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Does Britain have a sick note culture?

fly_past

Lantern Swinger
Are we a sicknote culture outside in Civvie street?
Do you have the answer to the problem to the wasters (not genuine cases) and how to identify them as such? :thumright:
 
This is only my opinion, but the way I see it, since Liebore came into Government they have fostered a reliance on the state, which, in turn enables them to have more and more say in what people are doing and to a certain point, thinking. We are now reaping what they have sown over the past decade. A rapid decline in the number of tradespersons, people refusing to do "menial" jobs etc leading to more requirements of external labour leading to more immigrant labour leading to bad feeling (right or wrong, it exists).

As usual, Liebore are jumping on the bandwagon again, this time regarding the culture of social security, a culture that they have been instrumental in increasing.

MY answer to the problem is to leave this stinking cesspit of a country to the likes of broon and his cronies, because he and his ilk have ruined it beyond redemption.
However, my eldest son is trying very hard to get into a certain secondary school, and if he succeeds I don't know if I can drag him out of it in a couple of years (when I leave the mob) and off to another country.
I think that these days, all you can do is look out for yourself and your family.
 

P2000

Lantern Swinger
It's an extension of the problem whereby a lot of people I know think nothing of 'having a sickie'.

It might be harmless but in itself, but if you do it once, you'll do it again to the point where it becomes commonplace, almost accepted.

It's all a dilution of the work ethic: work becomes an unnecessary infringement of your right to sit about doing FA.

Rant off.
 
Fly_Past, A leading question in the topic headline followed by a spot of naughtiness in the way you link 'sick note culture' with 'disability benefits', which itself is a 'problem' to be solved! Your thread may have come across as less biased if your topic title and opening question had simply been 'Changes to Disability Benefits' and 'Do you support the change in disability benefits?'. I am sure there are more than enough people on here who will be only too pleased to give their opinions about 'disabled spongers'. A debate is certainly worth having but a slight change in the way you have set the thread up may have encourage a wider range of responses than simple outrage. However, I now suspect we'll never know! :thumright:
 
fly_past said:
Are we a sicknote culture outside in Civvie street?
Do you have the answer to the problem to the wasters (not genuine cases) and how to identify them as such? :thumright:

Contributor Mode

My last Company kept meticulous sick records, complaint, day of week sickness started Monday and Friday are favorite, local football teams mid week away matches, days sick etc. most are not that inventive.

Then if they had a sufficient pattern of what appears to be fraudulent claim they would be interviewed and if not very convincing formally warned then at the next sickness they were removed from the sick pay scheme for a period of up to 12 months.

Nutty

Harry and FP you lost me with the Disability Pension bit where did that come from.??????????????
 

Omelette

Midshipman
Not sure about Britain as a whole, but certainly in the office I work in. My suggestion would be a six month probation period. The real wasters wouldn't be able to stick it out without showing their stripes. You'll always get some wasters though!
 

Rocket_Ron

Lantern Swinger
I have to say i disagree with Lamri`s apportion of blame (but not the sentiments). I remember t`was during the Conservative govts reign that all apprentice training died, and it was also responsible for cutting the unemployment figures by sticking people onto disability benefits. The sad state of affairs is that Labour has had more than 10yrs to fix the situation, and has either not been able to or not realised there is a problem.
Thats long term sick.
As for short term sick.
At my place of work there is so little forward planning that to leave major commitments to the chance of daily/weekly leave would be suicidal.
 
Ron is quite right the concept of massaging the unemployment figures by shifting people onto the long term sick was started by the Tories. Where he is wrong is in suggesting it has take NuLabor so long to work this out. They spotted it when the Tories were in power and complained quite volubly then. Of course as soon as they got into power themselves they found the concept as attractive as the Tories had found it and kept it going. Over the years they have had various initiatives to cut the numbers but surprisingly cosidering the attatractiveness of the system none have worked. Even the re-announced scheme ( for the third time) will only by their own admission, if it works, scratch the surface of the problem.
 
