFT!>...:(

Previously <<ROMFD!>> D = Doz =Dozen = 12 Year Engagement
 
#20
... Tiffs used to be the worst because they had a 48 month SITP and would always try to blag their way out after becoming qualified, without completing the 42 month RoS.
Aye, I had some fun & games handling those baby Tiffs who played the 'Unhappy Junior' card/loophole, despite being over 18...

Those that were successful attracted a lot of also-rans, too.

Grrr & Spits.:cool:
 

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