MOD Main Building

F169

War Hero
Just read a letter in the Sunday Torygraph suggesting the refurbishment of the Main Building is costing 2.3 billion. Can this extraordinary amount actually be true?!
 

stumpy

War Hero
The latest edition of Pricate Eye deals with this:

"The PFI deal was priced at £746.1m in 2000 against an estimated cost for public funding of £746.2m (magically just £0.1m more expensive after £103m in "risk factors" was added: who says the calculations are fiddled?). Now MoD figues show the deal will end up costing three times as much at £2.35bn."

I thought that the point of PFI was that the contractor carried the financial risk?

The article also mentions that more PFI problems: "The size of the MoD's financial hole marked "PFI" has only just emerged. Deals already signed and offically valued at £5.3bn will in fact require payments totalling £26.3bn - almost a whole years defence budget. And thats without some very big ones in the pipeline."

It also mention that because of so much of the MoD budget tied up to paying PFIs that projects such as moving military to Wales might not happen!!
 

SILVER_FOX

War Hero
How many ships would that [not so] little amount have run for the next 12 months? :evil: :evil: :evil:

SF
 

stumpy

War Hero
The annoying thing is that the military will get the blame for this when it should be laid at the door of the politicos who insisted on the PFI scheme. This happens a lot, the government insist on a huge Typoon order for European political reasons, but the defence budget suffers. I do think that where there are cost overruns due to political reasons these should be passed to the Treasury (fat chance).

Lewis Page wrote a book (which is great in parts) about MoD waste. I guess that he visits this site, so I wonder if he has drawn up a list of defence overspends that are due to political interference and not military need? (It might be in an annex, but I have lent my copy out). I guess it would make interesting reading, and possibly take some of the heat off the military.
 
In response to silverfox's questions the calculation is easy. If we assume that the PFI deal on MoD main building costs 2,300,000,000 (one can be a bit of an anorak about how much is a billion, but I won't bore you) and the cost of not mothballing 6 frigates and destroyers being £250,000,000 per annum then it means we could keep 6 ships for a the better part of a decade.

It would however mean that the Whitehall mandarins would be deprived of their £1000 seats and a state of the art atrium and chill areas etc. Who has the box of tissues?
 
If we are talking about the main building I wouldn't be surprised if part of the refurb consists of putting large barriers between the street and the inhabitants. I always like walking past (not for the frisson as armed guards give one a searching look) because of the magnificent statues which decorate the facade. Still I suppose these are dangerous times :?
 
stumpy said:
The annoying thing is that the military will get the blame for this when it should be laid at the door of the politicos who insisted on the PFI scheme. This happens a lot, the government insist on a huge Typoon order for European political reasons, but the defence budget suffers. I do think that where there are cost overruns due to political reasons these should be passed to the Treasury (fat chance).

Lewis Page wrote a book (which is great in parts) about MoD waste. I guess that he visits this site, so I wonder if he has drawn up a list of defence overspends that are due to political interference and not military need? (It might be in an annex, but I have lent my copy out). I guess it would make interesting reading, and possibly take some of the heat off the military.
I agree... but it won't happen. :x
 
stumpy said:
Lewis Page wrote a book (which is great in parts) about MoD waste. I guess that he visits this site
If the kno**nd known as Lewis Page does read this Forum, I could almost be persuaded that there is a God.

Phil1972 has the arithmetic about right. Admittedly, parts of MB were a mess but some of us have been working in worse conditions for years. Has the argument of how it must appear to foreign Dignitaries been wheeled out yet? The concept of a building site that is only allowed the Show House springs to mind.
 

lsadirty

War Hero
I left the MoD in 2003, before my branch moved into Main Building: since then , the lads who stayed on have told me it's so PC, totally faceless for a branch to operate in - all open plan, can't have a laugh or a joke like my time, in case you upset the J Arthurs next door - thank you God for early retirement schemes.............
 

JeffB

Badgeman
lsadirty said:
I left the MoD in 2003, before my branch moved into Main Building: since then , the lads who stayed on have told me it's so PC, totally faceless for a branch to operate in - all open plan, can't have a laugh or a joke like my time, in case you upset the J Arthurs next door - thank you God for early retirement schemes.............
Actually having been in on several occasions, it has been done pretty well and seems to be popular with most who work there - but they you would hope so considering the cost!
I was led to believe that part of the deal involved the PFI contractors acquiring buckshee all of the central London property vacated by MoD when Main Building reopened so they have probably made even more of a killing on the deal.

On a related issue, I find it amazing to see how much property the Army retains in central London. Whilst the rest of the MoD Centre has rationalised, RN training establishments are under seemingly constant review for closure and we are seriously considering closing one of the 2 remaining major naval bases, the Guards are still sitting on acres of the most expensive real estate in the world.
 
[/quote] On a related issue, I find it amazing to see how much property the Army retains in central London. Whilst the rest of the MoD Centre has rationalised, RN training establishments are under seemingly constant review for closure and we are seriously considering closing one of the 2 remaining major naval bases, the Guards are still sitting on acres of the most expensive real estate in the world.[/quote]

Not for much longer the guards are on the move next year, off to a cheaper part of London vacated by the Artillery
 

JeffB

Badgeman
Skate_bastard said:
/Not for much longer the guards are on the move next year, off to a cheaper part of London vacated by the Artillery
'Cheaper part of London'? Surely you mean 'almost, but not quite so vastly expensive part of England'. I thought that the MoDs policy was supposed to be 'rustication' to cheaper parts such as South Wales.
 

Chaz

MIA
F169 said:
Just read a letter in the Sunday Torygraph suggesting the refurbishment of the Main Building is costing 2.3 billion. Can this extraordinary amount actually be true?!
The money in question (not sure of the exact amount) to refurb the Mod main building also includes the money being spent to relocated everyone in the Old War Office builing opposite, we're due to move over in 2009 (about 800 of us) if all goes accordingly. What happens to the Old War Office building I've no idea but it must be worth a percentage of the initial 2.3 billion - not all I know.
 
JeffB said:
Skate_bastard said:
/Not for much longer the guards are on the move next year, off to a cheaper part of London vacated by the Artillery
'Cheaper part of London'? Surely you mean 'almost, but not quite so vastly expensive part of England'. I thought that the MoDs policy was supposed to be 'rustication' to cheaper parts such as South Wales.
Surely, not even the Guards deserve to be sent to Wales, even the Welsh guards, don't want to go LOL...............
 
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