Four more ships for the Surface Fleet...?


I can offer some more rumours from the coalface on this one. During OST, had a very interesting chat with the one of the staff Loggies regarding the status of the ships. The moving and shaking has passed beyond speculation and into the practicalities - Cardigan Bay has had several Naval Architects visit the ship with a view to turning them into pussers war canoes. The plans are essentially to rip out most of the accomodation and start again - the current gym will become a 40 man mess, extra bunks will go into the Cadet and RFA senior rate cabins to turn them from either 1/2 man cabins into 4-8 man messes, the double beds will be torn out of the current officers cabins and they'll turn into two man cabins and the like.

The idea they're looking at is turning them into ships with a crew of something of the order of 180, without any major modifications apart from fitting the phalanxes and turning the ops room into something other than a joke.

Watch this space...


Lantern Swinger
Scud said:
The idea they're looking at is turning them into ships with a crew of something of the order of 180, without any major modifications apart from fitting the phalanxes and turning the ops room into something other than a joke.

Where are they going to get the c.1000 crew from for four ships? I know I use a rule of thumb of 3 RN per 1 RFA personnel, but WTF are the 120 supernumaries actually going to do?

How did you get on with Mounts Bay in BOST anyway?


War Hero
Has 'mixed manning' of the Bay Class been floated with any seriousness Scud? An RN ship's company will hardly walk on board and figure it all out in a forenoon. Gobby sprog matelots calling the Chief Engineer 'mate', junior RN officers thinking he's a 'Chief' Petty Officer.

Interesting times for the RN and the RFA?


Got a Strong Satisfactory on OST - would have got a VSAT if everything worked. Nearly all the pick up points, from MASC onwards were material defects rather than training issues - along the lines of "this doesn't work", "where's the SOP for this?" and so on. Ship was ok, though it looked like we'd do our final inspection on the buoy at one point after both converters decided to die the day before - we were only saved by a bloke from Siemens flying over at the rush to debug and change £40k worth of circuit boards.

As for mixed manning, it's an interesting idea. As for adding up the personnel extras, I'll have a go:

Operations Officer
4 x Bridge Watchkeeping Officers
4 x WE Officers
6 x WE Senior Rates
18 x WE Junior Rates
4 x ME Officers
8 x ME Senior Rates (to do all the engineering)
20 x ME Junior Rates
3 x Logistics Officers
25 x Catering/Supply dept
10 x Communications Senior/Junior Rates

As for warfare/seamanship department, I'd be completely lost as to how the RN work it, but that gives an idea how numbers would build up. I've hit 100 already without trying...

Mixed manning would be interesting to say the least - the culture shock would take at least a Month to get past, and it'd be interesting to see where the lines were drawn, and whose ideas end up dominant. The idea of 1 in 3 bridge watches in itself seems offensive to RN Warfare Officers (as does the lack of anything 'Warfare' to play with), and the possible tussles between CPOMEAs and RFA Engineering Officers about who actually gets to play with the engines would be quite interesting. It's one of the 3 options currently up to the treasury regarding the future of the RFA though. They are:

1. Navy Takes Over

2 Greater 'Integration' between RN and RFA (Navy Takes over, but longer timescale)

3. They do nothing (Navy tries takeover attempt later)


War Hero
I am glad to hear that my idea a while ago isn't just wishful thinking.
With an RN ships company, and RM, then they turn into very useful ships, much more practical than a type 23.

Can helicopters be taken below at all??

And as for the extra personnel... well they are big ships and will require lots of cleaning......! (groan)


War Hero
Ref Bay class Stumpy asked:

Can helicopters be taken below at all??

Um, no! So there is something called 'incremental aquistion' going on. Bays can't operate more than one helo but with a better thought out quarterdeck/flightdeck there could have been multiple spots. Oh and they forgot a FLYCO but have identified a fan trunking that can be adapted (after an A&A and £££ of guidance is approved).

Serious maintenance, especially in roughers can't be carried out on helos parked on the upper scupper so a hanger is required, but what kind of aftermarket fit will they get?

Going back to the question. A ditched helo could probably be winched in to the dock/vehicle deck. That's 'below' but not what you meant Stumpy.
(Am I warm Scud?)

Best leave the Bays with the RFA for now and start another thread on the future of the RN and RFA marriage- if that's what is happening.


War Hero

My idea wasn't to grab RFAs for the sake of it, but that the Bays could be operated more like the Albion and Bulwark are at the moment, ie patrolling large areas of sea, sending out RMs on landing craft/patrol boats (poss even some of their go fast ones...).

I think that the rest of the RFA should be left as they are as they do an excellent job, but these vessels could be used in a way to gain 4 more, very useful, ships for the surface fleet.