Discussion in 'Royal Naval Reserve (RNR)' started by trehorn2, Mar 4, 2007.

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  1. Well ladies and gentlemen, we have all seen the many different threads on this website about the failure of JPA. Most of us have experienced the problems with JPA.

    So i am now making a plea to anyone who is in a position of authority who reads these posts to pleeeeaaaase do something about it!

    Its bad enough that we reservists experience this problem but the fact that the regulars of all armed forces who are serving in combat zones around the world are also experiencing the same problems is completely inexcusable. Their mortgages rely on it!

    If i worked at McDonalds i would be paid more money, on time and the food would be a damn site better too!

    If this were, as some people try to suggest, a part time job then why are we not getting paid anything like the right money in anything like the right time frame.

    What makes it worse is the fact that we are expected to input this information into the system on a drill night. We have 2 hours, some people instruct, we have compulsary presentations, compulsary lectures, NFT, WHT, BHT etc etc. Please tell me when the hell i'm supposed to find time to input this information, especially when the fecking thing is off line for a hell of a lot of the time!
  2. JPA goes down for maintenance for preceisly the period of my drill night. Terrific. I haven't logged in yet.

    Unfortunately I think the people who can really fix JPA's problems are in the civvie firm that provided it - the best that the more senior members of the Forces can do is confront them (Oracle? - the database company) about the problems and ask for them to be fixed.

    Sub-contracting in all its glory. :roll:
  3. Py the power of deduction, I assume by that, that your drill night is a thursday evening!
  4. EDS actually, they've been running all three armed forces pay for about 8 years now.

    Trehorn, I'd just re-iterate the point made in another thread, the only way to deal with it is through the proper channels; state a complaint through the div system. In fact everyone who is affected in this way could do the same thing. If that means everyone in the unit then so be it.... Of course usual caveats apply, each complaint is a distinct instance and there should be no collective drafting of the complaints etc.

    Without some evidence from those affected then anything from the service is just griping and won't be taken seriously, although I get the impression that even valid concerns aren't being taken that seriously by AFPAA!

    I'd suggest that you suggest to the XO that s/he call the RN Focal Point, at Whaley, to discuss the problems that the unit are experiencing.
  5. FlagWagger

    FlagWagger Book Reviewer

    Typo fixed.

    EDS have also been responsible for a number of other high profile computer software screw ups such as the CSA system and a now abandoned Tax Credit system for HMRC; given the track record of EEDS on major PFI contracts, why the hell did the Government think that JPA would be any different?
  6. Probably because they'll have come in with the cheapest bid.........
  7. You forgot the NHS IT system that cost £90 million, and was binned. Good to know our pay is in safe hands :roll:
  8. Wasn't that Accenture?

    Northern project, it's been taken on by CSC, who are involved in Bowman I think.

    A friend was with ACN at the time, hated it. Same problems as MOD, p!ss poor requirements management, continual scope creep, lack of a clear understanding of what they were trying to achieve....
  9. EDS had a 10 year contract to supply an e-mail service to 1.2 million NHS workers in 2004 but the NHS pulled out due to "delays" and other issues.


    But you're probably right in that the specs may have been badly written and the usual "feature creeps" that are loved by government agencies.
  10. I voted yes for the following simple reason. It was not designed with "Attendence Based Pay Personell" in mind. We should have stayed off it until it was designed to deal with us. Stand by for a lot of fun when it comes to Bounty Time.

    If there is an delay or reduction or even cofusion over me getting my bounty i'm outa here til its sorted.

    In fact, if they don't sort out my bloody pay i'm out til they do! Everything takes too long!
  12. wave_dodger

    wave_dodger War Hero Book Reviewer

    Pointless shooting at EDS, who else would you have contracted? Fujitsu, BAe, SCS, SCC, Thales, CAP-GEMINI, LOGICA.... Choose anyone and I can come back with an example of where they have failed to deliver on a project. IT projects and government rarely work out because Government does not know how to contract properly and in the JPA case this is doubly so, EDS and ORACLE advised against making the type of changes to a COTS product that they wanted. MoD in its infinite wisdom pushed ahead and demanded ever aggressive implementation dates even when EDS wanted to slow down and get it right. A rare day for me to defend a private compancy, especially our Texan chums, but there it is.

    You only have to look at how many blue chip enterprises actually succesfully use Oracle HR to realise its not the product thats at fault.

    On another tangent then - if the system is down during the 2 hrs you are in for a drill night. (some things have changed then since I last worked in an RTC, people used to come in early to bleat at the PSI's, book courses, do admin etc - all working to rule now?) Why now get the RTC staff to move to a JPA deployed basis and use forms or the e-forms that are available and process claims that way?

    If problems have got that bad get the XO to make contact with the RN Focal Point in FLEET HQ. The Cdr and his team will then be tasked to look at your specific issues. I would suggest getting COMMARRES involved too.
  13. If it requires no manual intervention, and it's up and running, you input your details and the money is in your bank 2-3 days later. Therefore I'm in favour of it. Its when it gets rejected for some reason, and it requires you to resubmit, thus sitting there for another week, that bugs me.
  14. Not knowing what i have been paid for is quite irritating. I know i have money outstanding but i dont know what for.

    On the point of coming in early unfortunatley not everyone can.

    Its not the people who are at fault - it would appear that it is the system.
  15. wave_dodger

    wave_dodger War Hero Book Reviewer

    I've got to say I use JPA lots, I probably submit 5-6 minor claims a week or 3-4 major ones per month. All of my unit, which is joint, travel extensively and work odd hours, JPA has been a real blessing. Sure we've had some issues, I lost all of my staff - no drama's we just spoke to each other to sort out leave and other things, I lost all record of my deployments to Telic and Herrick last year because the PAS import was corrupt. But 90% of the time its been much better than we expected and we like it, its a bit difficult at times but we're getting used to it.

    For al the people that bleat about it I just have to think how often did I ever go to the ships/upo in the past and need the Writers to sort something out - less and less the longer I served I guess is the answer. Since JPA has come along I think I've been in 3 times to hand in audits, twice about medal applications and thats about it.

    I'm actually looking forward to appraisals coming online, should make my life easier. As far as we're concerned JPA whilst far from perfect is ok. (and yes I have had the random pay deductions - but I had those under the old system too!)
  16. Thats the first positive thing i've seen about JPA. I havent had many problems, but then, i haven't had anything to claim yet!

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