Anti-Fun Police at it again

#1
Yesterday's Gosport Carnival procession had to be cancelled at the last minute after the police decided trainees from HMS Collingwood and 'pensioners' were incapable of acting as stewards. There are other examples of cancelled events in this article in yesterday's Pompey News.

Carnival organisers fear mountains of red tape could spell the end of the traditional processions of floats. They said the bureaucracy involved in setting up the town and village parades now takes up so much time and money that their days could be numbered.

They hit out as the organisers of Gosport's annual carnival procession pulled the plug on today's march after police demanded copies of briefing notes to be given to each of dozens of stewards and a comprehensive marshalling plan – and gave them two hours to comply.

They also told the organisers they were concerned the extra stewards they had drafted in to help save the parade in the first place would comprise 'trainee sailors and pensioners'...
It looks like the good old days of village fetes, fairs, carnivals, galas and street parades are numbered owing to the huge increase in bureaucracy and costs required to provide adequate insurance cover and stewarding. The Horndean fete, held in a local farmer's field, ceased several years ago because of the exorbitant cost of public liability insurance demanded.

Will people ever be made responsible for their own safety at public events again? In this age of litigation, we really seem to be breeding a generation of namby-pambies wrapped in cotton wool. Is it any wonder that youngsters perform acts like tombstoning (jumping off piers and cliffs into shallow water) and participate in gang-fights to find some adventure in life?
 

janner

MIA
Book Reviewer
#2
No problem with the Veterans Parade at Weymouth today, I suppose that because of the hugh number of people that it attracts the Council pick up the insurance costs
 
#3


I organised a fete for the Bournemouth Sea Cadets in 2000, I was the CO of the Unit. I could not believe the amount of red tape, and Council Meetings I had to attend prior to the event happening. Liability Insurance for up to £5m, Ambulance in attendance, so many toilets (something like one portaloo for every 25 people or something like that). How does one know how many are going to come. Then there was the not allowed's, the allowed's, you cannot do this, but you can do that. Noise levels (the field was next to a cemetary).

It was worth the hassle, and we raised £4000 for the Cadets. Would I do it again, yes, but with a bit more help

Regards, Chris

 
#4
FUN and POLICE should never ever be in the same sentence.

Nothing surprises me anymore about the way this country of ours is being run by complete and utter imbeciles and I fear its only going to get worse.
 
#5
Locals should bombard the Chief Constable with letters about that, I used to hold the police as a whole with respect, not any more I'm afraid.
 
#6
I think you'll probably find it's the H&S Nazies and not the coppers. Don't forget the H&S lot brought a private proescution against the police for endangering public safety when they shot that Brazilian guy.

Does anyone know what "accident" means anymore?
 
#7
stabradop said:
Locals should bombard the Chief Constable with letters about that, I used to hold the police as a whole with respect, not any more I'm afraid.
I'm with DE on this one. Our Police are not really the problem. They are strapped for cash and personnel and are bound by the idiot laws that our elected representatives introduce for us.

We live in a society which is increasingly using litigation to make a fast pound or two for doing nothing more than admitting they are stupid for drinking tea that is too hot or ignoring signs which tell them not to do something and then crying because it hurt . Is it any wonder therefore that we are where we are and the once simple to organise carnivals are cancelled for fear of having to make huge payouts because someone else did something stupid and got injured?

SF
 
#8
Picture the scene: A 5 acre sports field; a summer's day; a tractor towing a lawn mower; the fresh smell of new-mown grass; a sign at one corner of the field bearing the legend "Beware, grass cutting in progress"!

The Health and Safety Nazis have a lot to answer for, but I suppose it keeps sign manufacturers in business.
 
#9
A simple fact about H&S legislation that the judiciary appear reluctant to enforce is that individuals have the same, if not greater, duty as employers/organisers - that is to keep themselves safe and out of harms way. If anyone ignores a wel placed and obvious warning sign then they can be prosecuted under the same legislation.
If this was enforced - it may be, you just never hear of it - you'd probably find that claims reduced. Maybe.
 
