A new perspective of punishment

Discussion in 'Diamond Lil's' started by hobbit, Jul 9, 2007.

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  1. This is a topical and somewhat controversial subject involving euthenasia . While primarily the subject concerns end of life choices for those suffering or with a terminal illness this approaches criminals facing a life-time in gaol . Personally I view life imprisonment as a form of torture , a slow death . Prisoners sometimes subjected to isolation and vulnerable to attacks by other prisoners plus sadistic treatment by some ' screws ' makes sense to end it all in one clean act . This is a prisoner asking to be executed not an outsider calling for blood . It doesn't need to be a stage performance as with Saddam Hussein but a civilised act where the prisoner , by choice , is given a knock out drop , Nembutal is the most efficient and painless method I understand . Anyway , for what it's worth , food for thought .

    "6. Prisoner backs 'euthanasia for lifers' calls

    Jul 7 2007
    by Robin Turner,
    Western Mail

    A PRISONER serving life in a Welsh jail has called for the Government to consider allowing voluntary euthanasia for inmates serving long sentences.
    The demand from the Swansea Jail prisoner comes a month after 300 Italian inmates signed a letter to the country’s president Giorgio Napolitano urging him to bring back the death penalty.
    The letter was from a member of the Sicilian Mafia, 52-year-old Carmelo Musumeci, in prison for 17 years, who said he is tired of “dying a little bit every dayâ€.
    “We want to die just once,†he said, “and we are asking for our life sentence to be changed to a death sentence.â€
    Now, a prisoner in Swansea Jail signing himself Allien Dewi- David has written to the prisoners’ newspaper Inside Time asking for a law change to allow certain prisoners to be killed.
    The letter reads,“I was listening on the radio to the story in Italy whereby 300 lifers had sent a petition to the Italian government seeking the introduction of the death penalty for certain lifer inmates.
    “As a long-serving lifer, this got me thinking about the UK and one of the arguments consistently put forward against the reintroduction of the death penalty is what if an innocent person is put to death?
    “However if we introduced what would amount to voluntary euthanasia for lifers, this would nullify that argument.
    “Obviously there would need to be extensive psychiatric tests for anyone considering this option, but in principle I believe it’s one worth examining.
    “As for public approval – no problem there, which would in turn lead to political approval.â€
    Editor of Inside Time John Roberts said it is the first time voluntary euthanasia for prisoners had been broached in the publication.
    He said, “While we have not discussed the issue before, suicide and how to deal with very long sentences is obviously a big topic inside.
    “Many prisoners who are not likely to get out have decided to end it themselves, the best known examples in recent times being Harold Shipman and Fred West.â€
    But Frances Crook, director of the Howard League for Penal Reform, is horrified at the idea.
    She said, “We would never endorse euthanasia for lifers. The very fact Mr David would suggest such a move shows the desperation that life imprisonment can cause.
    “Locking people up indefinitely, with little or no hope of release, is cruel and inhumane. The prison system should be about working with inmates so that they can return to society without fear of re-offending. In truth, it is only a very few who are so dangerous that they can never be freed.
    “Prisoners do take their own lives frequently and so far this year we have 47 confirmed self-inflicted deaths in custody. The focus must be on preventing suicides and giving lifers the hope that one day they can return to their communities as reformed citizens.â€
    It is estimated that only about 30 life-sentenced prisoners will actually serve a “whole life†tariff, with Ian Huntley and Rose West thought to be among them.
    Erwin James, now a columnist with the Guardian after his release from a life term for murder, said, “Hopelessness abounds among the lifer population. Many fail to get to the end, some commit suicide, some die of natural causes.
    “Doing life can seem like a hopeless existence, an endless journey to nowhere.†"

    I hope there is sufficient reference points to satisfy the pedantic plagiarism
    police .
  2. He's free to top himself. Does the wanker need someone to do the deed for him to prevent him dropping himself in it with the Pope, should have thought of that before he joined the Mafia.

  3. I suppose the lesson to be learned here is that execution is more humane than life imprisonment and prison staff do not like suicides on their watch . The death sentence needs to be reconsidered perhaps but without the theatricals just straight out ' drink this bastard ' finish .
  4. If you are in the pokey, ans your crime is such that you are banged up for life, you don't get choices.

    "I die a litle every day", so? Keep dying and STFU, you have no rights to request early termination.

    The death penalty is not a deterrent, getting put away for life (I mean life, for ever, until you die) and being punished during that time in jail is the deterrent.

