An amazing picture

jumpertucker

Midshipman
cheers for the heads-up Fish-M i'm a WAFU, if it came to me putting in wedges we'd be in the shit, the instructors on Whale Island could tell you! ( thanks for the cue cards at the window of the engine room guys) then again chances are it would be a weekend so we would be saved by the proper sailors whilst we rested. "partial CAG" :lol:
 

Levers_Aligned

War Hero
Moderator
fishmiester said:
dunkers said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Barham_(1914)

As she rolled over to port, her magazines exploded and the ship quickly sank with the loss of over two-thirds of her crew.
Not sure why sea water would cause the boilers to explode? - would the compression caused by the water rushing in cause the boilers to burst, or something?
I'm not sure either, not being a stoker. Is it an urban myth then that boilers explode when the sea water hits them??
Rapid cooling etc
No, that's definately X and Y turret deep magazines cooking off. The four open fronted boilers wouldn't produce that kind of energy to explode like that. All you would see is clouds and clouds of steam. The tubes would probably rupture once in contact with cold seawater, but the speed that ship has capsized. I would wager that most of the engine and boiler room would be floooded with superheated steam anyway as most of the main engines come adrift and the auxiliaries come free from their seats. It would have been a grizly detah for those trapped below, and in total darkness, as well.

Levers
 
fishmiester said:
dunkers said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Barham_(1914)

As she rolled over to port, her magazines exploded and the ship quickly sank with the loss of over two-thirds of her crew.
Not sure why sea water would cause the boilers to explode? - would the compression caused by the water rushing in cause the boilers to burst, or something?
I'm not sure either, not being a stoker. Is it an urban myth then that boilers explode when the sea water hits them??
Rapid cooling etc
The PO Stoker on the computer next door says that the water going down the funnel hitting the furnace, because of the heat there is a flash off of steam, and he thinks hydrogen might form? He denies all knowledge now that he is a civvie! I have no idea, I am a lawyer!
 
Any physicists on RR who can solve this mystery... or superintelligent stokers? I'm a bit dubious about the generation of hydrogen at these relativly low temperatures though - superheated steam, yes, but hydrogen gas?

Come on you physicists!
 
Always_a_Civvy said:
Any physicists on RR who can solve this mystery... or superintelligent stokers? I'm a bit dubious about the generation of hydrogen at these relativly low temperatures though - superheated steam, yes, but hydrogen gas?

Come on you physicists!
You maybe right, the PO Stoker next door was not being very helpful when I told him what I was doing so perhaps he was talking b*ll*cks just to make me look an idiot!
 

CheefTiff

Lantern Swinger
fishmiester said:
Re The Barham

Is it really the Magazines blowing or is it when the sea water hits her boilers.

I have watched the film a couple of times and the explosion seens to occur just as the water rushes down the funnels??
I'm with the boiler explosion theory myself. Listen carefully to the video and you can hear the steam rushing out. No doubt a rush of cold sea water onto very hot boiler tubes could cause a crack with disastrous consequences. Bear in mind there would probably also have been fuel tanks under the boilers whose tank lids could have leaked as the ship turned slowly over. This could have also caused the explosion.
 

UncleAlbert

War Hero
Probably a combination of boilers and magazine, the official view is the cause has never been determined,
See a brutal picture like that though, it certainly brings it home to you. (shudder)

...
 

CheefTiff

Lantern Swinger
Levers_Aligned said:
fishmiester said:
dunkers said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Barham_(1914)

As she rolled over to port, her magazines exploded and the ship quickly sank with the loss of over two-thirds of her crew.
Not sure why sea water would cause the boilers to explode? - would the compression caused by the water rushing in cause the boilers to burst, or something?
I'm not sure either, not being a stoker. Is it an urban myth then that boilers explode when the sea water hits them??
Rapid cooling etc
No, that's definately X and Y turret deep magazines cooking off. The four open fronted boilers wouldn't produce that kind of energy to explode like that. All you would see is clouds and clouds of steam. The tubes would probably rupture once in contact with cold seawater, but the speed that ship has capsized. I would wager that most of the engine and boiler room would be floooded with superheated steam anyway as most of the main engines come adrift and the auxiliaries come free from their seats. It would have been a grizly detah for those trapped below, and in total darkness, as well.

