Man Power............

Having noticed that the waiting times in the Newbie Forums seems to be rather long, can someone explain to me why this is?

People are leaving hand over fist, the Submarine service is desparate for people, I know that RNR Personell are now being taken on full time, I don`t know the numbers but i personally know of one PO Chockhead on HMS Ark Royal, and of a PO Caterer on a Bomber.

My Son a Chief Tiff on Bombers having served 24 years and had signed for a further 10, handed in his notice and starts work in Civvy Street on Nov 3rd, was aked why he didn`t want to join the RNR and become full time,( and you think Newbies ask bone questions)

So if they are so short of people, why are the waiting times so long?

When i joined up it was a matter of weeks, and yes it was a much larger service then, so, why can`t they do it now?


Lantern Swinger
When speaking with the AFCO guys, they said AET's are totally on the other end of the spectrum, and have one of the shortest waiting times compared to others that have anywhere up to 24 months. I've no idea if this is correct, but he said with the introduction of the two new Carriers, for a few trades things are moving faster than usual.

In terms of why the entire process takes so long now, things are just so much more complicated nowadays, the process shouldnt be but we make it. The Navy is ISO 9001/2000 compliant, and has to go through certain procedures etc, which do slow things down. I think with the CTC and other security checks it can take so long. I suppose another thing to factor in nowadays is costs, and the funding we have available.

Just my opinion Higgy, not saying they are fact but just my observation.


Book Reviewer
Guessing to a certain extent here, I think its down to the downsizing of the whole shore base setup. When I joined vertually every branch had its own shore base for training, now its down to a handful which must cause problems and bottlenecks in getting new recruits into the system
Yes i understand that Janner, but, Full time RNR, we are desparate for manpower, people waiting 20 months? FFS i`d have found a better job in that time and told them to ram it. Even 6 months to me is excessive.


War Hero
"I know that RNR Personell are now being taken on full time,"

Are we? I know very experienced RNR personnel who've asked to go full time and been told, go to AFCO, do AIB, do BRNC etc - go back to day 1. That was within the last 12 months.

The RN rightly is reluctant to take RNR personnel full time except through FTRS - I'm RNR and I would be reluctant to see short cuts as 5 years RNR service does not equal 5 years RN service


Lantern Swinger
higthepig said:
Yes i understand that Janner, but, Full time RNR, we are desparate for manpower, people waiting 20 months? FFS i`d have found a better job in that time and told them to ram it. Even 6 months to me is excessive.
Spot on, but even if they are gonna say to someone wait 20 months surly the RN could do something for people in the mean time like training sessions at gyms that are close to careers offices or lectures on naval life! anything to keep peoples intrests and motervation up, just saying well done see ya in a years time seem very harsh to me. For crying out loud 20 months........... ALOT can happen in that space of time
I've no idea why the waiting times are so long for new entries. As you say, we're crying out for people yet can't get you in for 12-24 months. Why?

The FTRS thing is about replacing the more experienced guys that they're losing. Obviously experienced senior rates take time to grow. I know of one guy who has been given an FTRS contract at the age of 57. I have to say though, none of the FTRS personnel I know have been RNR. They've all done their 22, gone outside, and been offered a job to fill a gap.
pompeyexpat said:
.They've all done their 22, gone outside, and been offered a job to fill a gap.
Thats what a few of my old mucka's have done. One a successful land lord too! Barmey - obviously never did the gulf in his first 22!!!!

As for me. They said I couldn't sign on after 40 because I didn't have a passive sonar Qual. So bollocks to em now. (Just as well I was a shit sonar aircrewman.)


War Hero
"OK FTRS, is that not Full Time Reserve Service?"

FTRS is a means of filling short term gaps, or posts that we simply dont have the bodies to fill. Generally speaking FTRS personnel are ex regulars, who rejoin on a limited commitment - meaning no X factor, and no chance of deploying. They do specific jobs where needed, but there are some FTRS jobs done by the RNR - this is rapidly reducing in number though.

Very few (less than 100) RNR personnel are on FTRS at anyone time - the remainder are all ex regular with no commitment to, or involvement with, the RNR.
OK i accept the FTRS i assumed it was like the RNR, plainly I`m wrong on that for which i apologise, but are there enough people want to join, for example how many classes join Raleigh per week?


War Hero
Depends on the nature of their contract - a lot of them join on HC (home commitment) contracts, which mean they cant deploy. Some deploy on full commitment, which is the same as anyone else in the regulars, but these are rarer as they cost more to do.
Most FTRS billets are filled by ex RN, especially in the submarine world, as there is no way a RNR would have the skills/experience to fulfill the roles required of them unless they where ex regular. The RNR FTRS guys tend be employed in training roles, where a lack of relevant skills is less of an issue.There are differing levels of FTRS commitment, most of the blokes applying are only interested in home comitment billets. If you where to volunteer for a sea billet, you'd be better off signing back on again, which I'm aware of at least 2 blokes doing. In the immortal words of a former messmate "The mob would be a great job if you did'nt have to go to sea"
The waiting lists are caused by delays in our much narrower training pipeine. Thanks DTR!
Someone who was also at the initial presentation I went to said he wanted to be an aircraft handler but was told there was over a 2 year wait.On the way out he said he would have to either rethink RN options, or just rethink on whether or not to actually apply.Don't blame him- I wouldn't of applied as ETWE if it was over a 2 yr wait ( I was told 6-8 months-and i think thats a long wait! desp to get in!)
I believe the delay comes from there not being many part 2 training courses; let's say there are only a few phase 2 training courses per year for branch X, then anyone who wants to join that branch will have go into a Raleigh intake which will pass out just as these phase 2 courses start. Otherwise they would pass out of Raleigh then have to wait months for their course during which time they would be of little use to the Service. See?

There are several factors for a shortage of part 2 courses such as cost, lack of instructors etc.

You have to apply for a particular branch also, don't know if this used to be different but you can't just walk into a recruiting office, tell them you want to join the navy and let them put you into whatever branch has the biggest shortage. Then be on a train to Raleigh the following Sunday with just the clothes you stand up in and a rail warrant.

So essentially the RN now relies pretty heavily on very fcuking keen Sea Cadets putting up with the long wait to join.
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