Out of date Naval Traditions ( Laws)

copenhagencup

Lantern Swinger
#1
Firstly I apologise if this has been done before.
In today`s "modern" RN with females at Sea, Legality for hatters( sorry I`m not PC) why.

Do I have to wear a hat of some description. watching old footie clips for the 1930`s everybody wore one in the crowd but not today. Think of the saving in berets alone.

Why do the Navy have the right to tell me what facial hair I should be allowed.

Why are personnel still referred to as officers and men, are we to separate species
 

ET(WE)Sutton

Lantern Swinger
#2
the facial hair has something to do with your gas mask...


and the seperation between officers and ratings.. because i think they are officers
 

slim

War Hero
#3
ET(WE)Pooley said:
the facial hair has something to do with your gas mask...


and the seperation between officers and ratings.. because i think they are officers
You are talking out of your gas hole!

RN regulations state that only a full set may be worn. i.e. A rating who wishes to grow a beard puts on his request form
"To discontinue shaving"
If approved the MAA inspects the results after a certain time to determine if the rating in question has the ability to grow a set. If he hasn't then he must restart shaving.
At one time sailors were allowed to grow a moustache but that was well before my time.
 
#4
copenhagencup

Taking your points in turn;

(a) without turning American, how could you salute without your hat. Apart from that, 'ats is smart.

(b) like Slim says, not everyone can have a full set. Other Services and other Nations' Navys may allow pick and mix hair but it tends to look either nancy or spivvy. In our Navy, It's smart.

(c) as ET(WE)Pooley says, Officers are Officers and hold the Queen's Commission; and Ratings are Men who don't. Reading between the lines, I expect that you are wondering why the Andrew has 2 decks.

Fortunately, PC hasn't permeated the Senior Service's traditions; yet.
 
#5
points of questons......

(a) saluting......the reason for hats is that when you are saluting an officer you are saluting the royal crest on his/her cap which defers his/her authority over you devolved direct from the crown via his/her commission. You wearing a hat with a badge on it allows the officer to return the salute.....I think

(b) yup it is to do with gasmasks......over a certain length of facial hair a proper seal cannot be achieved without a special cream......so thats one of the reasons why.

(c) already dealt with

and yup.....tradition and non-pc please
 
#6
ET(WE)Pooley said:
the facial hair has something to do with your gas mask...


and the seperation between officers and ratings.. because i think they are officers
Facial hair is more relevant to us because it interferes with your BASCA facemask, roughly 10% loss.
Ships going south on Corporate were given the order "Shave Off" for this reason.

Regarding separation, long may it continue, would you want a chino wearer in your mess? :wink:
 

copenhagencup

Lantern Swinger
#7
You institutionalised bunch of fuddy duddies.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Passed over Loggie replied

Taking your points in turn;

(a) without turning American, how could you salute without your hat. Apart from that, 'ats is smart.

(b) like Slim says, not everyone can have a full set. Other Services and other Nations' Navys may allow pick and mix hair but it tends to look either nancy or spivvy. In our Navy, It's smart.

(c) as ET(WE)Pooley says, Officers are Officers and hold the Queen's Commission; and Ratings are Men who don't. Reading between the lines, I expect that you are wondering why the Andrew has 2 decks.

Fortunately, PC hasn't permeated the Senior Service's traditions; yet.

a) With your right arm or standing smartly to attention as per Clubs.
So I see the skipper in his car I don`t see his hat I still chop him one off.
Think out of the box dear boy.

b) Walking round in the UK do I really need to think about my AGR, so what if I have a Tash, goatee, Lamb chop sidees or what ever. If I go into conflict I shave it off after being informed, I don`t take naps tablets every day( just in case) and I had the choice about anthrax .

c) Just don`t get the Officers and Men shit in days society we are all people, in the Andew we all know what side of the fence we are on why publicly make such a distinction.
 
#8
a) if skipper is driving his car negative head gear or is on push bike DO NOT salute as he is in charge of a moving vehicle and cannot return the salute without losing concentration on the road ahead potentially dangerous. come smartly to attention as he passes. If he has a driver then you may salute

b) errrm?

c) this point has already been made. They are commisioned officers and we are the men........chain of command, discipline all that sort of good stuff?
 
#10
Is it still on the books that no man can be advanced in rate whilst having a venereal disease?

(That's the clap / caught the boat / sexually transmitted disease to our GCSE educated readers. I just like the original wording).
 
#11
Pity that all Andrew personnel were stopped from saluting any Royal of any rank, simply out of respect to, and recognising an all-round superior being.
:D :D :D
Happy New Year.

OSD
 

chieftiff

War Hero
Moderator
#12
copenhagencup said:
Firstly I apologise if this has been done before.
In today`s "modern" RN with females at Sea, Legality for hatters( sorry I`m not PC) why.

Do I have to wear a hat of some description. watching old footie clips for the 1930`s everybody wore one in the crowd but not today. Think of the saving in berets alone.

Why do the Navy have the right to tell me what facial hair I should be allowed.

Why are personnel still referred to as officers and men, are we to separate species
I think the answer to all three questions is because you are told to shipmate, or is discipline just an old fashioned outdated tradition!
 

chieftiff

War Hero
Moderator
#14
jesse650 said:
I wonder can we still be keel-hauled or has that gone as well??......I know the death penalty is still on the books.......
Unfortunately I think the 'liberal thinking outside the box' brigade have done away with all the fun traditions, they have just left the unpopular outdated ones like wearing hats, sporting beards and calling Officers Sir. :lol:
 
#15
Or as Sir Rather a Wally said"The Gentlemen will toil with the Mariner, and the Mariner shall toil with the Gentlemen, we are all of one company" I think you can safely say that the RN has gone downhill ever since.
 
#16
The RN, like any other disciplined armed service, wears uniform because smartness derives from everybody looking alike, i.e. "uniform". And everybody in the RN salutes somebody; ratings salute officers, officers salute more senior officers. There are too many scruffy individuals already without allowing people to look like out-of-work British Rail porters. Looking and feeling smart adds to one's self esteem and pride.
 
#17
wardmaster said:
... There are too many scruffy individuals already without allowing people to look like out-of-work British Rail porters. Looking and feeling smart adds to one's self esteem and pride.
Now don't start talking about the Pongoes like that! They might get upset!

OSD :twisted:
 

copenhagencup

Lantern Swinger
#19
Uniform yes but I do not need to wear an Ffing hat to be smart.

I said nothing about not calling officers Sir.

The tot was a tradition, field gun a tradition, getting spat on as a tiff(technicians now) was a tradition now all gone.
What is wrong with me smartly dressed with no hat sporting a goatee representing the Andrew,
 
#20
copenhagencup,

sounds like you've been pulled up for it.

if you are outside you need to wear a lid
clean shaven or full set with appropriate paperwork

those are the regs.......not sure wheather they are BR or QR but go and check........

I'd rather have you representing the Royal Navy in the correct rig including cap/beret or not at all.....coz uniform is just that uniform......if youre not like everyone else you are not in uniform.
 

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