racist??

[lauralovestodig]

While on a visit to HMS collingwood, during a lecture, we were told by a
Lt Commander that... and i quote

'muslim people will never join the Navy because all they have been raised to do is work in shops and have lots of children'

racism?

amongst a group of potential warfare officers i was the only one who took offence

 

[Passed-over_Loggie]

No.

 

[stumpy]

Such a comment is totally unacceptable, as well as being untrue.

 

[lauralovestodig]

more concerning that the potential officers, many of which had already passed thier AIB, leaped to his defence when i dared to suggest he was wrong to voice this opinion... or more importantly to think this.
i did notice he did a quick scan of the room to see who his audience was before becoming so outspoken!

 

[higthepig]

He must have been in all week and hasnt met a serving muslim, is there not a supply Admiral? I may be wrong.He`s out of order anyway.

 

[dondon]

more concerning that the potential officers, many of which had already passed thier AIB, leaped to his defence when i dared to suggest he was wrong to voice this opinion... or more importantly to think this.
i did notice he did a quick scan of the room to see who his audience was before becoming so outspoken!

Well you do have to be carefull, sorry ,

 

[Greenie]

more concerning that the potential officers, many of which had already passed thier AIB, leaped to his defence when i dared to suggest he was wrong to voice this opinion... or more importantly to think this.
i did notice he did a quick scan of the room to see who his audience was before becoming so outspoken!

The two and a half was probably fishing ---------- and you took the bait. :lol: :lol: and obviously swallowed the hook .

 

[lauralovestodig]

rather have taken the bait than not stood up for what i believe in... just because i want to be an officer should i sell my soul to kiss up to Lt ass?

 

[angrydoc]

Not a terribly bright comment to make, especially in current climate. However, I doubt if it was meant in anything but jest. Even Lt Cdrs have a Jack sense of humour...

 

[Always_a_Civvy]

The statement is clearly bigoted in the way the speaker stereotypes those who have chosen the Muslim lifestyle. It is not racist however. Islam is not a racial identity but a lifestyle choice, like Christianity or Marxism.

 

[Passed-over_Loggie]

Greenie is right; he was probably provoking reaction and debate. The presentation was clearly extreme but was there a partial truth there? We know that Muslims are underrepresented in the Forces proportional to their share of our population. Do they have a cultural aversion to serving under our flag? It can't be an version to military service, otherwise the Pakistani and Bangladeshi Navy, Army and Air Forces would be a fraction of their actual size.

If the 2 and a half was stereotyping, then certainly DG Log (Fleet) doesn't match it. Anybody who has attended a meeting with him will know what I mean. A very sharp man and just what we need.

If nothing else, the Lt Cdr probably drew out the thin skinned and black and white thinkers.

 

[Always_a_Civvy]

Greenie is right; he was probably provoking reaction and debate. The presentation was clearly extreme but was there a partial truth there? We know that Muslims are underrepresented in the Forces proportional to their share of our population. Do they have a cultural aversion to serving under our flag? It can't be an version to military service, otherwise the Pakistani and Bangladeshi Navy, Army and Air Forces would be a fraction of their actual size.

If the 2 and a half was stereotyping, then certainly DG Log (Fleet) doesn't match it. Anybody who has attended a meeting with him will know what I mean. A very sharp man and just what we need.

If nothing else, the Lt Cdr probably drew out the thin skinned and black and white thinkers.

Whilst I agree that Greenie may well be right, I still contend that the assertion was both provocative and bigoted. The danger that arises from incautious remarks of this nature is if they are overheard or their contents become more widely known beyond the original recipients (as we have become acquainted with it through this thread) there is a significant risk of damaging the reputation of the RN not only amongst potential Muslim recruits thinking about joining the Service, but also very sensitive politicians, ready to exploit this kind of thing for their own agenda. The Lt.Cdr. in question ought to be repremanded for behaviour likely to bring the Service into disrepute. It is bad enough for Jack to do it. For an Officer to do so is far more serious. Why give the Labour Party ammunition to attack the Navy?

Steve.

 

[Lingyai]

rather have taken the bait than not stood up for what i believe in... just because i want to be an officer should i sell my soul to kiss up to Lt ass?

As a young officer, you will have to kiss ass a lot more and put up with a lot more shit in the years to come. If you are sensitive to a comment like this then maybe a career in a "fluffier" job might be more appropriate? Thicker skin will be needed for the senior service.

 

[RoofRat]

FFS we wouldn't be having this conversation if wasn't for the PC brigade.
I served with Black, white, chinese, asian of all sects and religions, and none of them had any issues with the general banter that is "Jack's". In fact most even had their own retalitory remarks!!
Its the ongoing search for "PC offences" by the likes of Lauralovesadig that allows this shite to continue.
BTW before I'm called a racist, on my mantle are two Christmas cards from a Sikh and a Muslim friend, celebrating my Religious festival of Christs birth.
RoofRat

 

[FlagWagger]

FFS we wouldn't be having this conversation if wasn't for the PC brigade.
I served with Black, white, chinese, asian of all sects and religions, and none of them had any issues with the general banter that is "Jack's". In fact most even had their own retalitory remarks!!

On holiday about 12 years ago, I visited Hong Kong. In order to something other than the bars of Wanchai we went on one of those organised site-seeing bus tours. Our guide introduced himself, then asked the group to tell him our names, which we all duly did - he then thanked us and apologised that he wouldn't be able to remember them all because we Westernets all looked the same to him!

Was anyone offended? No. But I bet that if something similar was said over here there'd be millions of pounds spent on court cases and counselling

 

[slim]

Political correctness is ruining the country.
A remark does not have to be always construed to be racist just because it is about colour creed or race. It depends very much on the way the remark is presented. Is it done with a smile in a light hearted manner? Or is it obviously a derogatory snide comment?
In the present climate it seems that only ethnic minorities may make ethnic jokes. The Kumars at number 61 or whatever number is an obvious example, a funny program taking the p!ss out of stereotyped Indian values but presented by an all Indian cast.
In the pre PC days there were many funny programs on television, Alf Garnet, On the buses, Love thy Neighbour, Rising Damp and many more. These programs are no longer shown though many people of all colours and religions would like to watch them again and took no offence at their content.
Time for a return to the old values.

 

[Jim30]

Am I the only person who finds this whole thread a little suspect?
Person turns up, first post is to start a hugely provocative thread with potential for media interest and career assasination. Title of the poster is "loves to dig".

For my sake Laura, could you tell me exactly what course you were on, which building in Collingwood you were in when this was said please.

 

[finknottle]

Whether meant in jest or not and I choose to think it was not, comments like that could cost this fool his career.

 

[Nutty]

Unless this particular Lt Cmd. had it in writing that he should make a fairly innocuous but clearly racist, in the current climate, remark to test the reaction of the class then the man is a cnut and it would worry me if he was my leader.

Than again if your current Admiral of Asian extraction is Chief RN Loggie then perhaps he got the bit about shop keepers correct.

Oh! perhap that is not PC either.

Nutty

 

[Seadog]

Jim asked

Am I the only person who finds this whole thread a little suspect?

No Jim, I do. Seems unlikely outside 'role play' diversity/debate senarios. However if 'lauralovestodig' has a genuine complaint, there are avenues through which she can complain. I suggest she takes one of them, with witnesses. RR isn't one of them.

Rear Admiral Hussain is indeed highly regarded (and he is an engineer).