German soldiers pose with Afgan skulls

[rugger_bob]

German soldiers pose with skulls and various desecration's of human remains at a mass grave.

Guys, whats your thoughts on this ?

1. Is this a common thing with the armed forces abroad ?, a sort of (black humour).
2. How common is it with any of the British or coalition service's abroad ?
3. What action will be taken or should be taken, i.e. criminal/ disciplinary.
4. Should this be reported or kept out of the news ?.

 

[TattooDog]

1. Is this a common thing with the armed forces abroad ?, a sort of (black humour).
2. How common is it with any of the British or coalition service's abroad ?
3. What action will be taken or should be taken, i.e. criminal/ disciplinary.
4. Should this be reported or kept out of the news ?.

1. I think you'll find that this black humour has been present in many wars/conflicts. My grandad had a group photo of his brother's platoon in WW2 and the group included a dead German soldier who had been posed amongst the group - apparently he became their mate or mascot! There are many similar accounts from WW1 & 2, Korea, Vietnam, Falklands as well as the other conflicts. Possibly those involved become conditioned due to the stresses they are under, but you can't rule out the possibility that sometimes the military, and some units in particular, attract people who have a "different" set of morals.

2. Don't know about that.

3. I would expect that the first course of action would be disciplinary as they have probably breached their equivalent of the Armed Forces Discipline Act.

4. I don't think you can put a press blackout on this type of thing as it will always emerge somehow - in the same way as stories of prisoner abuse can't be kept under wraps.

 

[Nutty]

It is about time every serviceman who has served in Balkans, Middle East or any other active war zone goes thru his electronic and hard copies of pictures and deletes or destroys any photo/image that could be construed as embarrassing or as a war crime or illigal act, cruel and inhumane treatment, contravention of the Geneva Convention.

Just how stupid are you guys out there still with these pics that just may send you or your mates to prison. Let alone give succor to our enemies.

DISPOSE OF NOW BEFORE YOUR UNIT IS ON THE FRONT PAGE OF THE SCUM OR SIMILAR

Nutty

 

[sweeney]

edit

 

[TattooDog]

Just how stupid are you guys out there still with these pics that just may send you or your mates to prison. Let alone give succor to our enemies.
Nutty

Even more stupid is putting same phots into Boots for developing!! :roll:

 

[clanky]

German soldiers pose with skulls and various desecration's of human remains at a mass grave.

Guys, whats your thoughts on this ?

1. Is this a common thing with the armed forces abroad ?, a sort of (black humour).
2. How common is it with any of the British or coalition service's abroad ?
3. What action will be taken or should be taken, i.e. criminal/ disciplinary.
4. Should this be reported or kept out of the news ?.

What paper do you work for?

 

[HARRY_MASKERS]

It's inspiring tho, they could use the scull, find a few bones and design it as a cap badge! (or even an arm band), bet no German's thought of that before.

 

[andym]

It's inspiring tho, they could use the scull, find a few bones and design it as a cap badge! (or even an arm band), bet no German's thought of that before.

I think youll find that we already have a Cavalry regiment that has a skull and crossbones as its cap badge.

The Queens Royal Lancers.

 

[SILVER_FOX]

clanky wrote: What paper do you work for?

Exactly what I was thinking.

SF

 

[whitemouse]

German soldiers pose with skulls and various desecration's of human remains at a mass grave.


Did you, perchance, forget about the parading of the skeletal remains of the US servicemen killed in the attempted hostage rescue in Iran ?

or

the parading of prisoners, wounded and otherwise, through Hanoi during the Vietnam war ?

or

conveniently forgetting the atrocities committed by the Saddam Hussein's troops on the Marsh Arabs

or even

the civilians marched in front of the troops across Iranian minefields ?

The media were, and are willing to spout about western troops so-called insensitivity, but keep very quiet about other countries, whose record is far from squeaky clean.

You'd be better off checking that lot out, I think.

 

[rugger_bob]

Hi guys, no i dont work for any press or related industry, it was just a mere topic of discussion.

I know this has happened through out history, in many wars, conflicts and of course with all the armed forces from every country that has been involved in such wars.

I do think though any such happenings should be treated with utter disgrace, ie, if i was in a conflict and i lost a friend i was serving with , and this type of thing happened to his remains, not sure what i would do.
( But then again i have never been in a war or conflict )

Also what was mentioned before, the disgrace it would bring on your unit or regiment/service through the press etc.

 

[Rincewind]

i worked with pioneers who in GW1 took pics of heads with fags stuffed into bullet holes in cadavers. i know of pics of argies minus thier ears when the Para's got amongst them (no survivors).

Fact of the matter is this sick sh1t does happen and i think if you train people to kill you have to accept that there will be a darker side those peoples take on humour.

I cant speak for jack or for blue jobs... i imagine you feel very detatched from war, some one presses a button, something goes "whooooosh" and you crack on with whatever you were doing.... miles away people die - wasnt you that did it.

In the Army and the Marines, RAF Regt and any other Army...

You see the immediate effect of what you just did - most times you are actually looking onto the eyes of the person you just killed.

That require training and a certain level of detatchement from whats actually going on.

We soldiers use humour to mask most everyday occurances, so it stands to reason humour will be used to play down the darker side of mankind.

If you are not there experiencing it 1st hand i feel you are not in a place to comment.

I certainly feel that the media should not be allowed on the front line, and definately not be allowed to be imbedded with troops.

Rincewind

 

[rugger_bob]

Thank you for that Rincewind, very well put across, as i said i have never been to war, but think what you have said is spot on. My Grand father lost his leg in WW2 in Italy, i know he seen a lot of action, but he would never talk about what went on in those dark days of action.

 

[BootneckYank]

I think that Nietzsche put it best: "When we grapple with monsters, we must be carefull that do not become monsters ourselves."

