Police Response Times

Discussion in 'Diamond Lil's' started by Potential_Officer, Jan 1, 2008.

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  1. Firstly Happy New Year RRs!

    This morning just over an hour ago, a car crashed with some speed, on dry road into a retired couple's bungalow. The occupants ran off pretty quickly but were stupid enough to return. My point is this, had the police been on the scene in ten minutes, they could have caught the [the people who saw him said he smelt of drink] driver at the scene, and immediately breathalysed him, as it is, with every hour that passes he is further and further away from the drink driving limit.

    The fact that these chavs, and believe me they are, were able to just walk back to car, calmly take their belongings and left, shows just how little they fear the law.

    Oh and the police are treating this not as a crime but as an RTA, despite the fact that they committed the crime of leaving an "accident" and the crime of Drink Driving.

    No wonder crime is going up in this country.
     
  2. From my experience of dealing with the police it seems like all the other emergency services except the fire who do fcuk all are fully stretched to their limit and cant be everywhere at once. Unfortunately it takes either a fatal RTC or one that blocks the traffic for any police to appear and sort it out, breathylse etc. The Police where i work do an excellent job and 99% of the time are there if we need them.
     
  3. Then clearly we do not have enough Police officers to deal with the spiralling crime in this country. Instead of having them locked away dealing with paperwork they should be on the street, especially during the festive period, when drink driving goes up massively.

    I'm still seriously hacked off by the fact that it is being dealt with as an accident, and not a crime.
     
  4. I agree with your sentiments but the fact is that the Police have to make do with the manpower and resources that they have and as you quite rightly pointed out there isn't enough.

    The road that runs alongside my house has joyriders sprinting up and down it in the early hours of the morning. I recently saw a police officer with a speed gun stood by this road and stopped to have a chat to him about it. He stated that the Police knew about it and it will be stopping shortly as they now have the equipment to deal with the problem. The thing is, will the joyriders return once the Police have finished their crackdown?? Probably yes. But at least they are doing something about this and as stated earlier it's a sad fact of life that they cannot be everywhere at once.
    I personally think the Police do a brilliant job-yes they have their faults-but as a member of the emergency services i get to see first hand what they do and am quite pleased when a violent/gobby patient gets told to wind his neck in or he/she will be nicked!!
     
  5. I'm sure they'll respond to this by putting a speed camera up. That'll sort it ;)
     
  6. If you want the police to attend immediately its simple.

    When talking to the operator inform them that you have a gun and are about to shoot the burglars/chavs. Because a gun is involved they must send someone straight away.
     
  7. sgtpepperband

    sgtpepperband War Hero Moderator Book Reviewer

    P_O: As a responsible citizen you have your own 'common law' powers which you could have exercised when you witnessed the offence as described (I can't be bothered to tell you what they are here & now, but you are a potential occifer, so you can find out for yourself)! :wink:

    And before you rant about Police response times, consider that the officers available were at another location, dealing with another more serious incident. This time of year is horrendously busy for ALL emergency services and they have to attend incidents in order of priority.

    Despite the emotion of your post, the incident you have described does no appear particularly 'serious' (i.e. no loss/immediate threat to life or property). It is likely that the descriptions of the driver(s) given (including vehicle registration) were passed to other available units in the area (including CCTV operatives) who may have used the information to apprehend the suspects at another time/place. As you are not in possession of all the facts (including your assumption that because someone's breath smelled of alcohol they are unfit to drive a vehicle - information which is hearsay, as you have heard it as a third party), you cannot criticise the Police's actions.

    And for further information, the word 'crime' tends not to be used for incidents involving vehicles, and are reported as Road Traffic Incidents/Accidents/Collisions (depending on the circumstances). Less emotive, thus preventing panic among the public... 8O

    As you say, we DO need more Police Officers, but direct your anger at the Home Office, rather than the Police themselves. This attitude causes disillusioned officers who feel unappreciated by the public, who decide to relocate overseas (particularly to Canada/Australia, where they have more respect and better pay/conditions). :oops:
     
  8. The reason it is being treated as an RTC (the C stands for collision, not A for accident) is because that is how THE LAW requires it be classified and dealt with. Failing to stop at the scene of an RTC is NOT A CRIME, nor is failing a breath test - they are OFFENCES but not crimes.

    Just because the driver was not breath tested at the scene does not mean he/she would get away with it. We can "back-calculate" blood/alcohol levels through forensic science and regularly do with positive results.

    If you want more Police on your streets to respond to these incidents I suggest you write a letter to your MP and the Right DIS-honourable Jackie Smith MP, the Home Secretary
     
  9. ...and a 'BlackRat' would certainly know that :read: :biggrin: :biggrin:
     
  10. RTC not RTA..good and about time.
    Collisions have causes and accidents are simply that; excuses can be given for accidents.
    Little that happens on the roads or any other form of transport is by way of an accident.
     
