Early Release

Discussion in 'The Afterlife - Resettlement and Jobs' started by scary51, Jun 30, 2008.

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  1. I'm in the process of applying for the Australian Navy.

    I submitted my notice a couple of weeks ago and applied to be released in January 09. Drafty is being a bit funny which is hilarious after 24 years.

    Does anyone know of any policy or references I can throw back in order to secure my release?
  2. wave_dodger

    wave_dodger War Hero Book Reviewer

    Sadly the 12 months policy is just that however there are numerous examples where drafty has been flexible and allowed early release, sometimes compromising over EVT time etc.

    At the moment there aree also gaps and branch shortages - are you in a rank/rate/trade that has acute shortages?
  3. Stand for Parliament? There's a byelection coming up in Glasgow.....
  4. You could of course go off to Oz and when Pusser get upset say "either sue me for breach of contract or issue a warrant for my arrest as a deserter and see if the RAN will execute it.

    Not good publicity for RN to arrest and drag a man back from the other side of the world who has given the Queen 24 years service and is now passing his experience on to a Commonwealth Member when kids are being stabbed on the streets of Britain. Well thats what I would say to Drafty who of course is very interested in his next promotion/honour.

  5. Points to remember shipmate is that drafty is just what it says on the tin the person who drafts you. Once you've submitted your notice which you say you have done you will be released from naval service 12 months from the date you sign it. Drafty can try and talk you out of it buts thats about all, you've submitted your notice has per the T & C and all bar a major conflict or for some obscure medical reason you will exit the RN. The question of wether you can be released earlier than the twelve month point is mostly down to your employing commanding officer. You can apply for early release between the six to twelve month point providing that you have a job offer confirmed in writing, are willing to forgo any outstanding resettlement training/courses etc and that your CO can spare you. Given that in your last six months you'll have 28 days terminal leave, up to 7 weeks resettlement training and possible 3-4 weeks outstanding ALA. that really doesn't leave a lot of employable time left. Hence most CO are willing to be gapped if its what you really want and are willing to give up the Resettlement training and outstanding leave.
    I know cause thats exactly what I did my proper TX was Sept and I started my terminal leave on the last day of April.
    Get your DO on your side pronto and butter up the Captains Sec. and then ask nicely to go early, it worked for me.
  6. I am no lower deck lawyer but am simply wondering what would happen if somebody took Pusser to court over this?

    It seems that their idea of a contract of employment is not in accordance with that stated in the Employment Acts and the Employment rights Act 1996. There are periods of notice given in law. It appears that the MoD does not have immunity from these Acts as displayed by the rights fairly recently afforded to us all for issues such as paternity leave and flexible working.

    Having said that I dare say it would take longer for the matter to go to court than it would to serve out your 12 months. Spooky is it not?


    Have a nice evening checking out the law :thumright:
  7. I fail to see how drafty 'is hilarious after 24 years'.

    You agreed to the contract which you are on, why should you expect an automatic right to breach that contract?
  8. Guzzler do you really believe employment contracts are written in stone. Both Pusser and every employer in the UK have changed conditions of employment over the years i.e your contract. You as the work-force do not have a choice. Did Pusser ever say when they allowed Lady Sailors to go to sea that all you men who's conditions of service have been changed in that you did not have to serve with woman at sea and now you do so if you do not like it you can leave tomorrow.

    No I thought not. I am sure others can think of better alterations to contracts in which you had no choice.

  9. I see your point Nutty, and a fair one it is.

    It's the just the apparent 'shock' that scary seemed to feel on the mob's (no doubt not final) decision. People, not just youngsters, seem very ready to get all indignant when I feel they have no real grounds to. It would be 'nice' for his wishes to be met, and I wish him good luck, but I think it a bit of a cheek to expect it.

    Then again, I'm outgrumpying even myself at the moment due to the ravages of age rendering me a tad off-colour. x.x
  10. I fail to see how drafty 'is hilarious after 24 years'.

    You agreed to the contract which you are on, why should you expect an automatic right to breach that contract?

