Binned because of finances....a warning to others!

Discussion in 'Joining Up - Royal Navy Recruiting' started by Gollum, Oct 28, 2007.

Welcome to the Navy Net aka Rum Ration

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial RN website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Hello all,

    Well as some of you will know, I was due to attend HMS Raleigh for basic training on 25th November, but the day after my pre-joining brief I had a phone call asking me to attend the office, to run through my finances.
    To cut a long story short, my income on a yearly basis while at Raleigh would be £12500 (but only for 9 weeks) and my outgoings are just under £11000. Basically I was told that unless I could reduce my outgoings by £500 per month, I am seen as a financial liability by the MOD. The reason my outgoings are high (according to the MOD anyway!) is not because of bad debts, but simply because I have a mortgage!!

    I am really really pissed off as you could imagine, because it seems I have just wasted a year of playing waiting games, when this should have been picked up by someone in the beginning.

    I've been told by the careers office that unless you live at home with your parents and have very little outgoings, or unless you lie about your finances (and please don't think I'm condoning that, cos if you get found out they'll bin you anyway) then no matter how good a candidate you are, you may find your path blocked because the MOD don't want another Fay Tunney situation, whereby people blame their finances on the Royal Navy!!

    I'm sorry for the rant, but hope that my misfortune can help others avoid the disapointment that I have experienced.

  2. Sorry to hear that Gollum.
    Hopefully sometime soon you can get your chance at Raleigh.
    All the best in trying.
  3. Gollum
    Can't you rent your place out to make up the shortfall?
    If not will adopt you and be your seamum
    Good luck mate
  4. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    Sorry to hear your news Gollum.

    It's not an easy one as in order to live off your service wage, your outgoings need to be reduced, no matter what your circumstances are.

    Whilst it is extremely difficult to get on the housing ladder, many of the slightly older applicants, used to a higher income & larger outgoings, simply cannot afford the initial drop in pay. The RN simply doesn't particularly want you to lose your house because you won't be able to maintain your mortgage payments & have enough to live on. It's a life choice decision.

    Possibly by talking to your lender & investigating letting your property, you may be able to resolve the situation.

    Currently outgoings of £916 per month are £200 per month more than your projected net income AFTER training. It's worth having a look at Current Rates of Pay. The Navy estimates you will need a minimum of around £330 to live on per month if you intend going home from time to time, making phone calls & not living onboard ship 365 days per year.

    Good luck.
  5. Mate that's terrible news! I'm so sorry to hear that.
  6. Hi i rent a place it costs me 374 plus 66 council tax i am on pay as you go elec and gas my water is only 20 month i cant give my place up so i hope this does not effect my application. Sorry to hear about you not getting in will you have to do the selection process again.
  7. I was living in a place where rent was £550 per month (with my gf) council tax was £120 and gas and electric around £75 per month. We dropped the house so we could both join the navy. I'm now back with my parents and she's got a share place in Bath which is cheaper for her.

    I'm hoping that'll be enough not to cause issues.

    Really sorry to hear about your difficulties though :( Aren't they able to defer joining for a few months so that you can make arrangements?
  8. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    If your partner earns an income & shares your rent, then it is not an issue, however if you are he only person paying rent then you need to speak to your careers adviser.

    If you are intending renting somewhere on your own whilst serving elsewhere, then you need to seriously consider your priorities.
  9. I have missed something; who is Fay tunney?
  10. Lujon,

    Fay Tunney (or Turney?) was the woman sailor captured by the Iranians and paraded on tv. She sold her story to the press, claiming that she only sold her story because the navy didn't provide enough financial support etc etc.

    My application is still open and if I can reduce my income, then I can basically get straight in, but I've got a family and a young Daughter so renting the house out is not an option.

    It just doesn't seem like there are any more options open to me. I really hope that you other guys don't run into the same problems I have.

  11. To be fair Gollum the RN is actually trying to avoid putting you in a position where you will get into an impossible debt situation. Most employers wouldn't show that much care. It realy is not your fault, nor is it theirs but at the moment the RN and yourself are not compatible. Regretably the chances of the RN being able to change to accomodate you are slim, very slim so if the RN is your dream you will have to find a way of being able to live on what they pay, that is reality.
  12. Yes of course, I had forgotten her name. Obviously, for me, she has had her 15 minutes of fame. However, I hadn't picked up that she blamed the Navy for her financial situation, I just thought that she was greedy.

