Closure of RAF Lyneham & Wootten Bassett

onions

GCM
The "Sunday People" carries an article about the closure of Lynham and the tributes paid to the returning "Heroes", by residents and visitors when their coffins pass through Wootten Bassett. Those at the top consider the homage paid is a major "own goal". They hope that when flights land at Brize Norton, starting 2012, that the funeral processions can be quietly directed to the A40.

Lets hope that citizens living around Brize will point one, or two, fingers at Westminster and Whitehall and show the same level of support to our returning gallant warriors, as shown by all those who have attended at Wootten Bassett.
 

finknottle

Banned
Here we have an example of just how much the MoD and defence ministers are out of touch with public opinion, either that or it is just high-handed and arrogant, you decide.
 

witsend

MIA
Book Reviewer
finknottle said:
Here we have an example of just how much the MoD and defence ministers are out of touch with public opinion, either that or it is just high-handed and arrogant, you decide.
Please expand on your post!
 

Purple_twiglet

War Hero
Moderator
"Here we have an example of just how much the MoD and defence ministers are out of touch with public opinion, either that or it is just high-handed and arrogant, you decide"

The decision to close Lyneham was taken many years ago before WB became the event it is now. A lot of public money has been spent in the move (which isnt a good idea but thats politics for you), and to scrap it now to appease the pro WB brigade would be the worst of both worlds due to the money invested already, and the way that Lyneham is nearly shut, while Brize is nearly ready.

This is unfortunate, but if anyone thinks this is an intentional slight, I seriously recommend they seek professional help.
 

Seaweed

War Hero
Book Reviewer
We read of sad loss, and of acts of incredible bravery by our people on the ground, but Govt never tells us what this is FOR.

The problem is not that the corteges place an unfortunate emphasis on the cost of the Afghan war, but that Govt has failed to spell out to the people what our war aims are, nor has it given any overall indication that these aims are being met and that the cost in lives and treasure is worthwhile. Are we trying to destroy the Taliban? Or eliminating the poppy growing that does, ultimately, such harm to our civil society (that doesn't seem to behappening)? Or are we carrying out some liberal duty to drag the Afghan mindset out of its slough of mediaeval ignorance,misogyny, brutality and corruption? - the last aim is something that, if history teaches us anything, is neither achievable nor worth the effort.
 

finknottle

Banned
witsend said:
finknottle said:
Here we have an example of just how much the MoD and defence ministers are out of touch with public opinion, either that or it is just high-handed and arrogant, you decide.
Please expand on your post!
It is my opinion that this suits the goverment well, they do not want the publicity of the cortege passing through Wootton Bassett. The people of that town have done us proud in showing their respect for our fallen and I see no good reason to bypass them.
 
finknottle said:
witsend said:
finknottle said:
Here we have an example of just how much the MoD and defence ministers are out of touch with public opinion, either that or it is just high-handed and arrogant, you decide.
Please expand on your post!
It is my opinion that this suits the goverment well, they do not want the publicity of the cortege passing through Wootton Bassett. The people of that town have done us proud in showing their respect for our fallen and I see no good reason to bypass them.
Except of course, that coming into Brize will bypass them, because Wootton Bassett is to the west of Brize, and the JR in Oxford is to the east...

The alternative, is that you seem to want the govt to keep Lyneham open just to accept incoming casualty flights, when the entire rest of its raison d'etre has already moved/is moving to Brize, which is where the casualty flights used to go into anyway, until the Oxfordshire coroner got overwhelmed (which was why they moved to Lyneham).

The UK lasw states that bodies have to be dealt with by the coroner of the county in which they are discovered/enter the UK, thus TEMPORARILY moving repatriation flights to Lyneham meant the Witshire coroner picked up the job, despite the fact that the poor old lads this is all about are still dealt with medically in Oxfordshire.

The Oxfordshire case backlog has now been cleared, and yet you think there is some big conspiracy that is making the government wish to have an aircraft type that is based at Brize, and maintained at Brize, fly into Lyneham, which is further from the mortuary that is used for casualties, and then take off again and fly 40 miles back down its own navtrack so that the crew can go weekenders?

