Dirty Hospitals / C.Diff / NHS

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by fly_past, Oct 12, 2007.

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  1. Yes

    100.0%
  2. No

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Only with a MAJOR change in Govt Policies

    0 vote(s)
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  1. Whats your view of the cause, and a cure?

    Doesn't have to be factual.... but it helps!
     
  2. We cant even ask patients to have a shower before coming to theatre because of the human rights act so how the hell we are going to get on top of this is beyond me , the world has gone mad , scruffy visitors just sitting on patients beds transferring there germs , oh my god it's the hospitals fault , excuse me while I throw up , sorry for being cynical but I work in this situation every single day , some people are unbelievably fxxxxxxxxxg manky , have to have a bath tonight got doctors tommorrow , for christ sake ,

    Flack Jacket on for incoming :whdat: :whdat: :whdat: :whdat:
     
  3. Cause - farming cleaning work out to shiftless, unaccountable, lowest-bid companies whose main interest is turning a profit, not hygiene.

    Cure - re-nationalise hospital cleaning and focus on hygiene above all else.
     
  4. I was having a conversation about this with someone just the other day who basically said that one of the reasons why C-Difficile is so prevalent in our hospitals is because the U.K is a nation of people brought up on anti-biotics therefore our immune systems are weakened due to having to take more and more for effect!!

    However i have to say that it was utterly utterly indefensible behaviour in that hospital in Kent. An utter disgrace and heads should roll!!!
     
  5. Agree with that mate , slightly off thread Derriford Hospital along with most Hospitals in the country get there meals from South Wales {cook chilled} , how the hell can that be cost effective or good for patient recovery , it looks like sludge like we used to get in refits , and think of the transportation costs , doesn't make bloody sense to me . :pukel:
     
  6. Clostridium difficile is a particularly hardy bacteria that can survive the onslaught from broad spectrum antibiotics that are given for a range of complaints. This basically means that the competing bacteria in the guts are killed off and C diff takes advantage; hence its old name of Antibiotic Associated Colitis (AAC). It is especially associated with clindamycin and tends to attack the elderly and infirm as opposed to the young and fit.

    Treatment is with oral metronidazole or (more expensively) oral vancomycin. It can be very difficult to get rid of.

    I am sure that one of the main side issues, in addition to the over reliance on broad spectrum antibiotics, is the turn around time for bed use. Basically, there are too few beds to allow adequate time for deep cleaning.

    On a practical point, it may be worthwhile, next time you have a relative in hospital, to give the chocolates to the cleaners rather than the nurses........
     

  7. Yeah look after the cleaners , turn around time for the beds is a majore concern ,I have taken patients to theatre then once transfered patient onto operating table have seen coagulated bodily fluids on bed rails that so obviously do not belong to the patient in question , they would not pass a RN Rounds Inspection , Period ,
     
  8. The heads that should roll, should also include those in the Labour government who have insisted on 'targets' at the expense of patient care.

    With this government slinging even more cash at the NHS, which is not going to go anywhere but bonuses and salaries for even more 'managers'.

    I can't fully agree that over-use of medicines has brought some of this upon us, but that totally inept organisation (NICE) being grossly and obscenely absorbed with saving money should also be brought to account. Perhaps they ought to be renamed NIPE (Not Interested in Patients Either !!)
     
  9. Eh? I totally agree that overuse of antibiotics by lazy doctors has contributed to the current crop of resistant bacteria, of which C Diff is only one, but added to this there is the case that patients hardly ever took the advice of their GPs and stopped taking antibiotics when their symptoms disappeared, rather than completing courses.

    Cleaning will never be any good until those who clean have some ownership of the situation. In other words, the NHS needs to get back to a situation where the ward is served by a team, under the leadership of the ward sister, which includes the nurses, support workers and cleaners.

    Bring back the Enrolled Nurse, the Ward-aide and a proper team, rather than the disinterested bunch of visitors that currently make up those who provide services for those who really matter in all of this, the patients. For years, too many "experts", who know nothing of caring for the sick, have been given carte-blanche by successive governments in managing the affairs of the Health Service.

    Not enough beds, no concept of redundancy in the system and a service that has become beholden to day case care have led to the current situation. On top of this, the medical and nursing professions no longer have the trust and respect that they once commanded, so we need to return to stricter ways, restricted visiting times, a maximum of 2 visitors per patient.....the list goes on!
     
  10. That's it it's all Labours fault! I don't think so the NHS has been massively under funded, overstretched and under staffed for a very long time. Over twenty years of Tory-initiated privatisation wrecked what was an already imperfect health system, leaving it bureaucratic and top heavy, and driven by government targets rather than the health of the population and yes Labour have after 10 years in power failed to sort it out.

