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Nelson Mandela - Hospital!

drewfester

Lantern Swinger
Don't care!! Too many people forget that he was jailed because he was a terrorist. No doubt he will be seen as a great man when he dies but he is just a terrorist
One mans freedom fighter, is another mans terrorist
 
Princess Di got Mother Teresa when she popped her clogs, looks like Phil's getting Nelson. The small talk at the Pearly gates when they wait to get let in will be priceless.
 
G

guestm

Guest
Labelled a terrorist by the vile South African government of the time, to me he is a freedom fighter and a great man.

He organised public bombings with indiscriminate targets (how apt). Regardless of what he was fighting against, there is no justification for that. He is a terrorist and a murderer plain and simple.
 
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finknottle

Banned
He organised public bombings with indiscriminate targets (how apt). Regardless of what he was fighting against, there is no justification for that. He is a terrorist and a murderer plain and simple.

It's easy for us to adopt the moral high ground having never been in the position of the black South Africans forced to live under the repugnant policy of apartheid.
 

pg55555

Lantern Swinger
.

One should NOT ignore the fact that he was a terrorist.

What makes him a great ( but flawed ) leader is the way he went to huge efforts when he was released and became president to ensure a peaceful and relatively fair hand over of power.

Where he went wrong was letting the existing land and industrial owners keep too much and letting the more corrupt elements of the ANC thrive. South Africa is still a much better place for him having taken over, but so much corruption means that the common people have not thrived as much as they should have.

.
 
G

guestm

Guest
It's easy for us to adopt the moral high ground having never been in the position of the black South Africans forced to live under the repugnant policy of apartheid.

That's as maybe, but its terrorism and murder whichever way it's painted. There is no such thing as a just cause when the murder of civilians including women and children is concerned.
 

finknottle

Banned
That's as maybe, but its terrorism and murder whichever way it's painted. There is no such thing as a just cause when the murder of civilians including women and children is concerned.

Tell that to the Syrian terrorists or is it freedom fighters who have by all accounts committed atrocities. There are some who would like to see them armed by us so they can kill more people, I smell hypocrisy and double standards as well as self righteous pontificating.
 
G

guestm

Guest
Tell that to the Syrian terrorists or is it freedom fighters who have by all accounts committed atrocities. There are some who would like to see them armed by us so they can kill more people, I smell hypocrisy and double standards as well as self righteous pontificating.

Really? Not by me. If you're referring to this thread: http://www.navy-net.co.uk/current-affairs/68058-camoron-does-bliar-syria.html

You'll note that in my posts #31 and #38 I post my agreement that giving the rebels weapons is a bad idea. I smell forgetfulness and more contrary burbling. Do carry on.
 

flymo

War Hero
.

One should NOT ignore the fact that he was a terrorist.

What makes him a great ( but flawed ) leader is the way he went to huge efforts when he was released and became president to ensure a peaceful and relatively fair hand over of power.

Where he went wrong was letting the existing land and industrial owners keep too much and letting the more corrupt elements of the ANC thrive. South Africa is still a much better place for him having taken over, but so much corruption means that the common people have not thrived as much as they should have.

.

I'm sure the 24,000 murder victims per year under the ANC will agree with you .... if they could ...
Linky
 

Taloolah

Banned
Don't care!! Too many people forget that he was jailed because he was a terrorist. No doubt he will be seen as a great man when he dies but he is just a terrorist
One mans freedom fighter, is another mans terrorist

I hesitate to say this considering the contentious nature of the topic (terrorism) but look at Mandela's options during the 1950's and 1960's. The fact he became a lawyer was staggering enough.
Imagine you are one of a majority member in a society that has had 7 generations of minority rule that insists on:
Refusing you more than primary school level education
Refusing you the right to basic health care & housing
Refusing you the right to enter certain professions (assuming you could at all by education/design)
Refusing you the right to vote whatsoever when there is an oppressive minority government in a country predominantly populated by a majority 'other' and that minority had only been in power since the 19th Century....
Refused you the right to protest peacefully - have a voice at all
Refused you the right to legal representation or to meet with a legal beagle during police captivity (read 'Biko')

Would you yourself not be a tad pissed off ?

I have stood on the edge of Kylesha township and looked as far as the eye could see.40 miles of slums in each direction.Imagine being born into that.Imagine being born into those sorts of restrictions and trying to keep hope alive every single day against all the odds with no recourse to legal or peaceful representation. What the hell would any of us do ?
 
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G

guestm

Guest
How very American. 'Terrorism, its ok if it doesn't involve us'.

For what it's worth, in my view the situation in South Africa was such that it could probably only have been changed through co-ordinated, terrorist and guerilla violence. Mandella was the right devil for that particular hell, doesn't make him a great man though. Still a terrorist and a murderer.

It begs an interesting question. How would the uprising and guerrilla acts of Iraqi and Afghan nationals, given to fighting back against a military invasion and the directly related deaths of tens of thousand civilians, be viewed by us if there were no British involvement?

Freedom fighters or terrorists?
 
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WreckerL

War Hero
Super Moderator
I beleive they were freedom fighters when they were fighting the soviets...but that was before they became terrorists.

At least when we fought them before, when we invaded countries just because we could, they were just unwashed savages, none of this PC labelling ;)
 
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