    A twenty year old potential murderer would think twice if the punishment is the next 60 years in prison, no visits in the first 5 years, one phone call per week.

    Make jail harder, make criminals think more about the consequences.
  5. but it would work out cheaper for the taxpayer to just top them. why pay 60yrs food and accom for some murdering c**t. we are told all the time that prisons are overcrowded.
  6. I know what you are saying, but as is proven in Italy, these guys see death as an 'Easy Out', but that's not punishment.

    Don't bring back the Death Penalty (makes us as bad as the murderers) bring back the Penal Colonies, lovely little abandoned island somewhere (like Australia).
  7. or west falklands?
  8. Nah, Benny objection would be.......well......unintelligible
  9. but would work as a deterrent- and be cheap, a huge tent city style prison. hear the judge now- whats that son? not really your fault? your actually the victim of modern society... well i've got just the place for you- see you in thirty years!
  10. Interesting, after a wee bit of training and the issue of a lovely big pair of boots, we could have them down there looking for land mines.
  11. I think many people have probably said this before, but life should mean life, unless the parole board is satisfied that the prisoner is sufficiently rehabilitated for civilised society.

    The purpose of a prison has always been to protect the law-abiding citizens by locking up and stowing away the bad apples in the barrel. But these bad apples are still human beings and I agree that to lock them away without hope of release is cruel and inhumane. If there is a chance that a prisoner can reform and be accepted back into society then by all means s/he should be given that chance, but should be expected to serve a minimum number of years in prison to prove it first.

    The only reason I would consider condoning the death penalty is for high-profile cases which have been splayed across the tabloids for some time, causing public outrage and anger at the crime. If Ian Huntley was ever released from jail, there would be outcry and he would have to change his identity. He would require police protection for the rest of his life, and I do not believe that the government could realistically afford that. If the prisoner has no hope then I also believe it is a waste of money to keep him alive, therefore I would suggest a private hanging conducted in prison.
  12. The Death Penalty is a cheap option, but it's no more or less humane than life with no release.

    We are a civilised nation (honest) we do not require a Death Penalty.

    Before anyone checks my location and cries 'foul', Dubai has not had an execution in Years.
  13. but if people commit inhumane acts why should they expect to be treated any differently.
  14. Luke 6.27 to 35.

    Allah Akhbar!
  15. My heart pumps the proverbial Purple P*ss for poor lifers. I don't support the rubbish touted by prison reformers about how inhumane a life sentence is. The simple answer is that you should have thought about that before you did whatever you did.

    The life sentence should be abolished simply because it is a lie and no longer does what it says on the tin!
  16. What's Luke going to do in the 8 minutes between 6.27 and 6.35? Would that be in the morning or evening?

    To those of us no au fait with specific chapters of the Bible, please elaborate.
  17. Fair point: Luke 6.

    27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them
    which hate you,

    28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them
    which despitefully use you.

    29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the
    other; and him that taketh away thy cloak forbid not to take thy coat

    30 Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh
    away thy goods ask them not again.

    31 And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them

    32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for
    sinners also love those that love them.

    33 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have
    ye? for sinners also do even the same.

    34 And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank
    have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.

    35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for
    nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the
    children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the

    A an aside; now we are in Jointeryville, is the old Naval custom of Bible references in signals still allowed?

  18. My understanding from the evangelicals is that you should publically and privately denounce all sinners and demand that their human rights be curtailed at best, or simply erased on the grounds that their sin is a lifestyle choice. Clearly were Luke around today he would be forbidden to preach Christianity for challenging evangelical dogma. o_O

    Gott ist tot! (Nietzsche, Also sprach Zarathustra)
  19. Seaweed

    Seaweed War Hero Book Reviewer

    NB the Luke quotation is addressed at individuals; how one should behave as an individual to someone else; NOT how anyone should MAKE other people behave; and NOT in any sense talking about those who have done wrong to others. You are NOT being invited to 'forgive' murderers or abusers of OTHER PEOPLE or to abstain from defending other people, nor is it an injunction on society not to control and deter wrongdoing.

    It might be morally better to deter weak people from crime by making them stark staring terrified of going to prison a second time. It should be remembered that most crime generally bears hardest on the people at the bottom of society's ladder.

    [Equally it is not an act of charity to take someone else's money and give it away, nor to seduce people by easy handouts from organising their own lives, nor to vote for a party which does this! .. see the parable of the foolish virgins.]
  20. Well that rules out voting for ANY political party then, as they're all at it!

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