Refused by the Doc on pre join medical

#1
Hi guys I know what most peoples thoughts are on cannabis but please hear me out with an open mind. I am 26 and kicked a cannabis habit after 10 years of being stupid, I am now clear for 6 months with no chance what so ever to even touch the cr*p again, I applied for the RN 6 weeks ago, passed RT, passed eye test, passed medical apart from admitting to the Doc I smoked it. The Doc told me I done extremely well on all parts of the medical but due to me telling her I quit cannabis 6 months ago she can't let me in as it is not 4 years.

The only way I will be able to re-apply in the future is with regular urine tests for the next 4 years, so I phoned my doctor to ask how I would go about getting regular testing over the next 4 years to which he advised me it would not be possible to do through the NHS and to go private would cost alot of money for that amount of testing. Has anyone heard of this situation before or know of any way around her decision. I know that my own honesty has cost me a chance to serve in the RN but thought I was doing the right thing as they like honesty, Is there anyone in a high posistion that could possibly over ride her decision. I am willing to pay for regular tests for the next year to prove to them I am free from it.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#2
The issue has nothing to do with honesty, it's to do with medical suitability & that can only be definitively advised by a qualified medical examiner.

The wisdom of employing a long-term habitual recreational drugs user in a job that involves weapons & the potential to work in a mutually life-threatening environment would certainly become an issue beyond the medical examination.

The experts state the following:

Frank said:
Cannabis can mess with your mind

  • Cannabis can freak you out - it can cause feelings of anxiety, suspicion, panic and paranoia.

  • For people with illnesses such as schizophrenia, cannabis can cause a serious relapse.

  • Regular cannabis use is known to be associated with an increase in the risk of later developing psychotic illnesses including schizophrenia; and if you have a family background of mental illness, you may also have an increased risk.


  • Cannabis can affect the way the brain works. Regular, heavy use makes it difficult to learn and concentrate and research has linked cannabis use to poor exam results. This is a potentially serious risk if you’re young, when the brain is still developing. People who take a lot of cannabis can also find they lack motivation.

  • A recent review of cannabis research published in the British Medical Journal found those driving under the influence of cannabis had nearly double the risk of a crash.
Cannabis can mess with your body.

  • Smoking cannabis can make asthma worse, and cause wheezing in non-asthma sufferers.


  • It can increase the heart rate and affect blood pressure, which can be especially harmful for those with heart disease.

  • It is reported that frequent use of cannabis may affect fertility. It can cut a man's sperm count and can suppress ovulation in women.

  • If you’re pregnant, smoking cannabis may increase the risk of your baby being born smaller than expected.
What is the effect of mixing cannabis and alcohol?
Mixing cannabis with alcohol can have particularly serious consequences - the accident rate is 16 times higher than for cannabis or alcohol alone.



Cannabis | FRANK

It maybe worth having a chat with the other arms of the service with regard employability prospects, but a Doctor is highly unlikely to have their decision overturned in such instances.

Good luck.
 

sgtpepperband

War Hero
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#3
The RN doesn't need any potheads joining up.

We've got enough to keep us busy for now, thank you... :wink:

It could've been worse, shippers. You could've confessed to your muscle stimulant and protein shake addiction - far more dangerous!!
 
A

angrydoc

Guest
#6
All 3 Services have the same standard regarding illegal drug use.

You cannot appeal this decision (well, you can, but it will be thrown out very quickly).
 

Purple_twiglet

War Hero
Moderator
#7
Had you said 'I took it once or twice' I may have had some sympathy.

You took it for 10 years, and now expect us to believe you are clean after 6 months? Sorry, but I don't buy that.

I don't want you near anything where you could have responsibility for other peoples lives - the armed forces are not a place for serial ex smackheads.
 
#9
Had you said 'I took it once or twice' I may have had some sympathy.

You took it for 10 years, and now expect us to believe you are clean after 6 months? Sorry, but I don't buy that.

I don't want you near anything where you could have responsibility for other peoples lives - the armed forces are not a place for serial ex smackheads.
*pedantic mode on*

He is not an ex-smackhead. Cannabis isn't smack.

*pedantic mode off*
 

sgtpepperband

War Hero
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#11
...I don't want you near anything where you could have responsibility for other peoples lives - the armed forces are not a place for serial ex smackheads.
But it is a place for those who habitually abuse alcohol during working hours (i.e. extended lunch hours, mess functions) at the expense of wasted man hours (adrift due to baggy heads or hiding themselves for hours to avoid being seen)? While my personal views about some narcotic substances might be contrary to that of the Service, I am a realist when it comes to the hypocrisy of the Service policy towards drugs and alcohol.

Despite my previous joke regarding potheads, my personal experience of those that use it is much more pleasant than dealing with those who are smashed out of their faces on booze - whether in uniform or civvies, on board and ashore. And given the RN cultural endorsement of using alcohol to help grease the palms of some - such as CTPs or official mess functions, where those who do not wish to embarrass themselves by drinking until they are unconscious or partake in childish drinking games are frowned upon, as though their moral standards are signs of weakness displays of disloyalty - I think it needs to wake up and face the realities of today's culture (which we are supposed to represent, of course).

