Middle Age Religion

Discussion in 'The Gash Barge' started by OSLO, Nov 28, 2007.

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  1. As anyone who has followed my postings on RR will know, I am no fan of religion in general. However, my intolerance of Islam has steadily grown over the last few years, and I have moved my platform from one who defends anyone's right to worship as they see fit and to defend Islam in general. Now, I am of the belief that Islam is an unregulated morass of Middle Aged thinkings founded on the principle of the bloodshed and intolerance. With no central body equivalent to the Vatican or the General Synod, Islam has remained rooted to ideals from a bygone era and there is little momentum to change the present day decline in its acceptance of other faiths and attitudes.

    What has prompted this rant? Many recent events around the Islamic world, but 3 most recent ones have exemplified this idiocy:
    a) the sentencing of a gangraped woman in Saudi Arabia to imprisonment and suffering 200 lashes (or whatever the number is)
    b) the charging of the teacher in Sudan (talk about petty)
    c) the investigation into whether the publisher of Dawkins' "The God Delusion" is guilty of incitement to hatred in Turkey (http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/11/28/dawkins.turkey.ap/index.html)

    It is becoming evident that the claim by the extremist elements of Islam (such as Al Qaeda, Hezb'allah, etc) that the "West" is waging a religious way against Islam is set to become a reality. There is a growing intolerance to the West's tolerance and secularism in Islamic circles, while there is growing secularism in non-Islamic circles.

    I've got bored of the claims of the moderate Muslims that Islam is a religion of peace. There is little that I have seen to prove that. Increasingly, those countries that are governed according to the tenets of Islam are proving to be fundamentalist, intolerant and anti-freedoms.

    So my point is this: are we on the cusp of seeing the resurgence of open religious wars between Islam and Christianity/Judaism on an international scale?
     
  2. Theres never a Crusader around when you need one.
     
  3. I think that this is what the fundamentalists would like to see. I agree that the only things that hit the press support the view that fundamentalism is the only growing section of the Islamic world, but it must be difficult for moderates to displace this perception.

    IMO, our very tolerance in the UK, not necessarily the West, produces a fertile environment for the more radical fundamentalist Moslems to practise their brand of intimidation towards their less hostile peers.
     
  4. Not so much a religion, more a mental illness
     
  5. You really must re-read the Bible Oslo. It's full of contradictions: God is vengeful and forgiving at the same time. Both sinners and the innocent are individually and collectivly punished for their own or others' wrongdoing... or not, depending upon which bits you read. Hitler's Mein Kampf is riddled with quotations from the New Testament attempting to legitimize his warped, racist beliefs. White British Evangelical Christians claimed a couple of years ago that the enslavement of Africans by Britain wasn't wrong at all as slavery was an early, primitive form, of the welfare state.

    Then you said this:

    It would be equally valid to substitute the words Muslims and Islam with Christians and Christianity. In the USA the Catholic Church is seeking to ban literature and films that are critical of it (eg Philip Pullman's novels, etc) US Christian fundamentalists have been involved in acts of terrorism against doctors and their staff in abortion clinics. Throughout Eastern Europe anti-Semitism is on the rise and promoted by Christian leaders in those countries. In Britain, Christian Voice is seeking to prosecute the BBC for blasphemy for airing Jerry Springer: the Opera on BBC2 last year. The Christian Institute frequently publilsh literature which cites psuedoscientific research by Paul Cameron, who has twice advocated the systematic extermination of people like me. British human rights legislation gives the religious an opt-out from legislation they claim is against their deeply held beliefs, though interestingly the European Convention does not.

    I can be imprisoned for "blasphemy". I can be refused public services run by Christians. It is legal to demand that people like me should be killed. The police believe that they cannot prosecute either Muslims or Christians who make death threats against non-believers. Humanists cannot conduct their own weddings or get state funding for schools unless they promote Christianity. All these things are legal in non-Islamic, Christian, Britain. So what's the difference? We're not so very different, after all. OK Muslims have Hamas and Al Quada, but we had the IRA and then there is the Lord's Resistance Army.........
     
  6. Out of interest, has anyone on here read Dawkins' 'The God Delusion'?
     
  7. Correct.. :thumright:
     
  8. Absolutely. Found myself crying out "yes" in agreement with many of his points.
     
  9. not quite finished very good.
     
  10. Quite so. It gets a bit heavy going in the middle, but a lot of what he says makes a shitload of sense.
    I loved the bit where the suicide bombers go to paradise expecting 72 virgins, only to find that, through a mis-translation, they get 72 white grapes/rasins :p
     
  11. chieftiff

    chieftiff War Hero Moderator

    I've got bored of the claims of all religions that they represent peace. Religion is nothing more than a means of control, it preys on ignorance, personality, naivety, insecurity and innocence it sets out to limit the advancement of our race, however! Intolerance is not the weapon with which to fight it, intolerance plays into religions hands, it infers that Good is being fought and opposed by Evil, all religions see themselves as oppressed it's part of the psyche of faith.

    Humanity and justice, the very things religions proclaim are the appropriate opposition, then comes truth the most difficult. Faith requires a belief in something that cannot be proven, how do you oppose that with a logical argument however well presented, Dawkins' book is good, like his others, not worth the paper it's printed on as far as his opponents stand he's merely preaching to the converted (no pun intended)

    Edited to add: The sweeping statement at the beginning is perhaps a little harsh, there are a couple of religions which probably don't seek to control but rather enpower the individual, Buddhism and Wicca spring to mind, interestingly these consist more of philosophies than rules for life.
     
  12. A few of these wouldnt go amiss then?

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  13. Isn't that what's going on in the Sandpit at the moment?
    NZB
     
  14. Well you know my opinion, we need to turn some parts of the ME into glass to put the pre-medieval savages in their place.

    Sooner or later we'll have to, but thanks to our spineless guardianista kumbaya one world leaders they will have nukes too when we do.

    Great! A religion that glorifies death and is living in the 7th century with nuclear weapons…
     
  15. When I worked In Saudi for BaE, the Arabic years were 1399/1400 and 1401 - in our years, it was 1979-81: says it all, don't it ?
     
  16. I was in Aden in 1966 and built up a prejudice against them there.I know it's wrong and irrational but that was the impression I had from them as a young ordinary seaman.
     
  17. You will get no argument from me on the evils of islam. It is a sick cult based on the dark age ramblings of a homicidal paedophile and has no place in the 21st century. Unforunately it is still with us and growing in influence due to western secularism and political correctness gone mad.
     
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  19. Blessed be the meek for they shall be comforted.

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    LETS BE FRIENDS

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