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Do RN Chaplains want to be armed? (Daily Mail)

stumpy

War Hero
It is thou shall not murder, not hou shall not kill, a very important difference for laity. However, I believe that clergy shall not harm others.
 
asst_dep_to_dep_asst said:
Did I read correctly that the side arm was to use to commit suicide rather than be captured? Surely anyone daft enough to believe in a supreme being would consider this a mortal sin?

Since when has a bottle of holy water and a cross counted as a side-weapon ;)
 

finknottle

Banned
stumpy said:
It is thou shall not murder, not hou shall not kill, a very important difference for laity. However, I believe that clergy shall not harm others.

Having googled it you are correct but I am only a humble atheist!

WB, they knew what they were getting into when they joined up, anyway Bush and Blair and maybe even Gogsy believe God is on our side so they will be OK.
 

finknottle

Banned
All I can say is that this God must have a very sick sense of humour allowing 2000+ years of killing, murder and mayhem to take place in his name.
 

beltfedwombat

Midshipman
You might be all looking at this from the wrong angle. It occurs to me that arming the Padres and sending them out on patrol with the lads could turn out to be a real force multiplier!

Most of the RN padres I came across in my time on that side of the fence could clear a mess in under 30 seconds (I've even seen baby ROs in Mercury jumping out of upstairs windows to peg it up the Cresent Road as the Devil Dodger was making his rounds). So, send in a Padre 10 minutes before Royal breaks down the door on one of those Taliban compounds and I'm willing to bet that the duty Talibs will be making billy big steps out the back door before a single round gets fired.

There is, however, a slight flaw in my cunning plan. Every one of the Green Lid Padres I met during my time with the Corps were top blokes. They just didn't have that unique mess clearing ability that their dark blue colleagues seem to master as part of basic Padre training. Chances are that if you send a Green Lid Padre in to the Taliban compound, Osama will get a wet on and start spinning highly exaggerated war dits. That always seemed to be the reaction they got from my lads!

So I'm afraid it will have to be your General Service Demon Dodger that gets the pier head jump to Helmand Prov. Needless to say, someone with lots of braid will have to have a word with Brigade, or they'll start that, 'Green Lid only, blah, blah, blah,' As for the issue about whether to carry a pesonal weapon or not? No need! If the 'Boots fit and mail getting through' patter doesn't clear the room and Jonny Talib is starting to get a bit arsey, my advice would be to start setting up for a church service. That'll do it!
 

finknottle

Banned
Maybe the Padre and the Mullah could have a duel to settle the whole thing, similar to the Queens champion in days of yore?
 

stumpy

War Hero
beltfedwombat said:
You might be all looking at this from the wrong angle. It occurs to me that arming the Padres and sending them out on patrol with the lads could turn out to be a real force multiplier!

Most of the RN padres I came across in my time on that side of the fence could clear a mess in under 30 seconds (I've even seen baby ROs in Mercury jumping out of upstairs windows to peg it up the Cresent Road as the Devil Dodger was making his rounds). So, send in a Padre 10 minutes before Royal breaks down the door on one of those Taliban compounds and I'm willing to bet that the duty Talibs will be making billy big steps out the back door before a single round gets fired.

There is, however, a slight flaw in my cunning plan. Every one of the Green Lid Padres I met during my time with the Corps were top blokes. They just didn't have that unique mess clearing ability that their dark blue colleagues seem to master as part of basic Padre training. Chances are that if you send a Green Lid Padre in to the Taliban compound, Osama will get a wet on and start spinning highly exaggerated war dits. That always seemed to be the reaction they got from my lads!

So I'm afraid it will have to be your General Service Demon Dodger that gets the pier head jump to Helmand Prov. Needless to say, someone with lots of braid will have to have a word with Brigade, or they'll start that, 'Green Lid only, blah, blah, blah,' As for the issue about whether to carry a pesonal weapon or not? No need! If the 'Boots fit and mail getting through' patter doesn't clear the room and Jonny Talib is starting to get a bit arsey, my advice would be to start setting up for a church service. That'll do it!
:thumright: :thumright:
 

stumpy

War Hero
andym said:
bring out the Holy Handgrenade of Antioch!!!!!

But IIRC the monks provided the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch but the Knight threw it... I am sure it wouldn't be allowed now anyway, to use high explosives on a cute bunny rabbit...
 

OSLO

War Hero
stumpy said:
andym said:
bring out the Holy Handgrenade of Antioch!!!!!

But IIRC the monks provided the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch but the Knight threw it... I am sure it wouldn't be allowed now anyway, to use high explosives on a cute bunny rabbit...

He was a vicious killer with sharp, pointy teeth!
 

beltfedwombat

Midshipman
I've now had the opportunity to sleep on this and apart from the usual 7 hours dreaming about Kylie Minogue, I've given the matter a great deal of thought. It occurs to me that since our Chaplains have taken the initiative by considering that they might have to take the ultimate step in the face of capture, we owe it to them to move this debate to the next level.

In the Art of War, Sun Tsu is quoted as saying, 'It is a foolish Commander who refuses to consider adopting the tactics and strategies of his enemy when they are proving successful.'

Wise words indeed and with that in mind:

Behold, I give you the Suicide Devil Dodger!

 

danny

War Hero
i think they should deffinatly be able to bear arms if they so wish.
But if there opinion is that god will get them through it then let that be there downfall.
I have ultimate respect for all padres it can not be an perticually easy job mentally with the shit jobs they get to do day in day out.
 
Interested to read these comments, as one closely involved in the original article (ie: writing it).
Apols for the 'Army Chaplains' headline. Some of us hacks fight a losing battle for correctly labelling the various bits of the forces. In this case someone back home laying out this article clearly saw a pic of a man in uniform and thought 'Must be in the Army.' Doh.
For those who haven't had the pleasure, Stu Hallam is a thoroughly top bloke, and a thoughtful man. As he says in the article, he isn't happy or comfortable with this. It's just pragmatic. As the Marines among you will know, the Commando Padres set great store by getting out on the ground and doing what the blokes do. It's a central part of how they approach their work.
This is all a response to a very unusual set of circumstances. The choice is: go armed, or don't go out on the ground with the boys. Not a clear-cut question, but personal discretion seems a pretty good answer to me.
If anyone's interested in more of 40 Cdo's current doings in Helmand there's plenty more (and more to come) on the Mail website: www.dailymail.co.uk
 
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