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Future Defence Requirements (Navy)

rickeee

Badgeman
Were you alarmed at the latest headlines?? scrap the two A/Cs, scrap Trident replacement/ scrap future Astute S/Ms, no further work on a Joint Strike Fighter, The new Daring class are inadeqate for the type of wars we will fight in future.

Think on, look back in history, when have these halfwits ever got the forecast right, since the end of WW2 every conflict we have been involved in ranging from Korea through to Afgan via Oman , Falklands Cold War and Kenya plus countless others have crept up and bit us on the bum. This countrys defence capability has been woefully inadeqate time after time.

Let us now enter a new phase of forward thinking, how can we best achieve any given task with limited resources and overworked manpower.
Not easy you might reply.

But alas not as difficult as you might at first think. Consider some of the following options: Highly armed surface ship -nuclear powered modified Daring- with 2 vtol capacity plus helos: modified Astute class S/Ms to carry 4 Trident with 12 warheads each plus special forces capability to embark whilst at sea dived plus Tomohawk. Build enough of these and you need very little else, let us not be taken short. Once you lose your at sea flight and nuclear weapon expertise it will never be recovered. Lobby your MP.
 

trelawney126

War Hero
rickeee said:
Were you alarmed at the latest headlines?? scrap the two A/Cs, scrap Trident replacement/ scrap future Astute S/Ms, no further work on a Joint Strike Fighter, The new Daring class are inadeqate for the type of wars we will fight in future.

Think on, look back in history, when have these halfwits ever got the forecast right, since the end of WW2 every conflict we have been involved in ranging from Korea through to Afgan via Oman , Falklands Cold War and Kenya plus countless others have crept up and bit us on the bum. This countrys defence capability has been woefully inadeqate time after time.

Let us now enter a new phase of forward thinking, how can we best achieve any given task with limited resources and overworked manpower.
Not easy you might reply.

But alas not as difficult as you might at first think. Consider some of the following options: Highly armed surface ship -nuclear powered modified Daring- with 2 vtol capacity plus helos: modified Astute class S/Ms to carry 4 Trident with 12 warheads each plus special forces capability to embark whilst at sea dived plus Tomohawk. Build enough of these and you need very little else, let us not be taken short. Once you lose your at sea flight and nuclear weapon expertise it will never be recovered. Lobby your MP.

One glaring ommission in your fine statement....Are we going to also arm the Torpoint and Gosport Ferries, if so with what? :lol:
 

WhizzbangDai

War Hero
You'd need a bigger ship than a T45 to get 2xVTOL PLUS helo's as well as massive changes inside to accomodate the jets (whatever it may be) weapons.

Plus most harbours in the world don't let nuclear powered ships in so we couldn't enter anywhere.

SO lets see, bigger flight deck, VTOL and helo capacity, we'd need to scale up, add a bigger flight deck... we'd need to think of a new name for the class... 'Albion'.... 'Ocean' maybe, I dunno ;)




We'll never forward think, its a lost cause. People don't care unless there's a war on, and even if there IS a war on they still don't unless they are, or have blood relatives actually involved. Pessimistic, maybe but truth.



If you MUST change something i'm coming around to the idea of nuclear capable TLAMS as a sort of delayed deterrant on the cheap. 'Yeah Britain's glass right now, but in a week or so, when the Astute gets within range, THEN you'll regret it you cnuts' kind of thing :p
 

ctfairway

Lantern Swinger
The trouble with all these prospective cuts - CVS, Trident, Type 45 etc etc is that noone seems to understand that the essential question which the GOVERNMENT needs to answer is "what are the National Foreign Policy Objectives". It is talking arse about face to propose that bits of equipment should be cut without addressing that question first because the armed forces are instruments of the Goverment's Foreign Policy. Once the Foreign Policy has been sorted out, THEN we can decide what equipment is needed to implement it. Not the other way round.
 
That idea was seriously looked at in the early ‘80s. It didn’t progress very far as the VTOL option severely limited the usefulness of the aeroplane. Additionally, more maintainers were needed than would be the case where a large number of machines are “pooled†in a Carrier. That also needed a hull of sufficient capacity to hold the supporting infrastructure and the considerable amount of AVCAT such aircraft burn. Effectively, you finished up with a through-deck Cruiser.

 

rickeee

Badgeman
Passed overLoggie, fair point but still thinking in the traditional way, who says aircraft have to be driven/fuelled in a conventional manner or operated from some form of flat-top. build a ski ramp on the front and use ram jet technolgy (only guessing it would work) but lets explore all the options, with some 12/18 super Darings say and the same number of super Asutes we would not be caught with the proverbial nickers around ankles too often.
 

WhiteRose

Lantern Swinger
trelawney126 said:
One glaring ommission in your fine statement....Are we going to also arm the Torpoint and Gosport Ferries, if so with what? :lol:

With a system that can track an incoming beer bottle travelling faster than the speed of sound, obviously :D
 

trelawney126

War Hero
WhiteRose said:
trelawney126 said:
One glaring ommission in your fine statement....Are we going to also arm the Torpoint and Gosport Ferries, if so with what? :lol:

With a system that can track an incoming beer bottle travelling faster than the speed of sound, obviously :D

Ah... My mother in law...she manages to avoid all those I'd like to throw at her :D :D
 
rickeee. Fair point and I think I'm getting the hang of this now. Exactly; vertical lift ramjets; but we're still thinking liquid fuel. I think you're ahead of me on this and, your right. We just need to find that rich seam of Dilithium crystals that are probably on the South Georgian seabed. All we need to do next is replace the pink squishy maintainers and boat drivers with robots and there will be loads of room (and we won't have to pay them).
 

whiteknight

Midshipman
Surely we can use the 4billion saved from id card's to go to the new carriers, there sorted any other problem's ask gordon thats enough work for me this wk now where's my expence form.
 

OSLO

War Hero
There's alot of naval sabre rattling and posturing going on in advance of the Defence Review. The Army is flavour of the month with the media (notwithstanding the enormous effort that the Andrew is playing in Afghanistan), and the Navy has only had bad news in the press of late (thank you BVT, HMS Cornwall, etc).

The simple fact is that the UK remains an island nation where 90% of goods are traded by sea. So key quesitons that are needed in the Review must start with "what is the UK's role in the world?" If we want to retain a seat on the Security Council, if we want to retain an expeditionary Armed Forces, if we want to be able to go and protect our national and commonwealth interests overseas, if we want to retain a key role in NATO, if we want a chance at shaping the future agenda of an EU Armed Forces policy, then we need money, we need platforms, we need people. It's that simple. Start cutting capabilities, you start cutting our role.

However, for some reason, the muppet in No 10 seems to have taken a dislike to the RN over the last 11 years. His departure will be rejoiced by this ex-matelot. Maybe we don't yet know exactly what the next administration will do, but there is at least a glimmer of hope that some common sense will reign. I don't expect an immediate increase in the budget, but I do expect some more reasoned decision making.
 

rickeee

Badgeman
You have a very good understanding of the situation OSLO, I wonder if the muppet10 has some dark secret in Inverkeithing/Dunfermline that is linked to his dislike of all things RN????
 
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