Question re old Articifer Apprentice rate.


War Hero
I had a mate at school who joined up as one of these, late 70's (Probably '78) but he opted out because a GI kept beasting his Class on the Raleigh 'Assault' Course! :lol:
My question though; was their part one at Raleigh then trade training at Sultan or elsewhere and did they waer a smally PO type rig as my memory insists they did, rather than a normal Jack rig.
And finally did they on completion of all courses get made up to LH or PO?
Thanks for any help.
Confused of NZ.


War Hero
Cheers Johne.
I always thought what a silly sod he was, for a enduring a bit of pain he'd have had a great start he'd hjave had in the RN.
Even more suprised when I saw the course at Raleigh after doing the RM one several times. :? :wink:


War Hero
Re: Question re old Artificer Apprentice rate.

I joined in '77 as A/A became OEA/A (later WEA/A)

One year HMS Fisgard (across the road from Raleigh)
One year Collingwood
One year Sea Training (employed as a WEM on a ship)
Back to Collingwood for about 18 months, rated LH
Drafted to a unit (ship or shore) then advanced to PO

Issued with Senior Rate's style rig from joining

Similar style career path for MEA and AEA but with some differences after Fisgard


War Hero
johne said:
Yes Po type rig and then straight to P.O.

Cap badge was similar to PO but without laurels and was red if I remember correctly. Some training done at Sultan and some at HMS Cochrane near Rosyth. Good number to give up. Met some GIs in the 60s and some frightening buggers, but not really cruel, just an appearance of it.


Lantern Swinger
Joined Fisgard as an artificer apprentice in 1966 for a 1 year part one training.
Uniform number one was fore & aft rig Serge suit with black buttons.Cap badge was red.

On completion of part one exams & trade tests , in the last few weeks of that year you got a new number one doeskin rig with brass buttons. Cap badge still red.

My part two was at Caledonia, for 2 years 8 months, still as apprentice, with same no. one rig,same red cap badge

First sea draft was still an apprentice , still same no one rig.

On being rated to Leading rate( after about 9 months),you still wore the same no. one rig , red cap badge.No distinguishing rate badege at all.

About 9 months later having passed Fleet board , rated PO,
Same no. one suit , with PO buttons on lower edge of jacket sleeve, and PO cap badge.

About another 18 months having passed Fleet board, rated CPO, same no one suit , CPO badge and cuff buttons

Some GI threw thunder flashes at us ,on our assault course( at Raleigh) because he thought we could move faster--- we did!


War Hero
That's some fast track promotion route, still I bet you earned it.
Thinking on it my school mate probably joined in '77 at 16 1/2-17, would that age be right for AA?


NZ_Bootneck said:
That's some fast track promotion route, still I bet you earned it.

Not that far off what some AETs are acheiving now with the requirement for LAETs!!

NZ_Bootneck said:
Thinking on it my school mate probably joined in '77 at 16 1/2-17, would that age be right for AA?

Yep, you could join if you were 16, up to 21 (if I remember corectly), although you could apply for an age waver if over that age; I have a lad of 24 in my entry.

Deleted 2913

Sep 83 joined Raleigh A/A (Arfificer Aprentice)
Jan84-Dec85 Collingwood WEA/A
Jan-Dec 86 Sea Time WEA/A
Jan87-Jan88 Collingwood LWEA
Apr 88 Rated A/POWEA prior to Sea Draft
Apr 89 Rated POWEA
May 90 passed fleet board for CPOWEA
Apr 91 Rated CPOWEA
7.5 years from civvy to CPOWEA


War Hero
When I joined in '01 tiffs had stopped wearing PO's rig and had the same kit as everyone else with the exception of a red cloth beret badge. I believe the change was in '97. Phase 1 training was in Fisguard Sqn, a separate building at Raleigh, and was for 10 weeks instead of 8 compared to everyone else. During the final two weeks the orange rank tabs were swapped for RN ones with a piece of grey cloth and certain leave privileges were allowed.

After passing out, the WAFUs and Stokers went to Sultan and the WEs went to Collingwood for around 3 years with a bit of sea time thrown in. At the end of the 3 years you got your Killicks and went to sea again. Within a year or two of this you'd get your POs and within 2 or 3 years of that you'd get your Chiefs. So providing you didn't fail anything and cracked on with your task books you could expect to have your buttons within 7 or 8 years of joining up.