#10
drunken_engineer said:
A simple fact about H&S legislation that the judiciary appear reluctant to enforce is that individuals have the same, if not greater, duty as employers/organisers - that is to keep themselves safe and out of harms way. If anyone ignores a wel placed and obvious warning sign then they can be prosecuted under the same legislation.
If this was enforced - it may be, you just never hear of it - you'd probably find that claims reduced. Maybe.
Having been the organiser of events where H&S is a serious consideration it is important that the organiser/employer does think seriously about what could go wrong and how to cope with it if it does.

As for Joe Public if they cock it up they get no compo, and if the organisers did their job properly no blaim on them either.

In reality I think the current flush of problems with marches etc is more down to the public liability insurance problems over recent years rather than genuine Elfin Safety. Of course the faceless ones just blaim any one but themselves despite the problem being due to their own incompetance. If parades have to be cancelled at short notice then it is not the fault of the rules, rather either the organiser for not getting themselves properly organised in good time, or the same for the approving authority.

Round here we are at the peak of local gala days and I have not heard of one being cancelled.
 
#13
janner said:
No problem with the Veterans Parade at Weymouth today, I suppose that because of the hugh number of people that it attracts the Council pick up the insurance costs
It may be because the older generation are more likely to vote and is nothing more than political self-interest.
 
#14
SILVER_FOX said:
In amongst all of this though we all know that someone is making a hefty profit. After all, isn't that what its all about?

SF
Well it all started because the public liability insurers were making a loss, particularly the one that did most of the local authority business which actually went tits up, so premiums and conditions hardened up considerably.
 
#16


It turns out in this case that the Police did issue forms for the organisers to complete with regards to what was required, what was the content of the parade, etc etc.

The organisers not knowing who was in authority failed to complete the forms and return them. Thus the police withdraw their people from the network of events.

These forms are needed by the Police so that roads can be blocked off if required to do so. The Council can set up diversion notices, etc. And for the Police to know how many traffic controllers will be available from the sources.

Regards, Chris


 

sgtpepperband

War Hero
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#17
Pompey News said:
Former mayor lays into police red tape over procession axe

A FORMER mayor has criticised the police for forcing carnival organisers to scrap a traditional procession with floats. Graham Burgess said he was 'astounded' that red tape forced last Saturday's parade through Gosport to be abandoned for the first time in half a century.

He said the decision, which was forced on the organisers at the 11th hour, lacked common sense.

It was bureaucracy contained in the Traffic Management Act 2004, only now just starting to bite, which hit – and which could hit other carnival processions.

Councillor Burgess, a Conservative who represents Lee East on Gosport Borough Council and was mayor in 2005-2006, said the decision would hit charity coffers.

The annual carnival is run by the Gosporteers – a fund-raising group which raises cash every year for a variety of good causes chosen by the borough's mayor.

Helpers would have collected funds in buckets as the procession wound its way on a three-mile route through town centre streets, but could not because the parade was cancelled

Cllr Burgess said: 'The decision by Hampshire Constabulary to effectively cancel the Gosport Carnival beggars belief.

'As a former mayor of Gosport, I am one who realises exactly what the Gosporteers do for local charities and the amount of time, effort and commitment they put into this.'

Sergeant Kevan Sitch gave the Gosporteers just two hours last Thursday to respond to a multi-page e-mail document in which he wanted details of emergency stewards who had been drafted in.

He said he would have been happy to provide two police cyclists to escort the carnival procession, but the offer was withdrawn when the Gosporteers said they could not meet the deadline and they scrapped the procession.

Sgt Sitch said he was concerned that many of the stewards who would control 47 road junctions on the route would be made up of 'trainee sailors and pensioners'.

But Cllr Burgess said: 'If my memory is correct, last year's carnival had two police constables, two police community support officers and two traffic wardens.

'This year we had the assistance of 12 members of the senior service from HMS Sultan who are trained in all aspects required for the carnival – crowd control, control of traffic – being told they were not qualified to enable the carnival to take place. Do the police live in the real world?'
[Source]
 

janner

MIA
Book Reviewer
#18
According to last night Meridian news the required forms were sent out last November but not returned. Still never let the truth spoil a good story
 
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