Global warming/ "Green" Car Tax

#21
Charzlo said:
drunken_engineer said:
Duly signed as a 4x4 driver and one who is thoroughly p!ssed off with the whole "Save the Planet" movement. Not sure what good it'll do though - politicians never go back on a money spinning idea once announced. Let's face it - if you can afford one, you can probably afford to tax one. Ergo the hike in road tax.
We should be publicising the fact that global warming is a natural phenomenon AND the very obvious fact that is it GLOBAL.
One wonders if, when the global temperatures show a slight drop - as they are expected to do in some quarters, we'll get the money back? Now that'll be a laugh......

Question where do you drive your 4X4 ???

:bball:
Off road...and on. I live in the sticks on the sunny IOW.
 
#22
sussex2 said:
Governments in the UK and other countries are jumping on the 'Global Whingeing' band wagon to extract more taxes; it is as simple as that and won't make one jot of difference when countries such as India and China are no longer content to ride around on bikes and have nothing more than a slap in the face and a bowl of rice for lunch.
If the UK thinks it can 'save the world' from a natural phenomena then so be it.
I went to buy a new car yesterday and the salesman happily started it up in the showroom saying 'Trust me my friend the air this thing chucks out is much cleaner than what is outside those (air conditioned and sealed) doors. As a jest I asked him what he thought of the Toyota Prius and he gave me a look only a Catalan knows how!

My dear chap, maybe we should get together for a beer or 2 and plan the anti-green revolution. Get ctfairway along too. Good luck in the snow.
D-E
 
#23
I drive my 4x4 on a road…

So it's a 4x4… so what? What the muppets ranting about 4x4's forget is that my Honda CRV has exactly the same 2.0l iVTEC engine as a Honda Accord saloon and no ones screeching ban saloons to protect fvcking Polar Bears. :threaten:
 
#24
Oil_Slick said:
I drive my 4x4 on a road…

So it's a 4x4… so what? What the muppets ranting about 4x4's forget is that my Honda CRV has exactly the same 2.0l iVTEC engine as a Honda Accord saloon and no ones screeching ban saloons to protect fvcking Polar Bears. :threaten:

Yet !!

I'm sure Liebour are hatching something still to come.

Hutton, Straw and Balls seem to think that they are exempt from this !!
 

ctfairway

Lantern Swinger
#25
Oil_Slick said:
I drive my 4x4 on a road…

So it's a 4x4… so what? What the muppets ranting about 4x4's forget is that my Honda CRV has exactly the same 2.0l iVTEC engine as a Honda Accord saloon and no ones screeching ban saloons to protect fvcking Polar Bears. :threaten:
I totally agree with you but would point out that although a very nice car, the Honda CRV is not a proper 4x4. It has very limited ground clearance, no low ratio box and the same towing ability as the average family car. If you need to go off road, extract yourself from a sea of mud and tow decent trailers you need a car with high ground clearance and diff locks that will tow upwards of 3 tons and that limits you to cars like the Disco, Defender, Shogun, Trooper. Land Cruiser, L200. Navara etc all of which will be paying upwards of £400+ road tax post 2009 under Darlings new proposals even if they are several years old. Everyone up here on the moors has one of these cars because they need them to exist - why should they be hit with these punative taxes just because they live in the sticks? It is utterly pathetic of Darling to tell them to "choose a low carbon emitting car". They cant afford to change cars and anyway as I have pointed out there are no low carbon cars that will do the job.

JOIN THE REVOLUTION!!!
 
#26
The only muppets on here are the ones blinded by the materialistic view of owning a 4X4 as a status symbol.

I can give you a few disadvantages of driving them my children.

1. The typical milage of one of these things is 12.1 Miles per gallon to 25 Miles per gallon.
if you do 20 miles per day over a year the 12.1Mile per gallon tin can costs about £2080 to fill it up each year.

Consider a smaller car doing 65 miles per galon over the same distance annual running cost £420

2. If you hit someone in one of theses 3 ton tin cans the guy you hit is a dead man.

3. The population of earth doubled from 3 billion to 6 billion from 1960 to the year 2000. here you have an extra bunch of 40 year olds driving many of which are driving around in these environment death traps.

You all say BUT WHATS THAT GOT TO DO WITH IT.

Well, you have more people driving.