    Contract, whats a contract? Ratings in the RN do not have a contract of employment has per the normal civilian, ask any rating to show you their copy of there contract of employment and you'll get the bucket of steam quicker, it does not exist. After 24 years service and having stated his intentions with respect to his future employment asking to leave early is certainly not unreasonable, and if done correctly should be taken seriously. Something else to remember this twelve months is not set in stone for both sides, submit your notice and the skipper wants rid of you he can ineffect discharge there and then without having to put up with you for another twelve months! Has to Drafty he has a job to do putting bodies into billets has required by the service, if your CO is willing to be gapped for a few months then that is the main factor in securing early release not what drafty whats or says.
  11. But the law says everyone should have a written contract of employment! :thumright:

    Have a nice day
  12. The fact that some/most matelots have lost their contracts doesn't invalidate it. I still have mine from '77. Anyway, maybe 'contract' s the wrong thing to refer to. Will Naval regulations do?
  13. You are missing my point. The MoD is not exempt from Employment Law Per Se. Statute law quite clearly states the requirements that any employer must have written into any contract of employment for it to be legally binding. It also states legal notice periods. Hence my original question I wonder what would happen if someone took this matter to court? Especially if they had a smart employment lawyer. My sole intention is to spark debate. :whew:

    Have a nice day
  14. I was agreeing with you.
  15. Sorry I failed to see your sarcasm! :thumright:

  16. Sarcastic? Me? :bow:
  17. chieftiff

    chieftiff War Hero Moderator

    I sort of agree with everything you've said. When I put my notice in I wanted out and I wanted out immediately for many reasons not the least of which was that I felt I couldn't (wasn't allowed) do my job anymore. I talked extensively with a lawyer specialising in employment law, his answer to every one of my perceived injustices was "but they are exempt from that section of the act" Honestly it was like listening to a record. Agreed no formal contract of employment and they must abide by that section of the act, my lawyers response "can you afford the time, effort and potential cost of challenging that in court?"

    At this point I was a bit frustrated however...... his advice to me was this: Get a job, get the offer in writing with a start date, give your written reasonable notice to your CO, when he says no ask him to reconsider and raise a complaint stating that your opportunity for future employment is being interfered with, give him no more than a fortnight then tell him in writing you wish to present your case to an employment tribunal This is untried ground and a fairly cheap process should you be forced to see it through. It is likely that any tribunal will agree with your complaint (it's important to note that you do not have to see through the complaint process, but you must instigate the internal redress process and give them "reasonable" opportunity to resolve it otherwise the tribunal will just refer you back to that process)

    The downside to all this, well the tribunal findings would still have no particular legal standing because the Armed Forces are exempt all of the important parts of the employment act. He felt that given my notice was in I had served for so long etc etc it was unlikely that MoD would pursue the matter, but there was always the chance. He felt that they would be foolish to: at some point in the future the law will be challenged, at that point if they were to lose it would open them up to be sued for loss of earnings should I then not find employment because they didn't release me when I had a job offer within a reasonable time without very good justification.

    I didn't pursue it in the end but still finished work some 4 months before my terminal date because keeping drafty on my side allowed them to get me a relief in early and then my boss was happy to let me go.

    There's about £400 quids worth of legal advice there but the upshot is you are legally screwed unless you are willing to take a significant financial risk that still may not see you out early or hope that pusser is a poor poker player.
  18. cheers for that chieftiff. touch wood it won't come to that but I will pursue my career change until I am told no you cant go and try some of those tactics you have offered

    Fair wind and following seas
  19. Hi, just doing some research ref early release and thought I'd bring this to the top as I have a query.....

    I submitted my 12 months notice in June and now have a job offer to start on 5th Jan 2009. I have been told that a European Court of Law would rule that The Navy cannot 'keep me in' for any longer than a month as we are now paid monthly. Can anyone confirm this or point me in the right direction?? I've trawled their website to no avail and am a bit stuck.

    I am in the process of going to the CO's table to apply for early release but as there are no LH's available to take my place I have been told that I probably wont be spared. OST is coming up in February and the CO doesn't want to be gapped for it although the ship has been gapped in the past!

    I'm just wondering if there's any law I can quote to my CO and get out of the RN to pursue my career outside???

    Any help much appreciated!!!
  20. Don't waste your time quoting law to your CO. He could only refer you to a "higher authority" - in this case Fleet HQ. EU Law does not apply here, the MOB can legally enforce the 12 months notice period (BR 8748) as a result of you (a service person) having given notice of your intention to Early Terminate your contract. If the MOB says no then there is sweet FA you can do about it. A court will almost certainly not allow any other "law" to take precedence over the provisions of the Armed Forces Act (as articulated within the relevant regulation i.e. the BR).

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