Navy Monthly Situation Report, September 2013

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by soleil, Oct 17, 2013.

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  1. Well when you look at some of the stats it doesn't look so bad. Then when you look at VO figures and it is quite shocking. The report certainly doesn't seem to match how it feels out in the fleet though.


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  2. How come that 10 Lt Cdr barristers and 10 Cdr barristers = total of 40 barristers, and why do we need 40 anyway?
     
  3. To serve the Coffee
     
  4. I wouldn't have thought you'd need 40 pusser's barristers for that POL as I assume they are only involved with naval law (and the numbers still don't add up).
     
  5. In a Pusser that's been civillianised and contracted out everywhere surely these solicitor types should have been axed years ago? Are they at sea or are they in an office in Whitehall/Pompey? When did that tail to teeth bollox start? Must have been 20 years ago, these seem like prime candidates.
     
  6. I think you'll find that many of them are Fleet Legal who are there to advise units on legal stuff and telling offenders, sorry "the accused" that they may not go to court martial for being charged with being an hour late despite what the Armed Forces Act may say. It also appeared to be a wheeze for LOs to go for to avoid being canned in the redundancy round. I do think 40 may be a bit too many but I suppose there is a need for legal advise especially in the thorny world of the AFA.


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  7. I can't get over the 32.5% deficit of PO's (or 310) in the GS Engineering branch. I know its shit but.........
     
  8. Oh I don't doubt the need for legal advice in our modern litigious world.

    Quick dit, I had an OM that didn't show up one morning so he got rattled. His story - he had been to the dentist for a filling and ended up with the tooth pulled. So the next morning he went to a solicitors instead of work to see if he could sue the dentist!

    Back on subject. What I question is having a bunch of uniform do it. We still needed feeding in shore bases but it didn't stop em filling the galleys with Mivvies did it?
     
  9. I see where you are coming from but given the amount I had to pay a shyster solicitor for a will, where I told them most of the stuff they wrote, I would hazard that the possibility of getting civvies to do it for less than a Naval officer is paid is less than nil. You can get a civvy chef to work in a shoreside galley for less than a pussers one, absolutely no chance of the same with lawyers IMHO.


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  10. Purple_twiglet

    Purple_twiglet War Hero Moderator

    I dont think it is 40 barristers - it notes that numbers ending in 5 are rounded to multiples of 20 for some reason.

    At that sort of level its very difficult to get an accurate figure due to the rounding up of numbers.

    Also, the reason the RN has legal people is a combination of law of the sea, targeting, rules of engagement, ensuring we can shoot people we want to shoot and not be done for murder, standing up to defend Jack, standing up to shaft Jack and generally doing all manner of legal stuff. If you think the cost of less than 40 SO1 and SO2 officers is expensive, have a look at the hours they pull and then try and get an equivalent legal service of same expertise and quality - I suspect you will be looking at adding millions to the bill.
     
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  11. There is no but mate. It is shit and people are leaving in droves. Just look at the VO rates for the last 4 years at all ranks. They've accelerated and show little sign of slowing and as has been discussed in other threads there are gaps everywhere. There are very few below who can be moved through any faster without leaving gaps there. I heard a rumour recently that we've so far this year (not sure if that's calendar or April to April) recruited a whole 15% of the number of new ETs we need. Can't speak to the veracity of that but if it's true then either way it's dire.


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  12. I"m on PO's course at the min. We have been basically told in no uncertain terms, that any of us with 12 years done will never reach CPO. Is it really worth staying in? IMHO nope, I am leaving once my 3 years RoS finishes and off out in to the great big civvie world. The RN has lost me and the majority of the 70 ish LH/PO's on POET course right now. We have no incentive to stay in once 2015 changes the pension, no time in shoreside billets and most of all no promotion prospects.
     
  13. Are they still trotting that line out? It was possibly true back when ET came in and we were heavily overborne with CPOs but now that CPOs are leaving and we're in balance or short of them it's probably not any longer. Also it would only be true if you are only planning on serving til your 22 year point. I think all of the planning that sees the RN engineering world surviving are based on continuing uptake of EC at a huge rate. That may be a false assumption but is probably another discussion subject. Point is I wouldn't give up on the prospect of being a CPO just yet.


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  14. With the increase of EC's being offered to CPO's and above, this will surely reduce VO and also slow down the CPO/WO2/WO1 promotion chain. Thus creating a stagnation of CPO's, many of whom are younger than 40.
     
  15. Well maybe but you are assuming that CPOs are accepting EC. Every single ME SR who was eligible for EC was offered it this year. I'm pretty sure they didn't all take it. Many have the same attitude as you towards the new pension and they are just as attractive to civvy employers. I think the number heading into EC will reduce massively. The average EC only saw the serviceman doing an extra 2.5 - 3 years and that statistic was from a few years ago.


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    Last edited: Oct 17, 2013
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  16. Pardon my ignorance but EC and VO? i guess 2OE replacement for the first? The old school of thought was to take it and put your notice in when you sniffed a draft. But if you aren't getting any shore time then better to just work to an end date. That's what I did. Everyone knew I was leaving so I went ashore, resettled and left. If you take it, as far as Drafty is concerned you're committed. Which, for me would have meant almost definitely shabby wood and a boss expecting me to do stuff.
     
  17. EC is Extended Career which you are correct replaced 2OE. VO is Voluntary Outflow or putting your notice and not reaching 22 years. Most people did take 2OE, go ashore then give notice when next sea draft hit their desk, especially if it wasn't what they wanted. Think it's still the case. There are and probably always will be those who love or can stand everything about the navy and stay in for as much as they can but my perception is they are getting fewer.


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  18. Section heads are now LH and POs. Only group heads are CPOs, so less CPOs needed saving them money.

    They are relying on a combination of the recession, and extensive use of reserves as a way of getting more for less. This Tory mantra may work for certain branches, but engineering is a sort after expertise outside.

    I expect this all to come to a nasty head very soon, luckily N.Korea/Falklands/Syria has not erupted yet!
     

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