Guess what?
These 4x4s are between one fifth up to and over one half the length of a smaller car and as much wider.
They are heavier

This creates less parking spaces on over crowded streets and towns
they look an eyesore in the environment.

Anyone owning a Honda CRV needs their heads examining.

By the way i live on the Isle of Man and are roads are full of them.

On in five of our population drive these over sized tin cans and when i am out walking i can smell the fumes up to 2 minutes after they have passed me.

My advice to you all is get the hell rid of them.

Seeing them, looks like a load of tanks trundling down the roads in peace time UK. Rediculous.
The fuel they burn is going into the environment. 5 times more pollution

Get shut of them.

Love,

Mike :)
 

janner

MIA
Book Reviewer
#27
I've got two 4 x 4, brilliant motors and if you don't walk or drive in my path I won't knock you over.

Both of mine give a return of around 30 MPH, but I suspect that my carbon footprint is a lot smaller than yours, I don't take foreign holidays nor do I go to and fro to the IoM. My total annual mileage both on and off road is less than 10,000.
 
#28
Well all I can say is drive an MGB ... chucks out CO2 like it was going out of fashion ... makes a noise like a chieften tank coming along the road ....and because it's pre '72 the daft Barstewards GIVE you the road tax as its an historic vehicle! Jobs a Good'un!
 
#29
Part of an email i sent the IOM Government

1. Four Wheel drives and people carriers take up more space when parked in streets or on the promenade or in a car park because they are between a fifth, third and half a length extra in length compared to a smaller car such as a Ford KA or Nissan Micra etc. On average if you had 300 four wheel drives and people carriers parked along the promenade, you could get 400 smaller cars in their place. This is a clear disadvantage because the Islands streets and carparks are already over loaded.

2. We have already seen the running costs, in the fact that they are inefficient at getting from A to B due to their low milage and higher fuel costs.

3. They compromise safety, they are higher, wider and longer, so therefore a driver of a smaller car cannot see clearly to the left or right and cannot see over them when stuck behind these vehicles, and this is particularly evident at a halt sign.

4. If one of these vehicles crashes into a driver of a smaller car, or a pedestrian, the accidents are usually fatal due to the weight and size of these vehicles.
I know a girl that was knocked off a motorbike by one of these cars and was killed. She was only 20 years of age. There have been other fatalities here involving these vehicles.

5. When reversing one of these vehicles, it is sometimes impossible to see a small child that maybe behind one.

6 There is the pollution aspects of these vehicles to be taken into consideration and the affects on peoples health and effect on the environment.

7. Because of their weight and amount of these vehicles on our islands roads they can over time damage our roads, thus putting up road taxes.

8. Fuel allowances from the Government and firms are high in cost, and this has to be paid for by more expensive goods or higher costs to the tax payers.

9. If the Government does not take action now, the Isle of Man will get gridlocked with them, with an ever increasing demand for wider roads and more car parking spaces.
This is evident already, as more and more are being parked on narrow roads and cars being driven are already having to stop to give way to traffic coming from the opposit direction with sometimes near accidents. These cars having to stop and move off again, means more fuel is being used.

10. People carriers are designed to carry about 7 people, the ones on this Island have between 1 and 2 people occupying them, so they are not being used efficiently.
These are only useful to taxi firms or handicapped services.

11. 4X4s are being driven around the Isle of Man for leisure, such as shopping, going to work and picking up children from school, when they were primarily designed to go off road, transport ammunitions and heavy equipment, so therefore they are not being used by the Manx Public for what they were intended for.

My Solution:

To begin to reduce these vehicles from our Island's roads:


PLAN A For a 5 year trial period The Democratic Approach showing Government inniative

1. Education: Inform the peoople of this island on the annual running costs of these cars by a typical millage of going from Peel to Douglas or Douglas to Ramsey in cars that do 12 to 25 miles per gallon compared with that of cars that do 40 to 65 miles per gallon and Include some or all of my points above, by press, magazines and even phone book and Radio advertising or any other means of getting the message across to the Manx Public.

2. Raise the car tax on the above type vehicles and at the same time reduce the tax on the smaller cars typically between 1L to 1.6L as an incentive for people to move over to smaller cars, at the same time do not increase the road tax on say taxi firms or those who can prove genuine legitimate reasons for needing these vehicles.