I have known - and been instrumental in investigating - some good people who have admitted to using social drugs. Their behaviour or performance was not affected, but they were caught and discharged through circumstantial circumstances. Had an alternative to the "zero tolerance" policy been taken in such cases, the RN's and the individuals' best interests would've been served (druge users = dismissed with a criminal record and loss of benefits; alcoholics = retained for counselling and rehabilitation). And in comparison, substance abuse in the Army is significantly higher, and they only operate in the spirit of "zero tolerance" in some cases.

Please do not consider that I am encouraging people to start using drugs, but before the RN claims that all druggies are bad (and thus unworthy of their services), it needs to get its own house in order first.
 
#12
6 months after a 10 year habit is something to be proud of on a personal level but in the grand scheme of things is not really going to fill any recruiter with confidence.

Not going to create another thread but on the same subject of pre joining medical, I nearly got myself denied due to having migraines in the past, luckily I said it were 5 years ago (which it were) but the doc acted quite concerned and questioned me intensively on it.

Not saying it's wrong or right but it did surprise me that anyone having suffered Migraines in the past 5 years would get rejected, fortunately I'm 25 and a little more sensible than when I was younger, around the time I went to the docs for migraines was around the time I was skipping school... Wonder how many young people do things without realising potential impact.
 

sgtpepperband

War Hero
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#13
Agree, Halifax. To be unaware of the consequences during adolescent experimentation is one thing, but it seems one or two people are quick to ridicule the OP in a self-righteous manner, without knowing the full story. The guy has tried to join up, was rejected on medical grounds and was seeking advice about how to overturn this decision - he wasn't looking for a sociological lecture on the rights and wrongs of what he has done with his life! People in glass houses, eh..? :roll:
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#14
Not saying it's wrong or right but it did surprise me that anyone having suffered Migraines in the past 5 years would get rejected, fortunately I'm 25 and a little more sensible than when I was younger, around the time I went to the docs for migraines was around the time I was skipping school... Wonder how many young people do things without realising potential impact.
I had my entry delayed by by 12 months after declaring I'd had a migraine prior to joining. Whilst bitterly disappointed at the time, with the benefit of hindsight from a service perspective, if I couldn't do my job due to migraine, then someone else would have to do it.

With regards the rights & wrongs of long term legal or recreational drugs use, the service medical professionals call the shots at that stage.

Rest assured however I've interviewed & rejected a fair few whose lifestyle is totally incompatible with the service, be it through drink, drugs or just plain old lunacy.
 
#15
I had my entry delayed by by 12 months after declaring I'd had a migraine prior to joining. Whilst bitterly disappointed at the time, with the benefit of hindsight from a service perspective, if I couldn't do my job due to migraine, then someone else would have to do it.

With regards the rights & wrongs of long term legal or recreational drugs use, the service medical professionals call the shots at that stage.

Rest assured however I've interviewed & rejected a fair few whose lifestyle is totally incompatible with the service, be it through drink, drugs or just plain old lunacy.
Why 5 years migraine free though? If I hadn't had one for 2 years and even prior to that they were only very sporadic why would that be an issue? I can understand someone still or recently suffering as with migraines you're basically useless. The 5 year benchmark just made no sense to me, also if it was declared does it get looked into further or is it just cut and dry? I'm just thankful that I haven't had anything for years otherwise I'd have been severely disappointed right now.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#16
Why 5 years migraine free though?

The 5 year benchmark just made no sense to me, also if it was declared does it get looked into further or is it just cut and dry? I'm just thankful that I haven't had anything for years otherwise I'd have been severely disappointed right now.
Dunno, it's a medical expert thingy. When you fill out the medical questionnaire, you also complete a consent form for the release of your medical records should anything need checking.

Suffice to say the Medical Standards for Entry state the following conditions are a bar to entry:

Medical Standards said:
Psychiatric disorders

Ongoing psychiatric illness. Psychosis. Schizophrenia. Obsessive-compulsive disorder. Autism. Personality disorder. More than one episode of deliberate self-harm of any type. Post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Alcohol, drug or substance dependence. Attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) unless free of symptoms and not requiring treatment for at least three years. Anorexia and bulimia.

Neurological disorders

Ongoing nervous system disease. Epilepsy or more than one seizure/fit after the age of five (although benign Rolandic epilepsy is acceptable). Single seizure/fit within the last ten years. Multiple sclerosis. Complications following head injury. Hydrocephalus (with or without shunt). Severe or recurrent headache (including migraine).
Medical Standards for Entry - Guidance notes
 
#17
Dunno, it's a medical expert thingy. When you fill out the medical questionnaire, you also complete a consent form for the release of your medical records should anything need checking.

Suffice to say the Medical Standards for Entry state the following conditions are a bar to entry:



Medical Standards for Entry - Guidance notes
On one of the forms I filled in it said anyone with kidney stones in the last 2 years was automatically not able to enter, any idea why this would be? I had them just over 2 years ago and I've had nothing related to them since, in fact the day I left the hospital was the last pain, side effect etc that I had.

It's amazing how many things come into play that you wouldn't even consider detrimental.
 

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