Action Working Dress

[onions]

A buddy and I were discussing "Jack" films today and one of the questions that came up was, "What was the AWD during before, during and after WW2. When were No 8s introduced"?

Keep Striving

 

[Greenie]

Before the war and during the war[WW2] it was blue suits or overalls.
In those days you had three blue suits . No 1's , best ,2's duty rig -red badges and 3's oldest blues red badges. Overalls were either worn over the blue suit or depending on climate on their own.
I don't think AWD [No 8's ]came in till about 1947 although the Canadians and US Navy had shirts and trousers working rigs.

Also you were issued with an Oilskin and an overcoat the pussers burberry
[raincoat] with detachable lining came in about 1956 .

 

[Skipperino]

Sorry to bump an old thread, but 1945.

 

[onions]

The rig they wear now is, I think, bloody awful, especially if it is worn in public. While waiting for a flight at Southampton airport my wife pointed out someone with a White Ensign shoulder patch. They looked like a complete and utter scranbag!! OK, I am an ex G.I. but this guy was the epitome of a stoker in one of Jan's cartoons! When he turned round I was aghast to see that he was a Warrant Officer! What a disgrace to the RN of today.

 

[WreckerL]

The rig they wear now is, I think, bloody awful, especially if it is worn in public. While waiting for a flight at Southampton airport my wife pointed out someone with a White Ensign shoulder patch. They looked like a complete and utter scranbag!! OK, I am an ex G.I. but this guy was the epitome of a stoker in one of Jan's cartoons! When he turned round I was aghast to see that he was a Warrant Officer! What a disgrace to the RN of today.

It is what it is, PCS is basically MTP in blue. No doubt your predecessors thought you looked a sack of shit when you wore 8's.

Personally I don't see anything wrong with it, at least it's not blue camo pattern like some navy's have adopted.

 

[fishhead]

For us PSOFs it is always a little strange to see what is now PCS being worn outside the confines of H.M. Ships/Establishments. The old No.8s/4s were never very smart in my opinion and on most occasions scruffy as after all they were working clothes. I have no opinion on the latest creation but doubt they are any less smart than what they replaced.

 

[BreathingOutOnTheWayUp]

Before the war and during the war[WW2] it was blue suits or overalls.

Ovies, officially referred to as boiler suits (regular dhobeying might not have removed the oil/grease stains but the original dark blue colour aka sprog shine soon washed-out to med blue & lighter.)


Clip depicting Jack & his oppos wearing ovies (from the current BBC1 WW2 drama series "World on Fire"*) aboard HMS CUMBERLAND prior to the Battle of the River Plate.
,
But ovies with collars? Perhaps they were subsequently removed? 1960's onwards they were issued without collars.

-https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0009f7n/world-on-fire-series-1-episode-3

 

[WreckerL]

Ovies, officially referred to as boiler suits (regular dhobeying might not have removed the oil/grease stains but the original dark blue colour aka sprog shine soon washed-out to med blue & lighter.)

View attachment 44157
Clip depicting Jack & his oppos wearing ovies (from the current BBC1 WW2 drama series "World on Fire"*) aboard HMS CUMBERLAND prior to the Battle of the River Plate.
,
But ovies with collars? Perhaps they were subsequently removed? 1960's onwards they were issued without collars.

-https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0009f7n/world-on-fire-series-1-episode-3

Pedant mode on

In the series he's on HMS Exeter, the Cumberland didn't get to Montevideo on time.

Pedant mode off

 

[BreathingOutOnTheWayUp]

^My bold - Edited to correct my Senior Moment. :BLUSH:

 

[dapperdunn]

You can still see the mast of the Graf Spee above the water in the estuary. I've passed by a few times transiting to Montevideo.

 

[northern-matelot]

The rig they wear now is, I think, bloody awful, especially if it is worn in public. While waiting for a flight at Southampton airport my wife pointed out someone with a White Ensign shoulder patch. They looked like a complete and utter scranbag!! OK, I am an ex G.I. but this guy was the epitome of a stoker in one of Jan's cartoons! When he turned round I was aghast to see that he was a Warrant Officer! What a disgrace to the RN of today.

How do you think we feel? It shrinks quicker than my tackle in horsea island lake in winter and fades faster than a peaky blinder's hair cut!

A Post-Project evaluation was recently carried out on the RNPCS uniform that was introduced into Service in 2015. The evaluation, backed by numerous PDRs, DLIMs, and direct user feedback, highlighted that the main concern with RNPCS is the unsuitability in hot climates. Subsequently, the RNPCS Upgrade Project has been established. Our Vision Statement is to “Procure a world class, professional, smart, military style uniform, that Royal Navy sailors are proud of, which is commensurate with a world class Navy.” We are seeking a solution that reduces the thermal burden in hot climates, yet, with appropriate layering, improves the insulating properties when operating in cold weather conditions. Our requirement is technically challenging and complex, particularly given the trade-off between flame retardancy and the weight of the material. Four materials were selected and made into uniforms in May, unfortunately failed either or both the flame and shrinkage tests that are required before a uniform can be trialled at sea. We are seeking to introduce an upgraded product in Q4 2020, subject to successful trials.

