Help the white working class

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by slim, Oct 28, 2008.

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  1. Yes I know it's the "Mail" but at last it seems that the working man (I don't believe that white needed to be used as the problems are the same for all colours).

    Help the white working class or risk surge in far-Right extremists, says equalities chief
    By Benedict Brogan

    Trevor Phillips said the white working classes should be given more support to prevent right-wing extremism
    Britain risks a surge in Right-wing extremism if it fails to help its white working class weather the recession, the equalities chief will warn today.

    Trevor Phillips will break with years of political convention to call for the law to be changed to enshrine positive discrimination in favour of disadvantaged whites.

    His startling intervention in the race debate is a rebuke to Harriet Harman, who earlier this year trumpeted plans to make companies discriminate in favour of women and ethnic minorities.

    Mr Phillips said ministers should allow councils and education authorities to introduce 'positive action' programmes aimed specifically at young whites unable to compete with highly skilled immigrants because the 'need is so great'.

    And he warned that immigration has fuelled 'resentments that are real and should not be dismissed – resentments felt by white, black and Asian'.

    The chairman of the Equalities and Human Rights Commission set out his thinking to the Daily Mail ahead of his appearance at a CBI event on immigration today alongside immigration minister Phil Woolas.

    Mr Phillips said failure to help white families hit by the downturn could drive them into the arms of far-Right parties similar to those that have brought turmoil to Austria, Belgium and Holland.

    He also warned that ministers needed to acknowledge the resentment by some whites over what they see as unfair help given to blacks and Asians.

    'What we are seeing is that there is a whole group of people, a large proportion of whom are white, who are going to suffer from this crisis who are going to be the people we should want to help, particularly because they come from the wrong side of town,' he said.

    'We are going to have to do something special for them. We are going to have to put extra resources where young people can't compete with migrants' skills.

    'And in some parts of the country, it is clear that what defines disadvantage won't be black or brown, it will be white. And we will have to take positive action to help some white groups, what we might call the white underclass.'

    And he warned: 'We know what the political consequences are because we have seen it on the Continent.

    'If we ignore the fact some white groups are going to be disadvantaged we will end up with the same kind of conflicts we have seen in Austria, Belgium and now Holland, where the anti-immigrant racist Right-wing parties get a big boost.

  2. Surprised the Mail would be concerned by the idea of more far-right extremism. Thought that was their bag.
  3. I don't believe that such action is required, I simply believe that we need to have race and gender blind recruitment policies. The best person for the job should get it, as simple as that. An end is needed to quotas, there is simply no logic to employing someone simply because they meet a politically correct ideal rather than have the best ability to complete the job.
  4. I think we need to return to the old values. As you say, best qualified gets the job. Unfortunately in recent years we have seen positive discrimination aimed at recruiting more from the ethnic minorities into many government departments (I include police and fire brigade). This must be stopped, if the guy from the ethnic minority is the best person qualified then fantastic, employ him. But don't employ him just to fill quota's.
  5. Slim, the danger with this approach, whilst laudible, is that you may end up with a workforce with no white working class people in it! :biggrin:

    Seriously though, where I work our employers not-infrequently complain that the staff in certain departments (like my own) only represent a narrow strata of society, which is true. The problem is that the pay is so low that the only people who apply for the (mostly graduate entry) jobs either have private means/income or are subsidised by their partner - and all that despite the availability of access to grace-and-favour homes in London. Sometimes positive discrimination is needed (and pay suppliments) to attract a more socially representative workforce. After all, you have to erode the ivory towers somehow! :roll:

    PS: I would always positivly discriminate in favour of ex-matelots.... especially ex-G Spotty types :w00t: ...oh and Scouse, who I regard as an Hontrog. :biggrin:
  6. Considering it is the fault of the white all to ofeten not working class that the nation is in the state it is, perhaps that is something that could be considered a positive out come. After all who did the immigrant benefit scrounger learn their craft from.

    Perhaps if the government could acually get rid of the many redundant civil serpents it has no work for but still paying a full wage to in case they can find work for them, perhaps they might be able to pay something more like a living wage. Equally if the gold plated pensions were being brough more into line with the pension expectations of those who were paying for them perhaps there would be a bit more cash in the pay pot and an ever so slightly smaller national debt.