    Having read your thread I have to say that I have done the DO job in the dim and distant past and other peoples finances can be a strain. A rating misses his monthly payments on a finacial agreement and the company writes to his ship. The Captain gives the letter to the DO and tells him to sort it. You interview the sailor who tells you that it is a 'one off' and he will rectify it and it 'won't happen again'. Two months later the cycle begins again, but his time there are two or maybe three firms writing in; and then it snowballs Eventually it is handed over to the welfare branch because it is taking up too much of the DOs time.

    In the bomber cycle there is much to be done during maintenance periods that is important and sorting sailor Sam's financial stuation shouldn't be allowed impede that work. For that reason I can understand why the Navy might now be trying to prevent it from happening, after all prevention is better ......

    In your case, I think that it should have been identified sooner by the recruiters and you should have been given more information and sooner. What ever happens I hope that it is resolved to your satisfaction.
  13. Gollum, could you manage your debt for a short period of time ? are you married or in a civil partnership, after initial training you could be entitled to a married quarter, I'm sure ninja stoker could advise you more accurately on that. Thus speak to your mortgage provider as for a six month suspension of payments, get your initial training over with, move into a married quarter near your part 2 establishment and rent your house out. Recommence mortgage payments.

    What trade are you interested in it will affect your phase 2 training length and location.
    All the best in your efforts, you could be my replacement as I am heading outside

  14. Why do you want to join the Navy if you will not be able to afford to live. it can take a long time to get promotion and you may feel a liitle strange compared to all the other young lads pissing up all the time and enjoying themselves while you stay in being paid by others to do their ship's duties to make a few quid. You may then start to resent your domestic situation for not allowing you to experience RN life to the full.

    As others have said the Navy is a lifestyle, not a job (unless you already live in Plymouth or Portsmouth). As young apprentices, we were all skint all of the time and we didn't have a mortgage to pay.

    If you were a waster you would have been OK, as you have wisely invested in a house you can only watch the wasters get on the train to Plymouth. I agree, it doesn't seem right but you can't just give a weeks notice and get a better paying job like you can in civvy street.

    I hope you can reduce your outgoings somehow and get on that train.
  15. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    A fair observation, however it may well be that the extent of the outgoings were not disclosed at interview. Some people regard a mortgage as an "asset" rather than a debt & do not declare it as such. Many people don't think spending £50 per month on mobile phonecalls is a regular outgoing, but I'm afraid it is.

    Often what happens is it isn't until security clearance is requested & a credit reference check is undertaken, that a true appreciation of an individuals' financial commitments comes to light. Often the Defence Vetting Agency (DVA) will send a financial statement request if they have not fully disclosed their circumstances. As Security Clearance is so expensive, it's one of the last elements undertaken as we need to be sure the individual fulfils all other (cheaper) required criteria for entry first.

    All people with partners and dependents are advised of their entitlement to service accommodation & the eligibility requirements to qualify.
  16. That's one reason why I only lasted a year in the regs before joining the reserves. I was 20, and earning a good wage. For the last month or so while my papers were going through, my bank accounts were frozen and my parents were lending me money. A decade ago in NZ, we had no financial advice and if we had asked, it would have been a black mark against us.

    I joined the reserves because I still wanted to serve, but I just couldn't and cannot afford to live the regular life. I'm single; my mortgage and council tax comes to more than I'd be paid as an AB in the regs.. it's not the greatest reflection on the Armed Forces, whose personnel protect this country that they should be paid so little for doing so much.
  17. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker War Hero Moderator

    I doubt there's anyone on the forum that would disagree.

    The wages are the same whether you join at 16 or 36, consequently most join younger whilst they can afford to, before they take on larger financial commitments.

    It's always been the case in any section of the public sector and will always be so.
  18. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    You've put your finger on it as usual Ninja. None of these problems existed when both officers and ratings were recruited straight from school and single!

    .. joined on four bob a day and keep. Just about paid for stamps and toothpaste.
  19. Even in my day not all came straight from school, there were quite a few at Dartmouth in my time who were not only not fresh from school but were married and had kids. Of course in those days there was marriage allowance but evn so it must have been hard.

    The thing I have difficulty with is this chap seems to see the RN being at fault for telling him that he cannot afford to join unless he does something about his outgoings. Now he has made commitment to look after his family, all very well but why is he trying to take a job where he can't pay the bills, who is he expecting to pick up the tab for him.

    Now like most of us on RR I think the pay should be better, especially when you are recruiting people up to 30 odd as they are now, but should people be paid according to their chosen expenditure plan or the going rate for the job.
  20. It is always the single man that suffers in the pay and allowances scheme. However if a married man with children joins surely he should be entitled to tax credits of some sort.
    Perhaps JockMc will be able to put some light on this.

Share This Page