Pay for University Graduates

#1
I am confused on pay for officers. The pay scale itself is simple enough, but where do you start as a graduate. I have a degree and my first interview in 2 weeks for Pilot officer, but I still don't know. It says on the website...

Non-Graduate Annual Basic Pay
Midshipman - £14,852
On passing out of BRNC - £23,475

Graduate Annual Basic Pay
Sub Lieutenant - £28,216 - £31,188

I understand that I would be on the graduate pay, but was told that this is after you complete your basic training. So what is the pay during training? I need to know as I have a mortgage at home to pay and need to budget.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#2
Welcome!

Gradute Officers start on £28,216 even if it's a non-vocational degree. Whoever said that was after training was incorrect.

Yep, madness I know!

(Incidentally graduates still need the mandatory 5 GCSE's including Maths & English & 180 UCAS points at A level standard from at least two non-overlapping subjects with no individual subject contributing less than 45 UCAS points, but you may already have sussed that one.)

Good Luck.

The question is... Why don't graduate Ratings start on £28K if non-vocational degrees are accepted?
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#4
tonypeers5 said:
I understand that, but what is the pay during training. Cause this seems to be lower.
Not sure what tax code or NI contributions you will be on, but the above figure is indeed starting pay, albeit gross (in more ways than one).
 
#5
Excellent, because that is not too far what I am on at the moment, therefore the bills will be paid. It'll probably be similar as a matter of fact, due to company car tax.
 

Guns

War Hero
Moderator
#6
Lamp swings, pulls up the bollard. Now sonny when I was a Middy it was a good month if I made 4 and sixpence.

Seriously. You will get the pay as detailed above from the Recruiting Jedi Master. There will be deductions though.

Food, Accommodation, Council Tax in Lieu and your mess bill.

The Mess Bill, well it covers booze, booze, wine, booze and some other stuff.
 
#7
Ninja_Stoker said:
The question is... Why don't graduate Ratings start on £28K if non-vocational degrees are accepted?
...or, why doesn't everyone start as a rating?

(a bit like the police... where if you've got a degree you can apply for accelerated promotion... they've got the SUY scheme in place, just make it the only scheme!)
 
#8
promsan said:
Ninja_Stoker said:
The question is... Why don't graduate Ratings start on £28K if non-vocational degrees are accepted?
...or, why doesn't everyone start as a rating?

(a bit like the police... where if you've got a degree you can apply for accelerated promotion... they've got the SUY scheme in place, just make it the only scheme!)
Basically because the armed forces see the problems associated with recruiting their officer corps as different to the plods. Both systems have their merits and disadvantages. Bearing in mind that the RN gets many of it's officers through the rating entry process perhaps they are enjoying the benefits of both approaches to the problem.

I suspect the reason that rating entries with degrees don't get graduate rates of pay is that the powers that be do not see a significant change in rating recruitment from offering such a benefit, whereas they do see a distinct benefit in recruitment from offering graduates competitive rates of pay with their civilian mates. As for the point about non vocational degrees getting the same rates of pay, once again it is the market, commercial organisations and the civil serpants recruit for general management graduates with non vocational degrees, so to fish in the same pool the armed forces need the same bait.
 

sgtpepperband

War Hero
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#9
What he said.

Last time I took any interest in this matter, I understand that approximately 30% of the Officer Corps was promoted from the 'lower decks' - a higher percentage that I expected, to be honest...
 
#11
Guns said:
Lamp swings, pulls up the bollard. Now sonny when I was a Middy it was a good month if I made 4 and sixpence.

The Mess Bill, well it covers booze, booze, wine, booze and some other stuff.
As the lowest paid member of the Royal Navy (indeed less than the long-gone Short Engagement Seaman), as a Mid (UCE) I was given pocket money by the mess and waived mess shares! Now that's the way to do it..... (And my panther is blacker than yours!)
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#12
tonypeers5 said:
I have to go in as an officer for 2 results.

- To be a pilot you have to be a officer

- I have a mortgage to pay and the ratings pay isn't enough
Sound reasons.

Good luck in gaining a job which is enjoyable, directly transferable & lucrative enough to pay the mortgage for the house you want.

Most of us have to settle for only one or two out of the three, but if the ability is there, then you deserve it.

Good luck.
 
#13
Sorry to ressurect this topic but it's better than making a new one asking the same questions, but can somebody just clarify this:

Non-Graduate Annual Basic Pay
Midshipman - £14,852
On passing out of BRNC - £23,475

Graduate Annual Basic Pay
Sub Lieutenant - £28,216 - £31,188

So during initial training BRNC a Graduate would have higher rank and higher pay?
After BRNC would a Non-Graduate be on £23,475 until increase to Lieutenant?

Also, during Warfare Officer common fleet time, would a Sub Lieutenant and Midshipman be essentially the same besides higher pay and rank... before increase to Lieutenant?

EDIT: Just seen this on the Rates of Pay PDF on royalnavy.mod.uk which mentions nothing about a degree:

Annual basic pay
Age on entry Royal Navy Royal Marines Salary (£)
18 Midshipman 2nd Lieutenant 15,681
19 Midshipman 2nd Lieutenant 17,111
20 Sub Lieutenant 2nd Lieutenant 20,095
21 Sub Lieutenant 2nd Lieutenant 22,680
n/a Sub Lieutenant (QARNNS) 27,260–28,698

(Apologies about the formatting...)
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#14
JWARDY14 said:
Sorry to ressurect this topic but it's better than making a new one asking the same questions, but can somebody just clarify this:

Non-Graduate Annual Basic Pay
Midshipman - £14,852
On passing out of BRNC - £23,475

Graduate Annual Basic Pay
Sub Lieutenant - £28,216 - £31,188

So during initial training BRNC a Graduate would have higher rank and higher pay?
After BRNC would a Non-Graduate be on £23,475 until increase to Lieutenant?

