Attitude towards Direct entry Officers

Discussion in 'Joining Up - Royal Navy Recruiting' started by EdinburghGuy, Apr 21, 2009.

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  1. Hi,
    3 quick questions:

    I was wondering what the attitude and treatment to direct entry officers is like. I have started my application process to become a Information systems officer. I have heard rumors that in all the armed forces that direct entry officers especialy those who were students are looked down on. It this just a rumor?

    What exactly does an information systems officer do on a day to day basis?

    What is the wardroom like? ie what goes on?

    Thanks for any answers.
  2. Thanks for the link, but Ive allready read the information on the website. Ive looked through all the recruting information inlcuding the handouts from the AFCO. I was more looking for observations or personal experience.
  3. Now do you mean the attitude from officers or the attitude from ratings?
    The majority of occifers start their life at Dartmouth, so why should their be a bad attitude from anyone?
    Occifers promoted from the lower deck normally fall into one of two types (in my experience)

    Type 1
    They are extremely good and respected by both their superiors and those on the lower deck
    Type 2
    They are obnoxious twats and disliked by those on the lower deck and spend their time kissing the arses of senior occifers.

    Luckily type ones are more frequently encountered than type twos.

    My experience of wardroom life was gained as a civilian on various sea trials. Life was well organised, there was a certain pecking order, and the Jimmy was god. I must admit to enjoying my time spent in the wardroom, it was extremely sociable and friendly (even for an ex wafu PO).

    As an occifer you are not expected to be liked by the troops. However be fair in all matters, listen to your senior rates and you will find that you'll be respected and often even liked. :p
  4. From the opposite viewpoint, the RN has for many yerars always drawn a significant proportion of it's officers from the lower deck, but even today I think the majority are direct entry. Some may say the bedst come from the lower deck and some will say the opposite, the reality they are both wrong where you start does not determine whether or not you will be a good officer, but if you are a good officer you will be respected by most above and below you (there are always the odd trublemakers). The big trick is to get your commision as soon as possible, so if your are outside go for direct entry, if you are already in then it is the UY scheme, but ASAP. Go for it, do not delay. If you are any good you will make it.
  5. Thanks for the advice. Thats questions 1 sorted. Any one got an insite into what an informations systems engineer would do on a daily basis and working on a "There is no stupid questions, once google has failed you" what is a ward room like both in contents and what happens. All i can find is rules and regs'. cheers

    Sorry I meant the attutude from other officers.
  6. Edinburghguy, ref Wardroom.

    This is the place you will eat, relax and socialise so as to what's it like well that totally depends on the Officers of the ship you join doesn't it. There will always be some good, some O and some "others". The general atmosphere will be driven by the personality of the Jimmy as he is Mess Prez.
  7. Wardrooms being made up of people are very variable, the mess president sets the tone but strong willed department heads can have an interesting influence. Generally they are comforatble places to eat and relax when off watch and have no other duties to carry out. There is usually as much banter as you will find in any other mess though I have very little experience of 'big ship' wardrooms.
  8. Ref What would you do on a daily basis.

    Well depends on the day, you will be part of the WE Dept (Weapons Engineering), reporting to the WEO (Weapons Engineering Officer) on all aspects of the IS and Communications systems onboard. This includes UHF, VHF, HF and SatCom links plus the ships internal IS systems. I think you will find it a very challenging position and very different from an IS Manager job in civvy street. You will have a tram of technicinas working for you who are trained in their tasks and the Senior Rates will be able to offer advice on availability and reliability of all systems, it will be up to you to proiritize and advise Command as to state of IS and comms. Plus take the heat off your maintainers.

    If you get the mix right you will find that your team will be very loyal and will go to the wall for you, if not it will be a hard life, but with some experience you will find that the lads know what to do and will get on with it with very little prodding from you.

    Hope this is helpful.
  9. Edinburgh Guy,

    Firstly good luck with your application process. There has already been some good advice posted previously but I will add my 2 cents worth. I am a serving WE Officer and have some relatively up to date information.