I last had a sickie roundabout 1980. That really has placed me at a great advantage over the wheezy, sneezy, squitty, bone/muscle/head achy weenies I work amongst; not! A recent MoD phenomenon is that somebody only has to sneeze a few times and their "line manager" sees it as a "duty of care" to send them home. You could give us all a cold/flu/tuberculosis!

It is one's human right and equal opportunity to be casually sick?
 

onions

GCM
Part of my induction routine into the Civil Service was to study the leave calender and book my "Sick Leave"! I kid you not. It was considered a "right" and if it wasn't taken it gave management an excuse to try and curtail it! Self Certification it was called. You would have been "certified" if you didn't take it.

Semper Strenuissima
 
onions said:
Part of my induction routine into the Civil Service was to study the leave calender and book my "Sick Leave"! I kid you not. It was considered a "right" and if it wasn't taken it gave management an excuse to try and curtail it! Self Certification it was called. You would have been "certified" if you didn't take it.

Semper Strenuissima

When I was in the civil service, admittedly 23 years ago, that would never have happened. Where I currently work the problem is not people being ill but people working late into the night, not taking their full leave entitlement (now you lose any you don't use up), working when ill and refusing to retire at 65. For health reasons I've worked part-time (1200-1800) since the Spring, but recently got told off for regularly working till 2000 and beyond. I've also been told off for not taking any breaks. So the public sector workforce are not skivers. A minority may be, but most work long hours for low pay. At my grade you don't get overtime pay, even when a crisis arises and you need to work late.

A little more balance please!
 
thingy said:
onions said:
Part of my induction routine into the Civil Service was to study the leave calender and book my "Sick Leave"! I kid you not. It was considered a "right" and if it wasn't taken it gave management an excuse to try and curtail it! Self Certification it was called. You would have been "certified" if you didn't take it.

Semper Strenuissima

When I was in the civil service, admittedly 23 years ago, that would never have happened. Where I currently work the problem is not people being ill but people working late into the night, not taking their full leave entitlement (now you lose any you don't use up), working when ill and refusing to retire at 65. For health reasons I've worked part-time (1200-1800) since the Spring, but recently got told off for regularly working till 2000 and beyond. I've also been told off for not taking any breaks. So the public sector workforce are not skivers. A minority may be, but most work long hours for low pay. At my grade you don't get overtime pay, even when a crisis arises and you need to work late.

A little more balance please!

Whilst not wanting a fight, I would suggest your experience of the CS is not the same as many of the rest of us. It is certainly not uncommom to hear people in the CS talk about the number of 'sick' days they have left, just as it is equally common for them not to apply any sense of urgency to completing the task in hand. For many it is simply a reflection of the environment they work in. In one job we had a CS chap in doing the unit admin ranked as a Lt Cdr equivalent. When he started he did 9-5 less his monday morning drive to the base and his friday afternoon drive home, 4 hours a week. By the end of the first year he was regularly doing unpaid overtime and by the time I left he sometimes even worked linger than us, if it was needed. So yes CS can be decent blokes given the training and opportunity like you thingy but in general?
 
I seem to remember the RN having its fair share with biff chits (P7RD ?)

Also worked for a stint in A+E in Edinburgh - the number of squaddies who turned up on a Monday morning with 'soft tissue' injuries with no swelling / restriction of movement was interesting.

And you can turn up to the military drunk in the morning - civvies tend to call in sick. Not sure which is better!

I would say the 'sick note culture' is pretty much everywhere in the UK. I'm off for a lie down, don't feel so good. :pukel:
 
SS-super-stoker said:
I seem to remember the RN having its fair share with biff chits (P7RD ?)

If they're P7R(D) they have at least seen a doctor, who agrees that they are not as healthy as they might be. Self certification is a whole other question, but if someone has a heavy cold I don't want them to be working alongside me, so I'm happy that they are allowed to take time off.

In healthcare, much of the major outbreaks of Norovirus and the like would be much easier to deal with if people took time off to recover, rather than bringing their illness to work.
 
asst_dep_to_dep_asst said:
SS-super-stoker said:
I seem to remember the RN having its fair share with biff chits (P7RD ?)