Also, during Warfare Officer common fleet time, would a Sub Lieutenant and Midshipman be essentially the same besides higher pay and rank... before increase to Lieutenant?

EDIT: Just seen this on the Rates of Pay PDF on royalnavy.mod.uk which mentions nothing about a degree:

Annual basic pay
Age on entry Royal Navy Royal Marines Salary (£)
18 Midshipman 2nd Lieutenant 15,681
19 Midshipman 2nd Lieutenant 17,111
20 Sub Lieutenant 2nd Lieutenant 20,095
21 Sub Lieutenant 2nd Lieutenant 22,680
n/a Sub Lieutenant (QARNNS) 27,260–28,698

(Apologies about the formatting...)
I think you'll find the rates of pay you found are well out of date, age is no longer a consideration- qualifications are. The Current Rates of Pay can be downloaded here.

With regard rank upon joining & seniority, your ACLO is the best person to talk to, however this may assist:

Just to clarify Officer Seniority upon joining:

From 1 April 2007 a sliding scale of seniority based on Educational Qualifications was introduced. This scale is designed to reflect the more varied routes to a similar standard of qualification and is designed to widen the spread of applicants to the Naval Service. A summary of the scale is as follows:

Masters Degree or Equivalent Antedated Seniority 3.5 yrs
Graduate or equivalent 3 yrs
Foundation Degree or equivalent HNC or Equivalent 1 yr
Basic Entrant- GCSEs, GNVQ and A levels NIL

These rules apply to mainstream X,E,L and RM officers. Existing rules will apply to E(TM/IS) entrants where credits for degree class and work experience will apply.
 
#15
Hi, just a bit of confusion i have about some of the pay descriptions on the Navy Careers Site.

As of yet I haven't decided what role I wish to apply for in the Navy, but I will be studying A public service management degree in september and wish to apply and also receive a bursary. I understand i will then become a member of the University Cadets or something (same as the army's UOTC and RAF's UAS) but what are these figures regarding here

University cadet entry (UCE)
First year £12,469
Second year £14,316
Third year £16,075
Fourth year £17,548


(source: http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/upload/pdf/MoD_Rates_Leaflet.pdf) (i.p. 2)

what is University Cadet Entry and what does it involve I have been searching for hours, Thanks for your time and future replies. :)
 
#16
ishmale89 said:
Hi, just a bit of confusion i have about some of the pay descriptions on the Navy Careers Site.

As of yet I haven't decided what role I wish to apply for in the Navy, but I will be studying A public service management degree in september and wish to apply and also receive a bursary. I understand i will then become a member of the University Cadets or something (same as the army's UOTC and RAF's UAS) but what are these figures regarding here

University cadet entry (UCE)
First year £12,469
Second year £14,316
Third year £16,075
Fourth year £17,548


(source: http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/upload/pdf/MoD_Rates_Leaflet.pdf) (i.p. 2)

what is University Cadet Entry and what does it involve I have been searching for hours, Thanks for your time and future replies. :)
Yar, google be your friend :D
 
#17
University Cadetship

This scheme is for people who really want to get on in the Royal Navy and you will start university or college as an officer. You are paid a substantial salary for each year of your study:

* 1st year £11,337
* 2nd year £13,016
* 3rd year £14,615
* 4th year £15,954

You will complete one full year of Naval training before beginning your degree course. This consists of two terms at Britannia Royal Naval College, Dartmouth, and a period of time at sea.
Source: http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/careers/how-to-join/sponsorship/

You basically do the majority of your officer training before Uni then serve as a Lt during university. (I guess you have to study at a Uni with a URNU or even one of the DTUS Universities?) You then have to join the RN after Uni for a certain amount of time otherwise monies will be required to be paid back. This scheme isn't for everyone. I applied to do this same thing for the Army and I'm glad I backed out before signing on the dotted line because my 4 years at Uni have changed me a lot, and now I'm joining the RN.

The other option available to you is:

Standard Bursaries

Standard Bursaries are available to those wishing to join the Warfare, Logistics or Fleet Air Arm branches, to assist with the costs of studying any subject at any UK university. The bursary is currently worth £1,500 per year.
If you are considering either of these routes you can't go far wrong by making an appointment at an armed forces careers office, or even just walking in off the street. They don't bite, and walking through the door won't be the same as being slipped the kings shilling or being pressed for walking within 5 miles of a royal dockyard.
 
#18
Ninja_Stoker said:
Welcome!

Gradute Officers start on £28,216 even if it's a non-vocational degree. Whoever said that was after training was incorrect.

Yep, madness I know!

The question is... Why don't graduate Ratings start on £28K if non-vocational degrees are accepted?
Sounds good. What do Post Graduate RATINGS get as starting pay? :razz: :drool:

Am I too young at 46 to join up? :biggrin:

PS: You do have a Wheelchair Operators Branch, don't you? :lol:
 

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