"Outspoken Army chief sent to the Tower"

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by soleil, Oct 7, 2009.

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  1. And he's now "double-hatted" according to the BBC...
  2. It's a good move by the Conservatives. As a Junior Minister he will have to keep mum when the forces receive their share of cutbacks.... er I mean, rightsizing/efficiency savings/collateralisation..... :roll:
  3. Very interesting.

    That sums up the mentality of Brown the Humourless.

    If by “improve our armed services†means improve the Army, he’s probably right. With all due respects to the man as a soldier, though, I greatly doubt his commitment to improving the Navy and the Air Force.
  4. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    Did I just see he is to go to the Lords and be 'Dave''s Tory Defence Advisor?
  5. Wasn't that the plan all along?
  6. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    Have to say, Tory MP Chris Grayling's gaffe regarding the appointment of Sir Richard as a political adviser being a political gimmick left me rather amused. Talk about a six-piece suck-back, when he realised it was as an adviser to his own party!

    Even more hilarious was an Army Colonel on the BBC TV News last night stating that General Dannatt may not be the wisest individual criticising his political bosses. He went on to say that if he gets appointed as a political adviser, then he wouldn't want to be criticised by military commanders either.

    Jeez, talk about pot calling kettle- Sir Richard is still "in post" until next month "Loft on switchy! :lol:

    Quality stuff - Just what we want, a Tory government military adviser who doesn't want aircraft carriers.
  7. Might be on the books but I was at his leaving speech in Main Building a few weeks ago.

    Well it aligns very much with the Tory party thinking, he's always been a very vocal advocate of the Army at the expense of the other two services. That's very much where Fox sits as well.
  8. wet_blobby

    wet_blobby War Hero Moderator

    There's a whiff of indecent haste about what the good general has done, he has gifted labour the chance to undermine all his vocal outbursts against them under manning and under funding the forces. Poor judgement in that department if you ask me, however full credit for following his words with positive action to actually do something about what he's complained about. Beats writing a "look at me" book.
  9. Particularly when the briefing yesterday was that he's been advising Cameron for some time, that's a very clear politicisation of the role and leaves both his position vulnerable, and the Armed Forces as a whole because suddenly all of his professional advice becomes tainted.

    The alternative view that's on the wires at the moment is that it has two effects, it legitimises his actions and it brings him under control. Legitimising his actions means that the current heads have free reign to criticise an incoming tory government, and to an extent sanctions those of us lower down the food chain criticising our superiors in public.
  10. wet_blobby

    wet_blobby War Hero Moderator

    Most of the comments I've seen lean towards ex Mil headsheds being cross bencher's if they enter the house of lords, there's allot of merit in that I think, nailing ones colours to the mast as the general has done is dumb, it handicaps his opinions.
  11. wet_blobby

    wet_blobby War Hero Moderator

    "Legitimising his actions means that the current heads have free reign to criticise an incoming tory government, and to an extent sanctions those of us lower down the food chain criticising our superiors in public."

    Apologies to karma but I've added his last sentence as an edit.

    I cannot see this happening, Dannatt has been lucky with his timings. He held a top spot when the Government was deeply unpopular, the press will gleefully report anything or anyone who knocks them. An incoming Tory government will have a "honeymoon" period in which the press will neuter most criticism, the present heads wont be heard, however there successors could have some fun.
  12. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    One cannot help but wonder whether Sir Richard will play the game, unlike the current Parliamentary Under-Secretary for Security and Counter-terrorism , and have his military pension capped to ensure that when he is re-employed by the Government, that his combined (pension & pay) does not exceed that of his last day's service - the balance being paid to HM Treasury, like the rest of us?

    Hmmn, silly me, thought not….
  13. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    One's pension, from any employment, is essentially withheld pay from when one was working. It is a cheap jibe to expect someone to give that up when they achieve a further career, if they are not forced to do so. If that the terms of a further career include a cap such as Ninja seems to be under, that's something to consider before you take the 2nd job. Ninja, you've been had. This is Govt staffing AFCOs on the cheap.
  14. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    It used to be the case, in the good old days when we always had a clutch of Gunnery Admirals of the Fleet in the House of Lords, that they quietly got together so as to sing from the same hymn sheet and then said their piece regardless of who the Govt was.

    If Cameron doesn't see the need for power projection by the UK in its brave new Euro-fairyland, then of course we don't need carriers, as the French and Germans will be happy to protect us. It will be a pity if Dannatt turns out to be the sort of thick pongo who can't see beyond the immediate present and can't see the need to maintain kit and skillsets for a possibly rather different future.
  15. wet_blobby

    wet_blobby War Hero Moderator

    Oh I dont know, building the carriers sustains jobs and such forth, axing civil serpents seems much more likely. Just think they could get rid of everyone that a squaddie could double up as on his leave, like mod plod or cleaners and get the uniformed blokes to do it instead, top idea, could even get them to be stuff like firemen, that'd save a few quid.
  16. OK, a bit of a diversion, is there a maximum that can be abated here?

    If for example one was to take a job in the Senior Civil Service, salary somewhat higher than say a Commander, would Treasury be looking for the salary to be top sliced as well as recovering the pension?
  18. Liam Fox is claiming that the 25% reduction will be met by culling civil serpents. After compensation for being made redundant and the costs of people (usually the most experienced) opting for early retirement, much of this paper saving will, at least in the short term, be lost. He has also indicated that the cuts should allow resources to be focussed on the front line. The Tories are telling us they offer transparency: so what additional equipment bedgets are they planning to cull? You can expect them to claim that they won't be able to assess this until they gain power. Those that sit on the Commons Defence Select committee are in fact in a perfect position to know. Their silence should be treated as the same old reticence of all parties to spell out the unpleasant, hard facts that significant cuts in all departmental budgets will need to be made, and government will need to withdraw from whole areas to balance the books by 2014. The public will have to make private provision, through commercial insurance, for various eventualities. Unemployment insurance is the most obvious area for change. The NHS will also have to start charging to curtail the large numbers of people who abuse the system by calling out ambulances for cut fingers, etc. Public sector pensions will be the first cut: averaging the pension based on a lifetime's earnings being the most obvious. The new government will not need to introduce new legislation to do this as it went into the stature book last year.

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