  11. RTI's these days guys. Road Traffic Incident
     
  12. Ex RD - not sure on the RTIs - there are incidents that are not collisions - in my force they are certainly RTCs - however, with this government it has probably changed since I started my leave just before Christmas and will probably change again before I go back next week !

    The only consistency in life is change !!!
     
  13. The police do a job on limited resources and manpower, however they seem to be under increasingly severe targets.

    recently someone tried to break into my mothers house (my mother is severely disabled and has communication problems), they broke the window and undid the latch, dog went ape shit and the (expletive) ran off, i went down to call the police, clear the glass and block the window, I would like to add that the police station is within 150 yards of my mothers house, it took an officer 1 hour to attend, and despite all the evidence pointing to an attempted break in she recorded it as criminal damage, the reason (entirely off the record) They were highly unlikely to catch the culprit, and criminal damage is not as serious as attempted break in, so the figures look better. I could have made a song and dance about it, and got it recorded as attempted break in, but the poor lass looked quite harassed, and i thought why make her job any harder than it has to be.
     
  14. I'm not having a go at the individual officers at the scene, I'm sure they had already had a very fun morning, what annoyed me is the fact that you can take the corner of someone's house out, calmly take your belongings and leave, change your trousers and come back for a good look. And then for their sergeant to deem that nearly demolishing a house, after driving awfully, after not having the balls to stand upto what the Chav had done, was not a crime.

    Sorry, do pardon my ignorance, but what is the difference between a crime and an Offence?

    As for me placing four chavs under citizen's arrest, they had unfortunately already ran past into the woods. I wasn't there when they came back, the elderly lady whose home the chavs ruined was.
     
  15. PO

    Without going technical, a crime normally, but not always, requires two elements - an "actus reus" and a "mens rea" - a physical act and a guilty intention or state of mind in layman's terms and would normally relate to those things that most people would think of a crime, such as robbery, burglary, etc. where someone has intended to do a specific act to the detriment of another. A crime is normally dealt with by the police whereas offences and civil torts are not always dealt with by the police.

    Most things involving roads would be offences, not crimes, although there are a few exceptions.

    I've tried to simplify it - someone may post chapter and verse but it can get a tad confusing if you try to look too deeply into it.

    Another reason for having crime and offences listed separately, being cynical, is that if the government told the truth and classified all things the police dealt with as crime you would see the true level of how many offences are actually committed in this country, not just how the government want you to see by cooking the books this week to make the stats look better for them !
     
  16. KL
    You last paragraph says it all really.
    As long as the police do their work by percentages and league tables, imposed from above then there is bound to be some suspicion among the public.
    IMHO the police, given the power they wield, are almost unique in getting this situation changed, if they wish.
    The police are now using their undoubted power in the pursuit of a pay claim; can they not use the same determination to change the way they do their work?
     
  17. Sussex

    I think I've mentioned on another thread - most senior police managers are more interested in complying and not rocking the boat to ensure they get their performance related pay bonus - just look at Brunstrom - every time he speaks out on something he's almost ostracised, although I accept he is somewhat radical with his views.

    The Police are, unfortunately, pretty much subserviant toothless tigers doing the dirty work of the government how and when they want it doing to achieve whatever this weeks priority or headline catcher is.
     
  18. If what you say is true then the situation is far worse then I, and quite a lot of other people would imagine.
    I really hope you are wrong, if you are not it doesn't look good for the future mate.
    That would have the worst fears of a lot of people realised; all the individuals powers of protection taken away, but no response from a police force dashing about ticking boxes.
    Please tell me it's not true...you are having a laugh surely?
    Nothing personal at all please understand, just a bit of shock and a lot of interest.
     
  19. Wait till the PCSO's take over......

    I worked over the New Years Eve in a busy City and the Old Bill were running from one incident to another all night, the guys/girls working in the control rooms were stacking the jobs up and then prioritising them as they came in.

    It was no surprise to hear that some jobs were downgraded or even left for the next day, at one stage we had 6 patrol cars and us (Heli) at an incident looking for a young man with breathing probs, no joy. It then transpired him and his G/F had managed to get home and go to bed..without telling anyone!!

    Sadly not enough bobbies to go around.
     
  20. Sussex, it's unfortunately all true mate - I wish I were joking.

    The Police Federation, who represent rank and file officers, have been calling for a Royal Commission inquiry into the police service for years but the government keep refusing to do one because they know/fear the outcome with show them up for the bunch of incompetent f***wits they are and how THEY are shafting the public by causing such p!ss poor policing.

    The senior managers continue to prioritise on chasing government performance targets which the government say you, the public, want us to prioritise - but I am still to find a majority of the public who agree with what the government are telling us to do.

    And I agree with your comment, I too am concerned that it will get worse until something extremely serious happens.

    Edited for typos
     

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