    Gordon is now saying bring back Matron, good idea if she/he is going to kick arse and get these filthy hospitals back to a high standard of hygiene.
     
  11. Got to agree with very word dondon.
    I have Had 5 visits to the surgical unit in Derryford, and on each occation the Naval Sir Johns Have discharged me early, as they feared that I would end up with an infection. On one occation two days after the operation I wanted a shower, the shower room and bath were fecking filthy, and my misses cleaned it before I used it. The HOUSE KEEPERS went ape shit, (Thats our job you can't do that...) but the misses read their horiscope.

    Some of the visitors to the ward where filthy too, they must have been carrying all sorts of bugs on them. But like you said is not PC to say feck off out of my sterial ward you crabby [email protected]. it would solve some of the problems with hospital aquired infections.

    By the way the Theatre staff are possibly the most effective and calming people on the planet THANK MATE.
     
  12. Get rid of wards.
    Why on earth the UK persists with this practice I cannot understand, especially mixed wards.
    If people are ill then they need to be isolated from the possibility of infection, not surely introduced to a greater likelyhood of it. Because I seem to be a kidney stone factory I have found myself in hospitals in different countries. The last time it happened I was in the UK and spent the night in a mixed assessment ward, which I frankly found awful.
    Here in Catalunya you get your own room with a spare bed for a family member to stay in if they wish. It is also accepted that if you are fit enough you will keep the room clean.
    There is no excuse, none whatsoever, for dirty conditions.
    As for the drugs business then I do think that overuse of antibiotics makes a body more susceptible to infection.
    The NHS was started bravely by a country bankrupted by war, getting the thing off to a bad start. It has never been properly reorganised or funded.
     
  13. If you don't have the staff or procedures in place to ensure that patients are clean, and safe to be operated on before going into theatre, then that has nothing to do with the Human Rights Act and everything to do with a lack of backbone on the part of your hospital. If the NHS can refuse treatment to people who refuse to give up smoking, they can certainly refuse treatment to people who refuse to have a bath and are a danger to other patients.
     
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  15. :toilet:

    We have put patients on the operating table in such a state that the surgeon has insisted that they be scrubbed with Betadine , and not just the operating site , fxxxxxxxxxxg disgusting some of them , then there filthy family complain when they get an infection , :pukel: :pukel: :pukel: :tp: :tp:
     

  16. Fxxxxxxxxxg angry now , have to go for a real pint , virtual pint later ,
     
  17. Perhaps the answer is to make all hospitals military hospitals. Civilian patients would be admitted only after signing an agreement that they would be required to participate in ward cleaning if the doctor deemed them to be fit enough.
     
  18. It should be standard practice that upon entering the hospital as a patient you are first given a bath/shower prior to formal admitance into your bed.
    If visitors are manky then they should not be allowed to visit etc.
    All this PC crap has got to stop or it will never get better.
    The call for the return of Matron is fine but a lot of those elligable to do this role have probably never done much time on a ward anyway having gone up the ladder to be admin types.
    The days of a Hattie Jacques style matron are long gone.
    When in Haslar many years ago the wards were cleaned EVERYDAY without fail,one side first followed by the next then the middle.
    You could probably eat your scran off the floor.
    There seems to be no discipline in any of the service industries anymore and I feel thats where part of the problem lies,you cant give someone a bollocking without them running to the unions.
     
  19. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    It seems to me that (a) the cleaning contracts are perhaps not worded so as to ensure clinically necessary levels of cleanliness and/or (b) nobody on the NHS side inspects the cleaning to ensure that it actually gets done to the clinically necessary standard and/or (c) either the ward sisters do not see it as a part of their job to report up the chain of command when either personal or location cleanliness is inadequate or, if they do, nothing happens AND (d) the managers don't understand that it is probably CHEAPER to ensure cleanliness than incur huge sums in damages from victims of hospital-incurred infection and their pay is not structured so as to penalise them individually when shortfalls occur.

    The alcohol handwash stations must be a great help, I have heard of a recent case (on a liver ward, naturally) where a patient feeling desperate for a drink, drank the contents.
     
  20. Record funding for what? More middle managers, more "Modern Artwork" and people going in for a routine op and dying of a Hospital Acquired Infection, it is not acceptable after ten years for Gordon Brown (who wrote the cheques) to say that the NHS is better than ever.

    Cleanliness is obviously important, and what happened at that hospital was awful, the whole Hospitlal (Maidstone) has problems though I recently took a friend to the A&E where they managed to let her go with a broken arm, saying it was no more than a sprain!
     

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