If these are Navy Leaders, we really are sunk

#43
At the end of the day, Mr Toms giving his opinion of today's RN is only as valid as me giving my opinion about his dark ages RN. Time moves on. People move on. Maybe Nelson would look at Toms's RN and utter equally scathing remarks.

As for the other's comments about Cornwall's crew members "being allowed to be captured", what would he do when faced with numerous heavy weapons and faster boats? Thrown his uckers pieces at them and hoped for the best? Imbecile.

Pinch of salt taken, let's move on.
 
B

Billy Q

Guest
#46
How many sailors lives are some cows worth?
A short while ago, I listened to the CEO of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency speaking at Trinity House of the SAR role they had taken over from the military.
He (a former Second Sea Lord) related the history of expensive SAR helicopters from Culdrose and elsewhere risking all to rescue dogs from beach-side cliffs. He gave the figures that were alarming. No problem for pusser aircrew to risk their lives there. Just cows presumably.
 
#47
A short while ago, I listened to the CEO of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency speaking at Trinity House of the SAR role they had taken over from the military.
He (a former Second Sea Lord) related the history of expensive SAR helicopters from Culdrose and elsewhere risking all to rescue dogs from beach-side cliffs. He gave the figures that were alarming. No problem for pusser aircrew to risk their lives there. Just cows presumably.
And your point is?
Edited to add. It's ok I've got your point. You are showing us the sort of circles you move in. I'm inpressed
 
G

guestm

Guest
#49
What the fuck is this thread about?

Mr Toms, whoever he is got his info about today's leaders from a heavily edited TV show.

Norman then decides he likes this so half arses a thread about it then backs himself up with his other logins.

As for Mr Toms: Stick to saving cows pal, you're clueless.
 

Ninja_Stoker

War Hero
Moderator
#51
A short while ago, I listened to the CEO of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency speaking at Trinity House of the SAR role they had taken over from the military.
He (a former Second Sea Lord) related the history of expensive SAR helicopters from Culdrose and elsewhere risking all to rescue dogs from beach-side cliffs. He gave the figures that were alarming. No problem for pusser aircrew to risk their lives there. Just cows presumably.
Post #9 refers.
 
#53
"Peter Toms didn't.
I added his Citation to show that he was a man of some merit and his views on today's navy worthy of being read.
Disagree with him if you will, but do not attempt to impugn a modest, decent man with your desire to prove him wrong."


The only person I'd impugn is you and your confused attempts to make a point by using someone else's words and then using their citation as your opening gambit to really make sure we have no idea what you're going on about. I have no desire to prove him wrong because (a)it is his opinion, not necessarily fact and you cannot 'prove' an opinion wrong and (b)I never said I disagreed with what he said because, frankly, I really, really don't care.

What you have done is use his citation and make it look as if he has written to the Daily Mail's letter section in order to laud his achievements. Of course, he's done nothing of the sort but it's your idiotic post that just served to confuse anyone who read it and make Peter Toms look a bit of a knob, which he clearly isn't. The same cannot be said of you :mad:
 
#55
Remember those horror movies where the ventriloquist's dummy turns on the owner and takes control of his life, or kills him, or commits crimes and gets the owner arrested?

I think that's what's happened with Norman's sock puppets...
 

Subsunk

Lantern Swinger
Book Reviewer
#58
FOR the past five weeks I’ve watched the Monday evening TV documentary about the Royal Navy School and tried to remain impartial and remember that ‘times change and things move on’. But I’m still concerned about the quality and standard of leadership displayed by the officers, senior rates and instructor staff at HMS Raleigh. As an ex-HMS Ganges and HMS Raleigh boy, of 1958-9, I cringe every time one of the instructors tries to impress his/her authority on the assembled recruits. Not one of them, from the senior officer in charge of training, to the senior rates, would have been acceptable as an instructor in my training years. What on earth has happened to the leadership courses officers and senior rates were expected to attend and pass? If those on display are an example of today’s leaders, Heaven help the Royal Navy. It would appear that the only qualities now required are an ability to scream and shout, make unfunny remarks and swear a lot. It’s small wonder the trainees are finding it difficult to understand what’s expected of them. Not one of the instruction staff has displayed any leadership quality. None has any presence, quiet authority, dignity or humility when dealing with trainees who are obviously struggling. All they seem to have is an ability to wreck a trainee’s bedding and kit — and make the usual smart-alec, puerile remarks. Their childish antics in the instructors’ staff room wouldn’t look out of place in a kindergarten. I’m incensed at how the Royal Navy I loved and served in for 25 years is being portrayed to the nation. As an indication of the way in which leadership in the service has been deteriorating, we need look no further than 2007 and the disgraceful HMS Cornwall — when 15 RN and Royal Marine personnel, seven of whom were officers and non-commissioned officers, aboard two rigid hulled inflatable vessels, were captured and detained by the Iranians. These personnel allowed themselves to be seized by the Iranians and kept prisoner for 12 days. At no time did any of the senior personnel involved display any kind of leadership. The writing on the wall was clearly there for all to see. Someone in the Admiralty should have had the gumption to conclude: ‘There’s something damned wrong with our leaders.’ The HMS Raleigh TV programme stands out as a dazzling beacon to this conclusion.
If you were to watch any given 'Mad Max' film, I assume you'd get all angry and stuff because of the poor levels of road safety on display, lack of seatbelt use and high likelihood that none of the vehicles were insured.
 
#60
I saw my second ship on that Danaë, I was through drafted from Gurkha in 76, we then went to Rio to meet the train robber
 
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