    Mr Brown's smoke and mirror show has finally reached the end of the road.
  7. Clearly a rather questionable Police Commander disagrees with the apparent consensus.

    It rather smacks to me of the former Old School Tie job appointments that used to seen. Clearly he does not believe that the best man should get the job, just the man that is the same race and belief system as him.
  8. Gay public sector workers until recently had to take out private pension plans to provide for their partners should they die first and to cover for the fact that until recently you could be sacked from the civil service simply for being gay and stripped of your entire pension. That is on top of paying 3.5% of salary for the public sector pension, which still makes it optional whether to pay a pension to a surviving civil partner (in our workplace scheme). They have to prove hardship & need! Pity married straights aren't treated the same way - that really would get everyone het up. What I gain from paying above the odds in pension contributions (to the limit) will be taken away in the state pension clawback. :pissedoff:
  9. I'm a straight type[too old to be anything else!] and I can say with complete certainty that if my house was on fire I'd welcome any straight/Gay/black/ oriental/eskimo/lesbian/ fire fighter to get my sorry arse out of there.
    Can some-one please tell that stupid harpy Harriet woman?
    If you can do the job get on with it,don't expect favours because of race/colour/gender etc.
    I think eventually it will sort itself out,I hope so as it's stupid at the moment.
  10. The Politicians could not care less who get the jobs really,but they do want votes.They think the ethnic minorities and immigrants will vote for them if they are given favourable treatment.They might be right.They also reckon that the White Working Class vote is almost certain to be Labour however chill the economic wind is blowing.
  11. Thingy:
    As I recall being fired for being gay was stopped in the Civil Service many years ago,I think officially in the Eighties,but it was not enforced for many years before official removal as a cause for dismissal.When I joined in the Seventies there was a question on the security papers about sexuality,but that was dropped shortly after I joined.
  12. Wrong band wagon this time, the same retrictions on who gets what from the pension pot applies to ordinary gays as well as civil serpent gays, and for what you get a notional 3.5% deduction from pay is bl**dy good value for money, like most people I have more than that actually deducted from my pay and get less back in pension after more years, and ceratinly the last time I checked you needed a marriage certifificate to get anything for a partner, and as our final salary scheme is now closed I suspect the rules remain the same. However you look at it your pesion scheme beats the socks of any thing us normal mortals can get.
  13. The old Plod Pension scheme gave you 50% of basic pay after 25 years or 66.33% of basic pay after 30 years but you have to pay 11% of your pay towards that. That scheme, PPS, was closed about 1989 now there is a lesser pay out scheme.

  14. Out of curiosity, why does a workplace need to be socially representative? Surely as long as the workforce do their jobs well and get along, does it really matter if they are all in the old boys club or from all different corners of the earth?
  15. Well said. Best person for the job. End of chat.

    I do believe that most sensible people don't actually care what colour your skin is, which god you worship or which half of the species you go to bed with. It should only become an issue in the work place if/when it directly affects your work.
  16. There is a possibly not unreasonable feeling that if the whole of society is paying then all parts should benefit, equally where a group deals with the public having a mix that ensures that all groups peculiar fealings are understood has potential benefits.

    On the other hand probably having a good representation of the various groups is perhaps not the greatest overiding factor in selecting an employee, I would put actually being able to do the job a bit heigher up my list.

  17. Some places of employment have a social cachet to them and people work there for the atmosphere, possibilities of moving on to something better via contacts, they like to be at the centre of the universe, etc. Many of these places pay poor wages to all but the top 10%. or dish out honours and a good life style. The Royal Palaces, Westminster, White House etc. As Thingy said many are on around £20.000 not a wage that you can afford to live or commute into central London, buy or rent property and support a family which many do unless they have other means. This tends to make it a club for the reasonably well off and connected.

    And so the old boys upper middle class network continues as it has for hundreds of years. Ask Admiral West.

  18. Are you working for Norma these days Nutty?

  19. No I am ********

  20. The mean full-time salary (as against the much publicised average) is around £16.5K a year for a graduate with 2 years service and a grade 3 mark in their annual report, rising to £22K after 20 years service... thought this is in the process of change.... :roll: Of course this is only sustainable because they rely on upper middle class recruits for the junior posts or working class recruits with well paid partners. Nutty is right though about the kinds of people who elect to do these jobs.

    Of course, I'm solidly working class.... 'cause I work for a living! :thumright:

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