Maybe it does suit the government to be getting away from WB, but that's a secondary consideration to what is actually a resumption of business as usual. Still you have to admire a total and utter unwillingness to look facts in the face...
 

finknottle

Banned
I hope there are no more corteges :cry: but if there are then the NOK could always request that they detour through the admirable town of WB. It will be an awful slap in the face for those good people after they have shown such compassion on our behalf.
 

WreckerL

War Hero
Super Moderator
Finks

Not withstanding the highly emotive subject that this is and I'm sure the Sun will fire up the outrage bus but why do you have to turn everything into a Government bashing exercise?
 
finknottle said:
I hope there are no more corteges :cry: but if there are then the NOK could always request that they detour through the admirable town of WB. It will be an awful slap in the face for those good people after they have shown such compassion on our behalf.
I concur with your sentiments but, (and had you guessed here that I was speaking from local knowledge?), it's a non-starter. There is, roughly speaking, one route from Oxford to Brize Norton and Lyneham. For them to "detour" would include add something like 80-90 miles to the journey, 2 hours (minimum) to the time, and most places en route would see the cortege twice as it set off in utterly the diametric opposite direction to its destination to go to WB and then came back.

Given the policing costs are already astronomical, there is no way Thames Valley police are going to wear it. I'm really sorry to have to bring this debate down to the level of costs, but that is where the buck stops.

In any case the people of WB never wanted to do what they have been doing, they simply felt that they should. In all honesty, even the biggest stalwarts of the attendees will probably be glad for it to stop. Maybe Carterton or Eynsham will pick up the baton.

I don't really want to comment too much on what the NOK may or may not want, but I think it's unlikely to be front of their mind to request an unnecessary detour to Wiltshire in the circumstances...

"Those good people" are not going to see it as "a slap in the face." It is a change, just as much as it hasn't been a "slap in the face" for the dedicated employees of the CWGC that we now bring our fallen home. What has happened at WB has been inspirational and deeply reassuring of our moral fabric as a nation, but it was never intended to be a permanent memorial, and Brize Norton is closer to the final destination, thus reducing the time these deeply distressing (for all concerned) movements are taking place, which must be a good thing.
 

Purple_twiglet

War Hero
Moderator
The people of WB always knew this would be a temporary affair - read anything the town (and not the emotive bandwagon groupies who seem to congregate here) says and that is made clear. They have known all along it was a finite commitment.

They have been wonderful, but I for one won't miss it - I think what was an exceptionally dignified process has been 'griefed up' by a media and public desperate to be part of something. Personally I think it has become too overhyped now, and has lost something in the process.

Lets not try to create a faux outrage where no reason for one exists - this was a lovely gesture, and better to let it cease for a good reason, than to keep it going due to tabloid 'outrage'.
 

finknottle

Banned
WreckerL said:
Finks

Not withstanding the highly emotive subject that this is and I'm sure the Sun will fire up the outrage bus but why do you have to turn everything into a Government bashing exercise?
Why not, isn't blaming the government for everything a national sport, there was a plethora of team players during the last administration, me included but usually as a sub.
 

WreckerL

War Hero
Super Moderator
finknottle said:
WreckerL said:
Finks

Not withstanding the highly emotive subject that this is and I'm sure the Sun will fire up the outrage bus but why do you have to turn everything into a Government bashing exercise?
Why not, isn't blaming the government for everything a national sport, there was a plethora of team players during the last administration, me included but usually as a sub.
Except you tend to take it to the nth degree.
 

lesbryan

War Hero
finknottle said:
Here we have an example of just how much the MoD and defence ministers are out of touch with public opinion, either that or it is just high-handed and arrogant, you decide.
It is very sad !!, But the closure of RAF Lyneham has been on the cards sinc 2003 .The thing to do is make sure the respect paid is still payed no matter where(9not that anyone wants it to continue ) the fallan fly into .Isensative yes malice no .Thts my opinion
 

NotmeChief

Banned
Hearses are able to travel from RAF Brize Norton to the hospital along the A40, without passing through any towns or villages.

But parish councillors in the town of Carterton and village of Bampton have suggested the locations as possible alternative routes to continue the tradition begun in Wootton Bassett.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-12110739
 
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