IRAN, The RN and a straight talking Torygraph

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by F169, Apr 10, 2007.

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  1. This from today's Torygraph by an ex-cavalry officer, tells a few home truths about the MOD and senior management, not all of them palatable.

    It includes some contentious statements: "The rush to judgment by the First Sea Lord, Admiral Sir Jonathon Band, who endorsed their action in a painful interview with John Humphrys on Friday's Today programme, and by personally shaking hands with the returning sailors and Marines, is puzzling to say the least. Was it embarrassment at the failures at the strategic (MOD) and operational (theatre) levels?";jsessionid=GRWNMIE5GKDRNQFIQMFSFFWAVCBQ0IV0?xml=/opinion/2007/04/10/do1001.xml
  2. A very interesting read.Good link cheers.
  3. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    Rather interestingly, my perception is that Navy is no worse off as the MOD's dithering and ever changing location of the goalposts (not dissimilar to Iran's supposed GPS variance of the "offending" Boarding Party) tends to make the MOD look like a bunch of clowns and draws the flack. The other observation is that much as the "brave" commentators from yesteryear despair the antics of the Cornwall"decapentet", it is worth considering that we, and they, raised them, indulged them & trained them in that manner. You reap what you sow.
  4. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    Wot? No-one going to shoot me down in fiery pooh for my last post?
  5. Bang! Bang! Ooh what a stink! :D
  6. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    That's better WM!
  7. Read the replies to the Torygraph article Ninj, and you'll find the answer to your question is probably NO!

  8. IMHO the other papers are only going to town because they didn't get the exclusive from Faye. If the mail had have got the story you wouldn't have heard a peep out of Littlejohn.
  9. Seadog

    Seadog War Hero Moderator

    Better still is this blog from the Daily Telegraph's Toby Harnden. TH is ex RN and (not that it matters because it was so long ago ) served in/on HMS Cornwall.

    Toby Harnden Telegraph Online

    To begin with I didn't grudge any of the captives payment for their story but the affair is become more cringeworthy by the day. Opinion under review bearing in mind; I wasn't there.
  10. I wonder how long before we see the iPod endorsement advert? :?
  11. Interesting that the Rt. Hon. Desmond Henry Browne MP has performed one of the best examples of slopey shouldering that I have seen for a while. His staff blithely state that the decision to allow the sale of these sorry tales was made by the Royal Navy alone. Nothing to see here, move along please.

    Which begs the further question of why Vice-Admiral Adrian Johns RN rubber-stamped the decision. With leadership like this it is little wonder that the fiasco in the Shat al-Arab was allowed to happen. He's from Redruth which is notorious for having a limited gene-pool so maybe that's the answer. Not the Royal Navy's finest hour and these results are the accumulation of many years of politically correct and muddled thinking by Royal Naval senior officers.

    There is now a choice for the Navy; either a robust enquiry that kicks ass and takes names or a continuation of cover-up and deny.

    There is a quote over on ARRSE that may sting a few people but which sums things up "This whole episode doesn't raise questions about women on ops, it raises questions about fat semi-literate chavs being put in positions of responsibility."

  12. chieftiff

    chieftiff War Hero Moderator

    Whilst agreeing with your sentiment, and having read the thread to which you refer I don't think that comment, taken in the context it was written is at all fair. Personal attacks on the L/S are at the least unfair, ARRSE members (some not all) have decided to attack her for her inability to communicate effectively amongst other things. I missed the interview on TV but here is an extract from this in the telegraph :;jsessionid=BR4QITPU5WOPXQFIQMFSFF4AVCBQ0IV0?xml=/news/2007/04/10/nhostage110.xml

    "With a blindfold on, I was led away from the rest of the guys," she said. "All I could hear from behind me was one of them shout, 'They're going to execute us'. It was the first time I got really scared. I genuinely believed they might do it. That was my lowest moment. All I could think about was how alone I was. They could do anything now and nobody would know. I just totally lost it."

    Her thoughts turned to her husband Adam and their daughter. "All I could think of was what my family must be going through. Did they even know I was missing? I cried my eyes out."

    In solitary confinement, her days were spent counting the 135 bricks in her cell walls and the 274 and a half squares in the carpet. At night she was blindfolded and led to an interrogation room. "They asked which were my ship's ports of call, where were other coalition ships in the Gulf, how do Royal Navy ships protect themselves, how do we communicate, what was the US doing?

    "That could have put my colleagues at risk, and there was no way in hell I was ever going to do that, no matter what they did. I told them, 'how do I know? I'm just the bloody boat driver'. I tried to play the dumb blonde," she said.

    Seems reasonable to me when edited by a professional journalist, her inability to effectively communicate on National TV is not a fair representation of her thoughts or deeds!

    Bergen if you were being subtle and using that quote to infer other "chavs" in positions of responsibility I wind my neck in!
  13. The ARRSE quote is specific to the LS but I was trying to use it more generally. I think that the behaviour of these servicemen when in Iraq was understandable [although I hope that in the same situation I would have behaved differently]. It is their behaviour on their return to the UK [aided and abetted by MoD] that has riled the public. It couldn't have been juxtaposed at a worst time for the Royal Navy with the tragic deaths of our army colleagues in the Warrior IED blast.

    Compare the dignity with which the parents of the dead soldiers have acted with the general behaviour of the Royal Navy and it is tragic. The British people have historically had a huge affection for the Navy but this nonsense does nothing to help.

  14. A comment in the Telegraph I liked this week said something in the region of "The Iranians have done in 13 days what the opposition have failed to do since 1997, Show that the government are a bunch of indecisive, weak, incompetent half-wits"

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