Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by Manny_C, Nov 9, 2008.

Welcome to the Navy Net aka Rum Ration

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial RN website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Has anyone on here suffered as a result of the Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (IOM) collapse?
    If so, what do you think about the actions taken by Darling, Brown & Co in freezing the assets of a liquid bank?
  2. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the Tynwald answerable directly to HM the Q? Have the f**ckwits we vote for any true authority on the Island?
  3. Sorry, thought the thread was about fast food fried chickens
    geoff(ers) :rendeer:
  4. Having done some very brief research lets me see if I have this correct. Folk live on a cold damp Island in the middle of the Irish Sea as it has few of the Social Problems that the mainland suffers from and low to zero taxation. Cost of living and housing is of course more expensive being an Island but you elect your own Government who make their own laws within International Agreements HR etc. and Westminster takes care of Foreign and Defence matters.

    Now after many years of salting away cash that you did not pay tax on or at a much lower rates than Mainland UK, be they personal or company taxes, a bank has gone bust and we the Mainland higher rate tax payers are suppose to bail you out.

    Or have I missed some glaring obvious point.

  5. I thought someone was confused by a kit list :afro:
  6. Nope - I think you've just about got that right. So, was there a question other than how did we allow our Government to get us into that state?

  7. Nice analysis Nutty :) Now for some facts.

    Customer Base:
    KSF IOM has a large number of customers including expatriates and UK residents.
    These customers are not tax evaders. Most of them have banked with KSF (IOM) only because they couldn't open onshore UK accounts because of bizarre UK legislation on money laundering.

    KSF (IOM) depositors pay tax on interest in annual returns or via the European Savings Tax Directive’s withholding

    Bale us out:
    I think it more likely Hell would freeze over before the IOM Government had to be baled out by the UK!
    Offshore financial services generate a staggering amount of wealth.
    Most of this is returned to the UK financial system and herewith lies the problem which brought about the demise of KSF.

    UK Government Actions:
    KSF assets in the UK, but belonging to the IOM based bank, were effectively frozen by the UK Government when KSF (UK) was put into administration.
    Its arguable the UK Government acted illegally. At the very best, its actions might be described as reckless.
    There now seems to be little doubt the actions taken by the UK Government
    directly led to the problems at KSF(IOM).
    Consequently, some KSF(IOM) depositors have formed a pressure group and are petitioning the UK Government
    to unfreeze / return the assets belonging to KSF(IOM).
    No one involved is asking to be bailed out by the UK taxpayer neither is anyone entitled to ask.
    As an interesting aside, KSF(UK) affairs are currently being managed by an administrator. His terms of reference are described as confidential, something which, as far as I am aware, is without precedent.

    You are,however, correct about the weather! Its a cold, wet and windy place to live.

    To get back on topic though: the purpose of my first post was merely to inquire if anyone using this forum had been hurt by the collapse of KSF(IOM) and if so what they thought about the actions of Messrs Darling, Brown and Co in relation to it.

  8. A member of my family moved to IOM and suffered nothing but racist abuse from these so called Manxmen it was so bad it wore him down and he was hospitalised and they had to move back. Manx people have always had this thing that they are extra special.

    Mention the IOM now and he just goes :threaten:

    He stood up for a woman who was being bullied in the workplace she changed sides with it being two against twenty and this really pissed him off. Best thing to come out of the IOM Manx Kippers!!

  9. Cheers Nutty
  10. Good stuff Nutty :)
    Most of it would be true 10 years ago as well.
    I just make my living in offshore financial services so have to deal with it as it is .... not as people think it is :)
    The industry is tightly regulated in the IOM and compliance is a major overhead for all providers.
    Upstreaming is a common business model for offshore operations.
    A large group of SIPP holders, UK residents, find it impossible to get onshore accounts
    Tax liabilities are,as ever, due where the individual is domiciled and should be declared in the jurisdiction where the individual is domiciled.
    KSF(UK) administrators are working under sealed court papers. This is not only a highly unusual level of confidentiality but no one I know in the industry can remember a precedent.
    KSF(IOM) was a viable liquid bank until the UK Government seized its assets.

    It doesnt look as if anyone here (on the forum) was hurt by the UK Goverments actions and Id say thank God for that!

    And its blowing a gale here right now as usual!!

    Cheers (and how are things in sunny Spain?)
  11. Manny

    Still sunny here, I hope it improves in SE England where I arrive on Sunday.

    Now we both know that KSF(IOM) and KSF(UK) are separate companies and neither are responsible for the others debts. Anymore than Halifax PLC part of HBOS and Banco Halifax Hispana SA also part of HBOS would offer to pay the debts etc of the other if one was placed into receivership or administration. This is the real world not Investment Advisor's Speak.

    Certainly in Spain and other EU States you can elect to continue to pay you tax in the UK if that where you take you income from or Spain. Income earned in Spain has to have the tax paid in Spain if you are a resident. How many ex-UK Mainland Residents elect to keep payng tax on the Mainland????????????????????????????

    You keep on talking about UK residents do you mean that people who reside on the Mainland and pay there tax to London or are you referring to residents of IOM, Channel Islands etc who in general pay lower rates of tax.

    SIPP. Self Invested Pension Plan. i.e. the investor chooses where to invest their money or use an adviser and have to take responsibility for their actions not the Government of England and Wales i..e. Westminster.

  12. To be honest Nutty I dont think much progress has been made in recovering the funds belonging to KSF(IOM).
    Its all a bit of a mess which will probably end up being resolved in court.
    In the meantime KSF(IOM) still hasnt been liquidated but cant continue as a bank. In limbo in other words.
    Its beginning to look as if the IOM regulators (FSC) and the UK regulators (FSA) between them had decided the operation in Iceland had become too risky.
    Consequently all funds were transferred to the KSF(UK) bank which was then promptly shut down by the UK Government before any more transfers could be made.
    In addition it looks as if a large amount of money has been frozen in the clearing system.
    So basically the UK Government acted to protect UK account holders but in doing so trapped a large amount of cash in transit which belongs to KSF(IOM) depositors. Most people think this was reckless behaviour on the part of the UK Government.
    No winners here I think apart from the administrators and lawyers.
    The folks who held deposits there are left high and dry. You have to feel for them.
    Regarding the UK residents thing Im talking about people resident in the UK (the mainland) and who also pay UK tax.... (the crown dependencies including IOM are not part of the UK)
    Although there isnt any law preventing onshore banks from accepting SIPP deposits (held in trust) in practice its almost impossible. So they mostly have to go offshore
    See this link.
    House of Commons
    So these people, as well, have been left high and dry and it doesnt look as if they will be covered by the IOM compensation scheme.
    Regarding the tax arrangement you mentioned ..yes people can elect to pay a with holding tax in return for their details not being revealed. This is currently set at 20% but is planned to grow to 35% over the next few years.

    Im guessing offshore stuff might come to an end at some point.
    Lets face it your money isnt safe offshore when the s**t hits the fan.
    Either that or disappear off to some exotic but less well regulated location.

    At which point I shall be joining the queue for the ferry back to the UK from whence I came!! Back to London area probably.
    Ive had 10 good years here though so cant complain. ....
    Except about the weather ...still blowing a gale.

Share This Page