    I would say that as an IS Officer, once out of Dartmouth, you may have a first job working on Shoreside IT infrastructure. Eventually, you will complete the Systems Engineering and Management Course (SEMC) at HMS Collingrad which is approximately 8 months long and you will be on course with "regular" WE Officers. I had 2 IS Officers on my course and both did extremely well though initially struggled with the theory aspects - as did a lot of other people! Ultimately you will go to sea on CVS, LPD or OCEAN. In my experience, 8 months on CVS and 2 years on T42, big ships are a totally different environment than small ships. There will be a lot of Officers in the Wardroom (bout 40), with more when TAG or Battlestaff arrive. Therefore it might take you a little longer to find your place but you eventually will and I'm sure you will enjoy it. Just ease yourself in and see how the different personalities interact before you shout "naked Bar" !!

    As for the job, and as previously mentioned, you will be the Information Systems Engineer (ISE) which on a Capital Ship can be a demanding but rewarding job. However, you will still have to pass a Charge Board and so will still need to know about the Combat System, Weapons, Admin etc. Just remember that although you will know a lot, there is still a massive amount of information to take in so use and LISTEN to your Senior Rates and ask lots of questions. Be humble, they will have seen many Section Officers in their time and so respect them and their years of experience as they can really help you do your job effectively. When you pass your Board, you will be exactly the same as a regulare WE OFficer but will have the added experience of IT Systems.

    As an aside, when I went through BRNC in 04, IS Officers joined as Lts so you will gain an extra 2 years seniority over other entrants as well as the extra pay - though this might be out of date.

    Apologies for the essay but finally found a topic that I can contribute to. Good luck and feel free to PM me if you need any more information.

  10. Thanks very much for all the advice! One last question though. I wear glasses, contacts, and I also wear prescritpion goggles for swimming. For the swimming and other direct water based activities/assesments would I be expected to wear my glasses or lenses :? ? Would there be the option to wear my goggles for the duration. I am a strong swimmer but swiming with the goggles is much easier.
  11. Would your goggles be readily available when the call - ABANDON SHIP is called!!!!! Simply an observation.

    As for your post. How are direct entry officer treated.

    Ask your self - do you care?

    If you do care, then join the RAF!
  12. I just wanted to know, this is the career path i want to take so a few knocks on the road is to be expected. I was just wondering if there was the attitude that direct entry officers were not treated as well as other officers such as being passed up for promotions and the like. The glasses issue I was more of a fleeting thought. I was not expecting to have them tied to me left hand at all times lol. Ill just have to make sure my glasses dont come off easily.hmm a lanyard may be an idea. How do other people with glasses cope, daily lenses?
  13. EdinburghGuy,

    just to absolutely clear once and for all about this- this isn't the police force! Direct Entry officers are the absolute vast majority- somewhere around 60%.

    Promotion is on aptitude but, simply because of the number of officer jobs you need to do to progress, the vast majority of senior officers are "direct entry." It is so much a given that it tends to be the non direct guys that worry. Because of this, outside the RNR no one would ever use the term direct entry to talk about an officer.
  14. tiddlyoggy

    tiddlyoggy War Hero Book Reviewer

    Do unto others as you would have others do unto you. If you let that guide you, you won't go far wrong. Be FAIR and CONSISTENT, you don't even necessarily have to be nice, that's just a bonus.
  15. EdinburghGuy: Spelling the word RUMOUR would be a first stage to success if you really are going to become an orifice....
  16. Thanks for all the advice.
  17. PM Sent to Edinburgh Guy
  18. I always gave all officers a chance before hating them with a passion
  19. It is the uniform that 'commands' respect. If the person inside is a decent person as well, then that is a bonus.
    You cannot expect to be liked by everyone, that is not your purpose, and I think it would be a bit odd if you were in fact liked by everyone. Nor should you unecessarily upset those you live in close proximity to, they have plenty of ways of returning the favour.
    I don't doubt that a fair few people weren't overly keen on Nelson :lol: despite the myth.

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