Rating pilots. Time to bring them back?

D

Deleted 113170

Guest
In 91 I was still helping to reassemble and test the wiring circuits on SeaKing for the special weapon.

All very well and good until we had finished one of the larger plugs on the Observers console and realised that we hadn't fitted the backshell to the plug assembly.
Proves the point that officer level back seat drivers need to be intelligent to know how to put that back in reasonable working order.
 

slim

War Hero
Information about it freely available on Wikipedia.

On my last 2 ships, (mid 90's), I was the Air Weapons bloke - my handling and prep courses for the torpedoes, DCs and missiles did not include the nuclear depth bomb as it was no longer in service.
In fact, one of my first jobs was to remove the fittings for the monitoring equipment for "the bomb" from the Air Weapons magazine as it was no longer required.

I'm guessing there must be another reason for 2 officers in helicopters...
The Fleet Air Arm is the most exclusive flying club of all three services.
Only occifers are allowed to fly RN Aircraft (and chef pilots) .
I don't know about modern helicopters as ships Lynx helos only had a local aircrew (part of the ships flight) However most real rating aircrew on Wasps were able to fly (not officially) the angry palm tree. Stand fast pretend aircrew (missile aimers).
 

redmonkey

War Hero
Book Reviewer
Proves the point that officer level back seat drivers need to be intelligent to know how to put that back in reasonable working order.
I don't think you know what you are talking about.
The Observer will not ever touch the parts of the equipment that we forgot to put the back shell on as it is tucked away in the back of a console.
As the system was a special system it would also be inspected and tested numerous times but different engineers before it is signed off as serviceable.
The only time an officer would come anywhere near it would be if, and its a very big IF, that aircraft was selected to be loaded with a special weapon, either for drill or for real.

I don't have the knowledge to go further into the drill for this and I don't think it is an appropriate place either.

I know for a fact you would not be able to place it back in working order.
 
I don't think you know what you are talking about.
The Observer will not ever touch the parts of the equipment that we forgot to put the back shell on as it is tucked away in the back of a console.
As the system was a special system it would also be inspected and tested numerous times but different engineers before it is signed off as serviceable.
The only time an officer would come anywhere near it would be if, and its a very big IF, that aircraft was selected to be loaded with a special weapon, either for drill or for real.

I don't have the knowledge to go further into the drill for this and I don't think it is an appropriate place either.

I know for a fact you would not be able to place it back in working order.
It was a time consuming ball ache!!! :(
 
During my RNA duties I received a call from an ex RN chap regarding something he had for the branch. I arranged to pop over to his place and we had a good chat. Turns out he was a Rating Pilot right at the end of the war, he did his training in Canada, qualified and got his wings then the war ended. He was told there was no more need for him and he could become a maintainer or leave, he left. He was very bitter and twisted still.
 

redmonkey

War Hero
Book Reviewer
Not all cabs fly with 2 officers.
I have known a cab to fly with 1 pilot and one CPO AEM.
This was from a downbird back to CU. The CPO was a flying Maintainer and left hand seat qualified.

I've also been the only other person in a cab in flight before and at times have more flights in a month than most aircrew. This being explained by carrying out a compass swing and being in the back doing the calibration.

As to the suggestion of one to steer it and one to stop bits falling off, the main cause of bits falling off has been the aircrew, usually officers.
 

WreckerL

War Hero
Super Moderator
I think you are all just rising to the bait lanky throws out, there doesn't seem to be an awful lot he actually is knowledgeable about. He's not stated why he feels the need for rating pilots to come back, or, indeed, the point of this thread.

In fact he contradicts himself (surprise, surprise) by stating that only officers have the intelligence to operate aircraft. he's obviously not met some of the officers I have, some of whom the operation of a pencil sharpener is the height of their mechanical ability, and that without risk to themselves.
 

Waspie

War Hero
Just to clarify things up to the point I left in 92. Officer pilots were in cockpits because the RN deemed us ratings couldn't issue an executive order to fire live weapons.

EG! As a airborne missile aimer I required an officer, (pilot), to give me the command to fire on a target. I identified the target, had it in my sights, hand on the firing mechanism, (T10K controller), but could not fire a missile on my own volition!

When firing GPMG's from the back, again, the pilot/captain of the aircraft gave the executive command to 'fire'. One could not fire a weapon without that executive order.

In Lynx, one pilot one observer. (2 Officers). The pilot flew, the Obs was the tactician who using the Lynx' sensors saw the threat and operating under strict ROE made the assessment to fire. A rating could not.

The Army operate under totally different guidelines.

The above is how I recall the rules, maybe one of the sites ex front seaters could clarify or say my comments are crap, either way we may find out the truth. if it changed after 92 - No idea!!

PS, Don't bother replying directly to my comment Lanky cos your blocked/ignored!!!!
 

SONAR-BENDER

War Hero
All very well and good until we had finished one of the larger plugs on the Observers console and realised that we hadn't fitted the backshell to the plug assembly.
Been there, done that with 120 wire Towed Array cable. For extra shyte and giggles, the box was high up in the extreme after end of the boat's machinery spaces, where it was redders.

My how I laughed.
 
It's all covered in great detail across on PPRuNe for those inclined to have a look and, without wishing to be sidetracked into a convoluted trip down Memory Lane, I'll simply like to mention that the Army Air Corps (aka Teeny Weeny Airways :eek:) have not dropped their minimum rank for *pilots* to the equivalent of private. What has changed is simply that those of that rank may now *apply* for flying training, followed by subsequent promotion on successful completion.

Jack
This is where I got my information from- from the AAC’s official Twitter page on 01/02/22. Guessing it must be bad phrasing then.

Also: https://www.forces.net/news/british-army-lowers-minimum-rank-become-helicopter-pilot
 

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