Happy?

 

[Dredd]

"Military style" uniform?

What, like this?

 

[MCC is the place for me]

The new AWD still has convenient pockets for individuals to put their hands in.

Witnessed two JRs in Barrow last week walking back to the boat in AWD. One of them had cold hands as he had them in his pockets. The Ex WO evil eye I gave him was enough to make him see the errors of his ways.

On topic, The powers that be keep on tweaking or massively altering what jack should wear. Replacement to 8s were a disaster and the follow ons not much better. If the comments of Northern Matelot are common then they have done it yet again.

Why do they not get representative opinions of all current personnel along the lines of a continuous attitude survey? Ask what they want and match that to what works in terms of garment life, protection and practicality. Apologies if they did this but certainly on the 8s replacement it was not done. Clothing turned up and it was "get on with it jack".

 

[dapperdunn]

Why do they not get representative opinions of all current personnel along the lines of a continuous attitude survey?

Because they couldn't give a flying fuck what the end user thinks?

 

[MCC is the place for me]

Because they couldn't give a flying fuck what the end user thinks?

So just bring out some clothng that is either not practical, shrinks in the wash or fades badly and waste millions doing so. Then repeat. Again and again.

 

[RabC]

If it’s working rig what do looks matter as long as it is practical. I do however question the wearing of working rig outside establishments. If Onions was correct why wasn’t the WO at Southampton airport wearing half blues or whatever the name is now?

 

[northern-matelot]

The new AWD still has convenient pockets for individuals to put their hands in.

Witnessed two JRs in Barrow last week walking back to the boat in AWD. One of them had cold hands as he had them in his pockets. The Ex WO evil eye I gave him was enough to make him see the errors of his ways.

On topic, The powers that be keep on tweaking or massively altering what jack should wear. Replacement to 8s were a disaster and the follow ons not much better. If the comments of Northern Matelot are common then they have done it yet again.

Why do they not get representative opinions of all current personnel along the lines of a continuous attitude survey? Ask what they want and match that to what works in terms of garment life, protection and practicality. Apologies if they did this but certainly on the 8s replacement it was not done. Clothing turned up and it was "get on with it jack".

We had pockets in convenient places on 8’s / 4’s, your issue is that you’re dealing with submariners in barrow, away from the rest of the mob, we had the same issue in Rosyth when the QNLZ was being built, especially with the stokers that had to wear civvy arc protection overalls who thought they’d get away with not saluting officers and such.

As for the story behind the new rig, the problem is, back in 2012, half my ships company (HMS Sutherland) we’re cutting about in MTP PCS , either because they were boarding party, or upper deck weapons crews or something else that meant wearing body armour. The explained reason for this is it tends out s a visible deterrent to would be attackers, though another reason I’ve heard for wearing MTP was that it didn’t have buttons (apparently they kinda hurt after wearing body armour for a while). But the 2SL didn’t like sailors wearing green as joe public thought we were army (at one point there were more naval service personnel in Afghanistan than there was Army, but e were all in green so no one realised). To counter this 2SL decided to bring out a naval PCS uniform the one we now have), the problem is that MTP PCS is copy righted and the navy couldn’t afford the rights, so we’re wearing a knock off version.


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[Paxman_Valenta]

Sorry to bring up a relatively old thread but I'm home on leave and bored.

I've just left a ship where we have complained unanimously about the quality of RNPCS. It is very impractical in hot weather and the sizing leaves a lot to be desired. It also fades extremely quickly, and even front line ships do not yet hold stocks of it so when it fails (and it does) people are forced to wear inadequate, damaged and tatty clothing because we can't get any replacements from stores.

I've been in the UAE where there is a high US presence and although their multi-cam uniform isn't what we should wear, but the quality (I think Under Armour are involved) is a huge improvement on our shoddy attempt at a 21st century uniform.

Overalls (which are now essentially two pieces of material stitched together across the back) fail all the time because as your typical stoker bends down to do something in one of her majesty bilges, the overalls tear across the stitching. I've just done four months on a T23, took eight pairs of overalls with me and only came back with two as they are so knackered they're practically unsalvageable.

Despite numerous feedback sessions with Staff Officers, the clothing supplier and HODs on board as NM highlighted in his post, the three alternatives have failed their QC testing, so we are stuck with crap rig for now.

 

[Dredd]

Sounds very much like the usual accountancy false economy.

Buy cheap, pay dear.

 

[redmonkey]

I think they may be changing it again.

I have seen a photo of some monstrosity of a uniform that looks like it has been thrown on the floor then someone who has been painting the deck walks through the wet paint and onto the uniform leaving boot prints all over it.

I must be in the minority as I prefer the RN PCS to the uniforms we had before.

Dont get me wrong, it has it's faults but it is more practical than the old no.8s.

If the command allowed us to relax jackets when in tropical climes that you help. It is mentioned in uniform regs.

The fleece needs ditching and revert back to the wooly pully. I have seen the command do this but no one else. The RM still have their wooly pully for use with pcs.

Has anyone else seen the new kit at all?