If they're P7R(D) they have at least seen a doctor, who agrees that they are not as healthy as they might be. Self certification is a whole other question, but if someone has a heavy cold I don't want them to be working alongside me, so I'm happy that they are allowed to take time off.

In healthcare, much of the major outbreaks of Norovirus and the like would be much easier to deal with if people took time off to recover, rather than bringing their illness to work.

Equally unless things have changed a lot since my day most of those on P7R want off it ASAP.

As some one who has suffered a few bouts of very severe sinuitis over the years I tend to take myself off to bed at the first sign of trouble, less risk for colleagues and less risk for me, and less load on the NHS whcih needs all the help it can get.
 

mikh

MIA
I left work at lunchtime yesterday due to a heavy cold and mild sinusitis, I would have stayed, but I believed I was getting to the point where I would have been unfit to drive, rightly as it turns out, as in the last couple of hundred yards of my journey I had difficulty concentration, and my vision started to blur a little.

I would much rather be at work, as no one will be doing my work for me, but an 18 mile drive in heavy traffic was just not on the cards this morning, and as I am seeing no improvement unlikely tomorrow.

I would also like to point out, that my absence from work not only inconvieniences my employer, but as I receive no sick pay until statuary kicks in, it inconveniences me as well
 
mikh said:
I left work at lunchtime yesterday due to a heavy cold and mild sinusitis, I would have stayed, but I believed I was getting to the point where I would have been unfit to drive, rightly as it turns out, as in the last couple of hundred yards of my journey I had difficulty concentration, and my vision started to blur a little.

I would much rather be at work, as no one will be doing my work for me, but an 18 mile drive in heavy traffic was just not on the cards this morning, and as I am seeing no improvement unlikely tomorrow.

I would also like to point out, that my absence from work not only inconvieniences my employer, but as I receive no sick pay until statuary kicks in, it inconveniences me as well

Mind it may may inconvenience your employer even more if you infected the rest of the staff, and also it equally may inconvenience you even more if you end up being of sick even longer.
 
HarryBosch said:
Fly_Past, A leading question in the topic headline followed by a spot of naughtiness in the way you link 'sick note culture' with 'disability benefits', which itself is a 'problem' to be solved! Your thread may have come across as less biased if your topic title and opening question had simply been 'Changes to Disability Benefits' and 'Do you support the change in disability benefits?'. I am sure there are more than enough people on here who will be only too pleased to give their opinions about 'disabled spongers'. A debate is certainly worth having but a slight change in the way you have set the thread up may have encourage a wider range of responses than simple outrage. However, I now suspect we'll never know! :thumright:


My Bold

Alright Harry

In a past life I used to work as an Investigator. I was on a surveillance job once, where a chap was making a disability claim after being signed off work on long term sick leave following an injury.

Basically, this guy was hanging washing in his back garden (council property) when he tripped on a broken slab and injured his ankle. He was off sick for a while and claimed that his ankle was permanently sore, causing him to limp, take masses of painkillers etc. The doc could see nothing wrong with him but couldn't prove he was faking it.

He put a claim into the council for negligence, injury, inability to work, disability, the whole whack. The council hired me through the company I was with, to conduct covert surveillance on the chap and hopeful gain video evidence that he was indeed fine. I followed this guy everywhere, but the problem is he was such a lazy barsteward it was impossible to gain any decent video footage of him walking, especially within the limited timeframe I had to conduct the observation. Even when I followed him to the bookies, he mounted the kerb at the double yellow lines in his car, so it was literally 2 or 3 steps into the front door - not enough distance and time to obtain sufficient video evidence that he was indeed walking fine without a limp.

In the end that man was awarded somewhere in the region of £36,000, he stopped working, is claiming higher rate disability living allowance and now has a brand new motability car. We knew he was faking it, the doc knew and the council knew - but nobody could prove a thing. What makes me angry is that my youngest brother is disabled (spina bifida from birth) and is in a wheelchair. He has no feeling or use of his legs from below the waist, yet we had some nugget from the disability place come out to assess his right to claim disability - you know, just incase he was faking the fact that he couldn’t walk!!! It really pisses me off!!
 
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