As was pointed out, this has been going on since time immemorial.
My father once told a (rare) story about WWII, when a RAAF P-40 pilot shot down a Japanese type-1 (Betty) bomber near thier field, and everybody went out to take a look and photograph it. Usually these fragile planes just made a smoking crater, or exploded in the air, so an intact one was a rarity (The Japanese called it the "Type-1 Lighter"). Everybody made sure to get shots of the mangled bodies of the crew.

In Vietnam, almost every US sevicemen carried a camera into the field, and many of them still have their "special" photo albums to this day. Many of the dead VC/NVA were posed, (holding cigs, cans of beer, etc.) it was their way of striking back at an elusive enemy who was rarely seen or caught.

Today, we have the internet and embed reporters, which make sure nothing stays underground for long. One (now thankfully removed) website called nowthatsfuckedup.com, was offering soldiers free net porn for their "best" war zone pictures, sex or gore. On arrse, they had a thread containing nude pics of US servicewomen that soldiers had sent in to get their free porn. Also had a large gallery of combat photos.

The human animal is just an animal for all our supposed sophistication, and higher intelligence.

 

[rugger_bob]

Thanks, Bootneck.

WE ARE WHAT WE MAKE OURSELVES.

 

[oldseadog]

Alas poor Yorrick! Is this a football I see before me?
No problem there, mate. He's 'armless! Went out for a wet last night and he came back legless!

Sick? Yes, or maybe?

However, always bear in mind that to some these 'jokes' are the lowest form of humour and should be severely dealt with. To those who have had to live with and through it, it is a release so that the individual is able to retain his sanity by 'forces' humour.

I have worked alongside the civvy blue light services, and on one occasion a weeping fireman brought out a 'roast chicken'. Someone overheard his remark, with the result that he was immediately suspended pending an enquiry! Think about it! What would you have said?

On another occasion we were recovering the remains of someone that had been submerged for a couple of weeks. One of the divers passed up a hand, and started singing 'I aint got no body'. Apart from the stench, it raised a laugh, and reduced the tension. Right or wrong?

We all do what we have to do to survive and to keep whatever sanity we have left - even if it means upsetting some poncy liberal do-gooder!

Rant over!

OSD

 

[rugger_bob]

Hey Guys,

I wasnt having ago at anyone or side, i can see both sides and the reasons for such type's of behaviour, war does strange things to people, what they see and what the do for there country.
Thus how it effects them in differant ways, whether right or wrong,it may be a way of dealing with the unpleasant or a recourse for revenge from what they have been through.

I truly take my hat off to all present and ex service personnel, for the simple fact they serve Queen and country and the fact they just dont lay thier lives on the line, but also there level of commitment to save life and preserve what they believe in.

 

[andym]

If you have ever seen Full Metal Jacket,there is a scene where they intorduce "the Joker" to the platoon in a Vietnam village,propped up in a corner was the corpse of a VC soldier with a fag in his mouth.They were celebrating his Birthday at the time.

 

[Father_Famine]

i worked with pioneers who in GW1 took pics of heads with fags stuffed into bullet holes in cadavers. i know of pics of argies minus thier ears when the Para's got amongst them (no survivors).

Fact of the matter is this sick sh1t does happen and i think if you train people to kill you have to accept that there will be a darker side those peoples take on humour.

I cant speak for jack or for blue jobs... i imagine you feel very detatched from war, some one presses a button, something goes "whooooosh" and you crack on with whatever you were doing.... miles away people die - wasnt you that did it.

In the Army and the Marines, RAF Regt and any other Army...

You see the immediate effect of what you just did - most times you are actually looking onto the eyes of the person you just killed.

That require training and a certain level of detatchement from whats actually going on.

We soldiers use humour to mask most everyday occurances, so it stands to reason humour will be used to play down the darker side of mankind.

If you are not there experiencing it 1st hand i feel you are not in a place to comment.

I certainly feel that the media should not be allowed on the front line, and definately not be allowed to be imbedded with troops.

Rincewind

I can remember seeing loads of photos similar to the above (Iraqi corpse posed with fag in mouth, burnt corpse with glasses and fag) in photo shops in Dubai after the first Gulf War, obviously before Digital Cameras, the shop owners would develop all the films then keep the good ones to sell.
Wonder why there was no fuss at that time?

 

[clanky]

i worked with pioneers who in GW1 took pics of heads with fags stuffed into bullet holes in cadavers. i know of pics of argies minus thier ears when the Para's got amongst them (no survivors).

Fact of the matter is this sick sh1t does happen and i think if you train people to kill you have to accept that there will be a darker side those peoples take on humour.

I cant speak for jack or for blue jobs... i imagine you feel very detatched from war, some one presses a button, something goes "whooooosh" and you crack on with whatever you were doing.... miles away people die - wasnt you that did it.

In the Army and the Marines, RAF Regt and any other Army...

You see the immediate effect of what you just did - most times you are actually looking onto the eyes of the person you just killed.

That require training and a certain level of detatchement from whats actually going on.

We soldiers use humour to mask most everyday occurances, so it stands to reason humour will be used to play down the darker side of mankind.

If you are not there experiencing it 1st hand i feel you are not in a place to comment.

I certainly feel that the media should not be allowed on the front line, and definately not be allowed to be imbedded with troops.

Rincewind

I can remember seeing loads of photos similar to the above (Iraqi corpse posed with fag in mouth, burnt corpse with glasses and fag) in photo shops in Dubai after the first Gulf War, obviously before Digital Cameras, the shop owners would develop all the films then keep the good ones to sell.
Wonder why there was no fuss at that time?

I remember those phots. IIRC, there was a bit of an outcry, but nothing actually got done about it In fact, its hard to see what could have been done officially.