Quick Officer question regarding grades

lonestar

War Hero
Thenzon said:
yeah i would of thought it would be a sort of filtering system and then they will look at the degree / background education for them to process further

No, it is not a CV based application. Your performance is assessed face to face at the Admiralty Interview Board.
 

Teutonic_Taffy

Lantern Swinger
Thenzon said:
yeah i would of thought it would be a sort of filtering system and then they will look at the degree / background education for them to process further

In a way, yes, inasmuch as the AIB is the filter system. To use a crap analogy, your degree buys you a ticket to the dancefloor, but you have to strut your moves yourself.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
IS-Potential said:
Just a bit of feedback if anyone working within the careers offices reads this (N_S?)

Good point. Got a meeting with the head honcho in this area coming up soon, so will give the feedback, with regard the brevity of Officer factsheets.

To be honest, my personal view is that we have got serious problems with too few people passing AIB - think it's down to about 30% at present.

There are a variety of possible causes for this, partly because a lot of educational establishments offer truly crap careers advice - they are more focused on generating revenue by creating value-less qualifications rather than preparing people for the workplace as well as educating them with regard pertinent qualifications.

For out part, my thoughts are that the RN (not AIB themselves) assumes too much with regard Officer candidates. Yes, there's an AIB DVD (very good too) and there is a page or so on the RN website about AIB, an out of date AIB leaflet & that's it. There is no single point of reference offering comprehensive guidance for Officer applicants - ACLOs will relate their experience of AIB "x amount" of years ago, Careers Advisers don't even visit the AIB or witness one, let alone get taught very much on the subject on the CA3 course or Careers Advisers Update Briefs, so everything is shrouded in mist, myth & secrecy - an archaic outward perception that unless you're in the "secret circle" or funny handshake gang, you ain't privy to what happens.

The thing that irks me the most is the very lazy attitude often heard in AFCOs: "Potential Officers should take the initiative, use their officer-like qualities & find out themselves rather than expect all the answers". It's almost as inane a comment as those writing a report using the generic lazy phrase: "Not enough attention to detail" Aaargh, typical old-school FOST logic - the retort being "specifically where?".

That said, I did like the following quote :wink:

Teutonic_Taffy said:
To use a crap analogy, your degree buys you a ticket to the dancefloor, but you have to strut your moves yourself.
 

IS-Potential

Lantern Swinger
Ninja_Stoker said:
Good point. Got a meeting with the head honcho in this area coming up soon, so will give the feedback, with regard the brevity of Officer factsheets.

To be honest, my personal view is that we have got serious problems with too few people passing AIB - think it's down to about 30% at present.

There are a variety of possible causes for this, partly because a lot of educational establishments offer truly crap careers advice - they are more focused on generating revenue by creating value-less qualifications rather than preparing people for the workplace as well as educating them with regard pertinent qualifications.

For out part, my thoughts are that the RN (not AIB themselves) assumes too much with regard Officer candidates. Yes, there's an AIB DVD (very good too) and there is a page or so on the RN website about AIB, an out of date AIB leaflet & that's it. There is no single point of reference offering comprehensive guidance for Officer applicants - ACLOs will relate their experience of AIB "x amount" of years ago, Careers Advisers don't even visit the AIB or witness one, let alone get taught very much on the subject on the CA3 course or Careers Advisers Update Briefs, so everything is shrouded in mist, myth & secrecy - an archaic outward perception that unless you're in the "secret circle" or funny handshake gang, you ain't privy to what happens.

The thing that irks me the most is the very lazy attitude often heard in AFCOs: "Potential Officers should take the initiative, use their officer-like qualities & find out themselves rather than expect all the answers". It's almost as inane a comment as those writing a report using the generic lazy phrase: "Not enough attention to detail" Aaargh, typical old-school FOST logic - the retort being "specifically where?".

Another point is that the IS leaflet seems to be a reworded WE leaflet, and its a lot more brief than the previous IS leaflet that actually had information within it.

Thanks though, hopefully if someone in the future wants IS information or the chance to talk to someone within IS they can get the opportunity.
 

Toucan

Lantern Swinger
Ninja_Stoker said:
To be honest, my personal view is that we have got serious problems with too few people passing AIB - think it's down to about 30% at present.