3. Set up a scheme whereby people with these large vehicles can receive a grant towards a smaller car, in which ever way you see fit. The level of this grant would have to be refined by the Government. One idea could be that people hand in these vehicles in the understanding that they use this money to buy a smaller car within the range 1L to 1.6L. These stockpiled vehicles could then be recycled in which ever way so that the Government receive revenue in return.

4. Promote car sharing if possible.

5. Improve public transport.


If in 5 years this fails to address the ever increasing amounts of these large vehicles on our Island's roads, then another plan could be adopted, which is:

Plan B over a 5 years period a more enforced approach showing Government Leadership

1. Ban the imports of these vehicles into the Island by not allowing garages to sell them to the public.

2. Only allow eg. Taxi firms or the Emergency services such as the Coastguards or those who can prove genuine legitimate reasons for needing them to order them from specialist suppliers.

3. Give everyone 5 years to get rid of the ones that they have, by either having them scrapped or handed in towards a grant for a smaller car (See point 3 above)
 
#32
Forget Global Warming and Climate Change for a minute.

There are plenty of reasons why driving around in 4x4s should be out lawed.

1. They weigh typically 3 ton and if hit by one you have no chance of survival.

2. They do between 12.1 miles per gallon to 25 miles per gallon so cost up to 5 times as much in fuel costs

3. They are higher and wider than other vehicles and cause restricted vision to other road users.

4 The population of earth doubled from 3 billion to 6 billion from 1960 to the year 2000, so you have more people driving larger and larger cars which demands more fuel from the earths resources.

5. they take up more room in car parking spaces and on streets and add to traffic jams.
Traffic Jams means prolonged use of the engine and inreasing fuel costs further, which is worse in 4x4s

6. The fumes they produce reduce air quality and the children you claim to love are affected by it in increases in childhood asthma.

The point is, why do people need them?

You are no better off for spending a fortune in fuel?

That money would be better saved and spent on paying off your mortgages or helping the starving in the third world countries, rather than burning it in smoke.

Trust me, you are not better people for driving those things.

Peole buy them to get noticed, however that doesn't work anymore, because there are that many of them and they are an eyesore.

4x4s were originally produced to transport munitions during the war, or are useful in Mountain rescues or for the Coastguards.

The general public do not need them, they are a disgrace being used for leisure and are not being used for what they are intended for.
 

FlagWagger

GCM
Book Reviewer
#33
brightspark said:
1. They weigh typically 3 ton and if hit by one you have no chance of survival.
Necessary for survival in cases of collision between car and moose/wolf/bear (all of which I witnessed in the last 18 months).

I've just purchased a large 4x4 SUV, not to get noticed, not to wantonly burn fuel (although at $0.80 / litre I can better afford to than I could in the UK!), but as a practical vehicle that will transport myself and family around the Ottawa Valley both in the depths of winter and the height of summer, that has sufficient room for skis/tents/camping stuff, the monthly food shop from Ottawa (about 100 miles away), that has sufficient towing capacity to tow boats / camping equipment. In my case the car I purchased offered the best compromise for my family needs - does that make me a bad person? :) Your objections are very general, and do not apply in all areas of the world where 4x4s are driven!
 
#34
FlagWagger said:
brightspark said:
1. They weigh typically 3 ton and if hit by one you have no chance of survival.
Necessary for survival in cases of collision between car and moose/wolf/bear (all of which I witnessed in the last 18 months).

I've just purchased a large 4x4 SUV, not to get noticed, not to wantonly burn fuel (although at $0.80 / litre I can better afford to than I could in the UK!), but as a practical vehicle that will transport myself and family around the Ottawa Valley both in the depths of winter and the height of summer, that has sufficient room for skis/tents/camping stuff, the monthly food shop from Ottawa (about 100 miles away), that has sufficient towing capacity to tow boats / camping equipment. In my case the car I purchased offered the best compromise for my family needs - does that make me a bad person? :) Your objections are very general, and do not apply in all areas of the world where 4x4s are driven!
I think as long as you don't park it in the IOM he isn't going to bother that much.
 
#39
Maxi_77 said:
tommo said:
lol Don't blame the 4 x 4's blame the cows and the termites they're the planets biggest polluters!!!!!!
But they neither vote or pay taxes so don't count or in the minds of many exist
You can say that about alot of the residents of the UK too lol
 
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