Levers
I take it you've never seen photographs of the devestation caused by a boiler explosion then.
 

Not_a_boffin

War Hero
Probably is a combo of mags plus boilers.

Hot steel boiler + cold sea water = thermal shock = material fracture

material fracture + high pressure = big bang.....
 
My dad was on the Russian Convoys (I am younger than that appears!) and he spent most of the time in rig, either on watch or in his hammock (allegedly!). However I do remember him telling me that if you went over board in on the Murmansk run then you had about a minute before you die from hypothermia.

He was on the Forsyth which used its last torpedo to sink the Edinburgh which was carrying Russian Gold to pay for all the war materiel. They evacuated the Edinburgh first (is that the righ term? am non-sea goer!) and on board were men from the Jamaica which had been sunk on the outward journey.

Makes you think doesn't it!
 

jeeperz

Midshipman
Lieutenant-Commander 'Ginger' Lynd
(Filed: 09/08/2006)

Lieutenant-Commander "GInger" Lynd, who has died aged 84, was one of the last survivors of the sinking, off Alexandria, of the battleship Barham, the largest warship lost to a U-boat.
Shortly after 4 pm on November 25 1941 Lynd was at his action station below the bridge when he felt three thuds as Barham was hit by torpedoes fired by Kapitänleutnant Hans-Diedrich Freiherr von Tiesenhausen in the German submarine U-331.
As Barham lurched on to her port side, Lynd climbed a narrow set of vertical ladders inside the bridge superstructure. When he stepped off one ladder, several large gas cylinders came down, sweeping the men who had been fleeing from their mess decks with them. Lynd just had time to open an armoured door and emerge on to the bridge, where Vice-Admiral Henry Pridham-Wippell was shaking the hand of Barham's commanding officer, Captain Geoffrey Cooke.
Clambering on to the now horizontal starboard side of the ship to climb back down the outside of the superstructure, Lynd was daunted by the torpedo bulges, which were covered by sharp barnacles. He was wondering whether the ship would roll over on top of him when the after-magazine exploded, hurling him into the water. He woke up in darkness and silence, thinking that he had been sucked into the sinking hull. Then, scraping heavy diesel oil from his eyes, he found himself amid flotsam and survivors.
Captain Cooke was dead. But Pridham-Wippell (known irreverently as "Pig and Whistle") was treading water and urging men to climb on to a raft; meanwhile he was trying to raise morale by leading a chorus of There'll Always be an England. In less than four minutes the 31,000-ton ship had disappeared. Of the original crew of 1,311, amazingly, 449 had survived.
For some two hours Lynd trod water. He had suffered severe gashes from being blasted across the barnacles, and his lungs and stomach filled with fuel oil. He was one of the last to be pulled from the water.
Douglas Lynd was born on January 7 1922 in Liverpool. At 17 the ginger-haired Douglas volunteered for the Royal Navy as a writer, one of the service's specialist administrators normally responsible for personnel records, cash accounting and pay. However, he became expert at signal decoding, and claimed to be the first man in the Mediterranean Fleet to learn from decrypting an Admiralty message that Bismarck had been sunk. After his escape from Barham, he recuperated in Durban before returning in a troopship to Liverpool, and then seeing shore service at the signal school, HMS Mercury, before being sent to India.
He was commissioned in 1955, and his appointments included Malta, Portland Bill, Yorkshire, Chatham, Gosport, and the Singapore naval base HMS Terror; he also served with 42 Commando in Singapore, where he established a sub-aqua club and led expeditions in Malaya to find the Sumatran rhino and the giant leatherback turtle. He was disappointed when his time in the aircraft carrier Victorious was cut short by the decision to scrap her, and ended his naval career as mess secretary of HMS Cochrane at Rosyth. He was appointed MBE.
After retiring from the Navy, Lynd became secretary of the Scottish Lawn Tennis Association in Edinburgh. He later travelled extensively in the Far East, and, aged 67, trekked to the base camp of Mount Everest.
Ginger Lynd married, in 1943, Doreen Marjory Fall. She predeceased him in 1997, and he is survived by two sons and a daughter.
 

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