There are a variety of possible causes for this, partly because a lot of educational establishments offer truly crap careers advice - they are more focused on generating revenue by creating value-less qualifications rather than preparing people for the workplace as well as educating them with regard pertinent qualifications.
Are you at liberty to tell us at which point candidates tend to fail at AIB? Is it as general as those who pass excel in all areas and those who fail are mediocre in all areas? Perhaps a "you've either got it or you haven't" style problem?
 

IS-Potential

Lantern Swinger
Toucan said:
Ninja_Stoker said:
To be honest, my personal view is that we have got serious problems with too few people passing AIB - think it's down to about 30% at present.

There are a variety of possible causes for this, partly because a lot of educational establishments offer truly crap careers advice - they are more focused on generating revenue by creating value-less qualifications rather than preparing people for the workplace as well as educating them with regard pertinent qualifications.
Are you at liberty to tell us at which point candidates tend to fail at AIB? Is it as general as those who pass excel in all areas and those who fail are mediocre in all areas? Perhaps a "you've either got it or you haven't" style problem?

Essay seems to be the main one, there are several ways to write one, plus people tend to forget to answer the question and waffle.

Also lack of persona during PLTs and Plan Ex lets people down a lot, if you are timid and shy you are on a hiding to nothing. Plus people seem to shut off and it is very easy to blind yourself to other solutions, which are staring you in the face.

I also found the bleep test harder than the PJFT run, mainly due to the different style of running and I thought I was marked as out when I still had a strike left.
 
Several points there:

1) You may have found it difficult to find and talk to an IS Officer because there are so few of them, and those that are, are often dispersed across the place doing jobs, a few sea going billets, but predominantly working getting Information Systems to the fleet in my experience.

2) The leaflet was almost certainly a re-worded WE leaflet because frankly IS is a WE sub-spec, they come under the branch for pretty much everything, they report to the WEO on board, and I can see a time in the near future (as has been debated on RR in the past, it has been some time since I last logged on!) where IS will be swallowed up by WE.

3) The AIB, I asked alot of questions prior to the AIB, it is our nature to try and find out more about the unknown, and it helps that it really winds up the old and bold when the people who will be their relief, (in some cases) ask lots of what they deem trivial questions.

I think that overall across the current schooling system less emphasis is placed on creating a well thought out logical essay, and having seen the writing of some of my peers (and on occasions my writing is very poor) it is not being taught to a high enough standard. For the essay keep it simple, and remember beginning-highlight the problem, middle-identify options, end-conclude.

Lots of people over complicate the interview, remember you are the expert on the subject they are questioning (YOU!), so you should be able to easily answer their questions, of which none of them are trick questions, answer honestly and to the best of your knowledge.

Do I think that there is enough information about the AIB? Well, I knew what the format would be, I knew in what order I would sit the exams, and the video told me how the PLTs would go. However, we still want to know more, I think even if the RN pushed out more information about the AIB, you would still have lots of questions posted here.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
Potential_Officer said:
Several points there:

1) You may have found it difficult to find and talk to an IS Officer because there are so few of them, and those that are, are often dispersed across the place doing jobs, a few sea going billets, but predominantly working getting Information Systems to the fleet in my experience.

2) The leaflet was almost certainly a re-worded WE leaflet because frankly IS is a WE sub-spec, they come under the branch for pretty much everything, they report to the WEO on board, and I can see a time in the near future (as has been debated on RR in the past, it has been some time since I last logged on!) where IS will be swallowed up by WE.

3) The AIB, I asked alot of questions prior to the AIB, it is our nature to try and find out more about the unknown, and it helps that it really winds up the old and bold when the people who will be their relief, (in some cases) ask lots of what they deem trivial questions.

I think that overall across the current schooling system less emphasis is placed on creating a well thought out logical essay, and having seen the writing of some of my peers (and on occasions my writing is very poor) it is not being taught to a high enough standard. For the essay keep it simple, and remember beginning-highlight the problem, middle-identify options, end-conclude.

Lots of people over complicate the interview, remember you are the expert on the subject they are questioning (YOU!), so you should be able to easily answer their questions, of which none of them are trick questions, answer honestly and to the best of your knowledge.

Do I think that there is enough information about the AIB? Well, I knew what the format would be, I knew in what order I would sit the exams, and the video told me how the PLTs would go. However, we still want to know more, I think even if the RN pushed out more information about the AIB, you would still have lots of questions posted here.

Good post Potential_Officer. Like the cut of your jib - some good pointers for those that follow.
 
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